Ever Killed Someone?

[Bug Out]

Weird topic I know but I think about this alot.

I always wonder out of the thousands of patients I have been assigned how many of them demised because of something I either did, did not do, did not do fast enough, did too fast, or just simply did not assess.

For example you give the Ativan that confuses the pt, pt crawls OOB, falls, breaks hip, eventually leads to demise of pt that would have otherwise went home safe and sound. OR you fail to see the s/s of some obscure syndrome and disease which leads to late treatment and eventual demise.

On the other hand, how many lives do you think you have saved?

Honest rough assessment, how many lives do you think you have directly saved through your actions/inactions and how many do you think (or know) demised because of your action/inaction.

P.S.

Pretty sure I killed 1 person, maybe 5-10 unknowingly?

Saved hundreds indirectly, I hope. I know I saved about 15 through direct action.

[Bug Out, BSN]

This thread has spawned an interesting idea..

Do we ever really kill people or for that matter, save their lives, or only prolong/hasten death?

[ShannonRN2010, BSN, RN]

I gave IV Phenergan to a post shoulder repair, who on PCA Morphine. He said he was sick to his stomach...*shrug* I checked back on him about 15 minutes later and he was sleeping. I chatted with his wife for a few minutes and then left.

The extra RN went back in about 20 minutes later to get vitals and he was having agonal respers. We coded him. He spent 24 hours in ICU. He was allergic to the phenergan and didn't know it.

The running joke of the floor was that "Shannon killed that guy with phenergan" *cringe* even the doctors were calling me Nurse Ratchet...

[tokmom, BSN, RN]

you don't have to disclose it, but i have to ask. how do you think you killed that one person? just curious.

right now i'm working hospice while in school. i had two patients who were actively dying, that i feel my actions helped them go a little quicker. of course, death was inevitable, but i still felt a little tinge of guilt later. maybe if i had moved a little faster or didn't keep them in a certain position as long, they wouldn't have gone right then.

i work the nightshift. one patient had lung cancer and his breathing was pretty bad throughout the night. around 7 am, i gave him a bed bath. once i was finished, he had the "death rattle" and was really struggling to breathe. i gave him his ordered morphine and ativan, and positioned him with his head up, to make him a little more comfortable. i left at 8 am, and he ended up dying 40 minutes later.

another patient was actually doing pretty well. i was at the home with a cna, who was caring for my patient's husband. around midnight, the lights started flickering. this happened before with another patient, who ended up dying the next day. so i jokingly said to the cna, that the lights flickering (which occurred three times in a row) was a sign that death was near for my patient.

about an hour later, she needed to have a diaper change, so i started cleaning her up. she was a large woman, and i had the head of the bed low for quite some time. and i also had to turn her several times, back and forth, to get everything just right. when i was finished, her breathing was very labored and she died about 10 minutes later.

do i feel i actually killed these patients? no. they were already dying. but i did feel my actions sped it up a little, even though i was just doing my job.

been in your shoes. i look at it this way. yeah, maybe all that turning and having the hob down wasn't the ideal situation, but they passed with dignity. they didn't die with poopy pants, or a gunky mouth, or all sweaty.

[BellaInBlueScrubsRN]

When I was a CNA I was assigned to sit with a confused patient for about 4 hours. His wife was in the room, and after about a half an hour, she left. She said he had been sleeping. So I just sat in the room. Technically my job was to make sure that he didn't get out of bed and fall, reorient him if he got confused. You know. I'm not sure what the admitting dx was now. I was NOT the RN, therefore I didn't do an assessment or wake him up. Summed up, I can back the next day and saw his wife. Turns out the guy had a huge brain bleed with midline shift. So totally unknown, while I thought this guy was sleeping, he was actually having a brain hemorrhage that would ultimately kill him. Almost started crying while his wife was hugging me saying thank you for being with him.

Should I have woken him up to say I was there? Would I have caught it before it got so bad? I was just a student assigned to sit with him! Thats my story

[roser13, ASN, RN]

Please quit picking on bug out... seriously guys, if you don't like the idea of the thread or the wording or whatever then don't post. This is lateral violence.

Are you serious?? Lateral violence?!!:lol2:

Give me a freakin' break. If you don't want people to comment/disagree with/question things that you say, then don't post your thoughts on an internet forum.

[EbonyBorn2Succeed]

This is a good topic. Very deep. Lol @ nurse hatchet

[scoochy]

I gave IV Phenergan to a post shoulder repair, who on PCA Morphine. He said he was sick to his stomach...*shrug* I checked back on him about 15 minutes later and he was sleeping. I chatted with his wife for a few minutes and then left.

The extra RN went back in about 20 minutes later to get vitals and he was having agonal respers. We coded him. He spent 24 hours in ICU. He was allergic to the phenergan and didn't know it.

The running joke of the floor was that "Shannon killed that guy with phenergan" *cringe* even the doctors were calling me Nurse Ratchet...

Not related to topic, but...an allergy to Phenergan, Compazine, and other phenothiazines is NOT pretty. I was given Phenergan for narcotic potentiation after undergoing facial reconstructive surgery. I had been extubated for approx. 1 hour; my pain was excruciating. The drug of choice for pain relief (way back when) was Demerol. Demerol was given, followed by IM Phenergan, which I had never received before. Had a dystonic reaction, and ended up re-intubated (that was a tough feat, d/t the nature of my surgery).

I am now overly cautious when I give a first dose of a phenothiazine, especially to those on anti-depressants, anticholinergics, or anti-parkinsonian drugs....

[GitanoRN, BSN, MSN, RN]

Enlightening, to say the least!

[CathyLew]

I don't think I ever Demised anyone.....but I'm pretty sure I lateral violenced quite a few

[Bug Out, BSN]

I have never assigned myself that level of responsibility on the cosmic level.

I think most all floor Nurses must admit that our actions directly or indirectly effect the ultimate outcome of our patient's condition.

Do you not think that you have had a life or death impact upon a patient or just not care to think about it?

[jjmath215]

I am with you and have often thought about this question. The other nurses that don't like you asking this question have probably killed someone themselves....The reality is that we do have lives in our hands and it is a possiblety for us to indirectly harm someone. I would like to believe I have always done what is best for my patient with my knowledge and skill! Thanks for the question!

[Ruas61, BSN, RN]

i think most all floor nurses must admit that our actions directly or indirectly effect the ultimate outcome of our patient's condition.

do you not think that you have had a life or death impact upon a patient or just not care to think about it?

i would imagine most of us have looked at the premise.

however, i would think that most people do not present it as an "ever kill someone" topic in general conversations or on boards.

i get that maybe this is your way of dealing with the topic in a macabre/sarcastic/down to earth or whatever way you want to call this line of discussion but frankly it is just a bit too demeaning to everyone.

yes, i am sure i have played a part in the cycle both as a nurse and as a regular human being.

do i sit around and ponder it much?

no, not unless there is extenuating circumstances.