I always wonder out of the thousands of patients I have been assigned how many of them demised because of something I either did, did not do, did not do fast enough, did too fast, or just simply did not assess.
For example you give the Ativan that confuses the pt, pt crawls OOB, falls, breaks hip, eventually leads to demise of pt that would have otherwise went home safe and sound. OR you fail to see the s/s of some obscure syndrome and disease which leads to late treatment and eventual demise.
On the other hand, how many lives do you think you have saved?
Honest rough assessment, how many lives do you think you have directly saved through your actions/inactions and how many do you think (or know) demised because of your action/inaction.
P.S.
Pretty sure I killed 1 person, maybe 5-10 unknowingly?
Saved hundreds indirectly, I hope. I know I saved about 15 through direct action.
Ever killed someone? Yeah, I did. I shot a man in Reno just to watch him die.
Now, to be serious. I was worried that I would bring about the death of one patient I took care of. He was an end-stage COPDer who only a day ago came up from the ICU. He had lots of trouble breathing with exertion, such as when I was giving him a bath and when I would move him to the chair.
i am sure i've been part of some of the situations you've described, but honestly, if i gave myself THAT much accountability over the long term of a patient then i'd probably be cliniclly depressed. Sure, as nurses we are supposed to be the eyes and ears. We're supposed to catch changes in vital signs early and try to determine when it could be serious and were supposed to ensure that the patients are safe, but we can only do our best.
We've all had the confused LOL that you figure must be related to Houdini as rails and all normal methods for keeping her in bed fail (and forget the posey vest... she slips right out). Don't carry the eight of the world on your shoulders. Do the best you can everyday and don't dwell on things like how many patients you may have given that push to the other side - it cam only bring you down.
i would imagine most of us have looked at the premise.
however, i would think that most people do not present it as an "ever kill someone" topic in general conversations or on boards.
does this line of conversation make you uncomfortable? i would imagine most people do not openly discuss matters like these, esp if they feel as though they may have negatively impacted someone's life.
i get that maybe this is your way of dealing with the topic in a macabre/sarcastic/down to earth or whatever way you want to call this line of discussion but frankly it is just a bit too demeaning to everyone.
who does it demean? why do you think it is demeaning to discuss this topic, or is it just my choice of words? was kill a poor word to choose? should i have choosen "ended a life" or "cause the expiration of life" or some other phrase?
...i thought my thread title was good...short, sweet, and to the point. sheesh.
yes, i am sure i have played a part in the cycle both as a nurse and as a regular human being.
do i sit around and ponder it much?
no, not unless there is extenuating circumstances.
if you do not wish to ponder your impact, for the better or worse, upon your patients then stop reading the thread. i thought the title was a fair warning of the subject matter lol. can't win with you. :chair:
Specializes in ICU, School Nurse, Med/Surg, Psych.
6 months out of school I was part of the team that coded a client - trach balloon not inflated, sats in the crapper, poor outcome due to multiple error (one of which the nurse practitioner who was supposed to be running the code walked out). The client died 2 days later never having regained consciousness. I learned a lot in those 36 minutes and through the BON investigation that followed.
6 months out of school I was part of the team that coded a client - trach balloon not inflated, sats in the crapper, poor outcome due to multiple error (one of which the nurse practitioner who was supposed to be running the code walked out). The client died 2 days later never having regained consciousness. I learned a lot in those 36 minutes and through the BON investigation that followed.
How many lives do you think you have saved?
NP running a code...interesting, most of the NPs I am familiar with are very skiddish for some reason.
i can understand both points of view-a group of you feels it's not right to discuss this and the others feel it's a pretty important question. I just think there are many types of nurses-some good, some not so good. so many of us can relate to going to hospital or doctor's and running into a very cold non-compassionate nurse-sad but true. I feel like the question is a little off the norm-for some of you maybe even a little wacky in a weird way. You know how ppl say the wacko Dr.s, well they same the same about nurses also.
I think most of us feel like the question puts down life-you know life is precious but to nurses that see ppl die all the time-hmmm it's looked at very differently. Now of course you probably couldn't say this to a group of average ppl(not nurses/dr.s that is)because sure ppl will get offended.
We live in a sick world! with sick Dr.s and sick nurses that do unthinkable things, so i wouldn't take the criticism your getting about the post too serious :) For some might be thinking hmmmm is this a weird one??
i can understand both points of view-a group of you feels it's not right to discuss this and the others feel it's a pretty important question. I just think there are many types of nurses-some good, some not so good. so many of us can relate to going to hospital or doctor's and running into a very cold non-compassionate nurse-sad but true. I feel like the question is a little off the norm-for some of you maybe even a little wacky in a weird way. You know how ppl say the wacko Dr.s, well they same the same about nurses also.
I think most of us feel like the question puts down life-you know life is precious but to nurses that see ppl die all the time-hmmm it's looked at very differently. Now of course you probably couldn't say this to a group of average ppl(not nurses/dr.s that is)because sure ppl will get offended.
We live in a sick world! with sick Dr.s and sick nurses that do unthinkable things, so i wouldn't take the criticism your getting about the post too serious :) For some might be thinking hmmmm is this a weird one??
Thank you, I can understand that.
I just want to clarify that I am in no way attempting to put down life but on the otherhand I do not take death personally. I assumed we all saw life and death enough to be completely comfortable with the subject, maybe not.
I will admit again that this is a weird subject that is not normally openly discussed but I do not think anyone can deny that they have reflected upon the question at one point or another.
Specializes in Psychiatric, Detox/Rehab, Geriatrics.
You can't control what people are going to say, just ignore the ones that feel the need to talk down to people. They have the right to voice their opinion, and we have the right to ignore it.
Does this line of conversation make you uncomfortable? I would imagine most people do not openly discuss matters like these, esp if they feel as though they may have negatively impacted someone's life.
Who does it demean? Why do you think it is demeaning to discuss this topic, or is it just my choice of words? Was kill a poor word to choose? Should I have choosen "ended a life" or "cause the expiration of life" or some other phrase?
...I thought my thread title was good...short, sweet, and to the point. sheesh.
If you do not wish to ponder your impact, for the better or worse, upon your patients then stop reading the thread. I thought the title was a fair warning of the subject matter lol. Can't win with you. :chair:
I don't know you from zip. You don't know me from zip.
I find your taste of words for the topic of the title demeaning for nurses, for humans, for our profession.
This isn't a bar and we're not sitting around having a brew and discussing war stories.
As for my pondersings on the subject, that is private and who I choose to share them with is my business.
This feels like going for some shock value, so have at it. It turns me off.
This could have been an excellent subject if it had been presented with more respect.
i agree nurses should not be too uncomfortable with this subject-not at all! if they are then hmmm i would say they are in the wrong field-this cup of tea is not for everyone, lol.
i just think for the patient or patient's family it's pretty cold, but you're not addressing either, so i think it's fine.
you were straight to the point, what is that word??? hmmm there is in the english grammar called something that ppl use all the time, you know instead of die they say oh "passed away, going home, in a better place now", oh it's going to bug me now. anyways for nurse this is reality and life.
i do agree with the member who mentioned that probably some of the nurses who got a little offended probably have killed someone in one way or another.
My God ppl say nurses don't get paid enough for what they do! I believe that! Nurses have a heavy responsibility-this is somebody's mother, father, brother, sister, grandmother, good friend, son, daughter we're caring for-Nurse's deserve so much more!!!:redbeathe:redbeathe
To all you nurses out there your are great!! and fantastic, without YOU what a patient do?????
For example you give the Ativan that confuses the pt, pt crawls OOB, falls, breaks hip, eventually leads to demise of pt that would have otherwise went home safe and sound. OR you fail to see the s/s of some obscure syndrome and disease which leads to late treatment and eventual demise.
Neither of those count as the nurse killing the patient, in my opinion. The former is just an unfortunate accident... The latter is the physician's responsibility... nurses don't diagnose diseases, physicians do.
What would constitute "killing my patient" would be, for example, ignoring deteriorating vital signs and not notifying the physician or administering a medication to a patient with a known allergy to same. I would hope that the vast majority of nurses are able to state, "none."
~Mi Vida Loca~RN, ASN, RN
5,259 Posts
No, but I sure have thought about it!