The choice to not take the COVID vaccine I feel is not defendable. The facts are that 99% of hospitalizations/deaths due to COVID are unvaccinated patients currently. This has caused a more severe strain on a already extremely stressed hospital staff, shortage of equipment and services, injury and death from other causes due to delay of care and suffering of everyone involved in the hospitalized COVID patient among other issues. Virologists report delta and other strains are accelerated and created due to the numbers of unvaccinated people in the US. The fact that vaccination rates have only increased about 20% since July with the information available is appalling, while there are 130k new infections daily in the US. This should not be a personal or individual choice and appears due to unfounded anxiety, medical or religious exception and or politics.
Specializes in Nurse Leader specializing in Labor & Delivery.
3 hours ago, capitalsfan83 said:
Little sheep keep repeating and regurgitating what you hear on CNN. "Unvaccinated are indefensible"?
What about those with previous infection who have natural immunity?
More recent studies are finding that "hybrid immunity" is even better, and recommends that people who have been infected should still get the vaccine. (links to multiple studies within the article)
If both side of the political spectrum had allowed the Virologist/Public Health Experts and the like to take the lead on getting the facts out about Covid, treatment, vaccines etc I don't think we would be having quite the issue/push back we are facing now. The division/anger/fear surrounding this issue is worse than it ever was when HIV/AIDS was new on the scene decades ago with people freaking out over something they from their mothers second cousin once removed about how it could be spread or cured.
This disease has been use as a weapon for personal/professional/political gain by so many it's mindboggling. All to the determent of public health, wellness and safety.
People get scared, it is the uncertainties, the what ifs. People get nervous when others try to force new things on them. They do expect a vaccine to be 100% effective and a prevention measure, and when it is not..they are suspicious? Government or science TRUST ISSUES FOR SURE.
? I'm not worried.
Tell you what the vaccine won't give you, Common Sense or intelligence!
Maybe, it is best you refrain from taking the vaccine ,in case of an allergic reaction, like doing the right thing for once!
Specializes in Treatment-resistant Clinical Depression.
1 hour ago, klone said:
More recent studies are finding that "hybrid immunity" is even better, and recommends that people who have been infected should still get the vaccine. (links to multiple studies within the article)
In exchange for a very slightly diminished risk of hospitalization (almost entirely reserved to diabetics, the obese, and teh elderly), the naturally immune are expected to take on 100% of the risk of brand new mRNA vaccine technology. It seems safe. But is it? We're less than half a year out here and we already know of thrombocytopenia, Myocarditis, and Pericarditis as well as more rare side effects. Are they the only ones? It's irresponsible to claim to be certain there aren't.
The cavalier attitude of the "vaccinate everybody regardless of data!" crowd is a big part of the problem.
Worse, when naturally immune people are counted as "unvaccinated", their staying clear of the hospital as reliably as they do makes being unvaccinated appear to be much much safer than it actually is! It encourages the unvaxxed in their faulty risk assessments.
If you're unvaccinated, you're ten times likelier to need an ICU rescue. That's teh data we've heard. But if you're unvaccinated AND never had COVID? Well....I don't KNOW how risky that is because this critical data is not being provided to the public in that useful, worthwhile format because admitting natural immunity is better than vaccination suggests Pfizer will lose two payments for every immune person. Can't have that. Campaign donors gotta be PAID!
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
1 hour ago, imppress said:
The benefit is minor.
Prove it.
1 hour ago, imppress said:
We're less than half a year out here and we already know of thrombocytopenia, Myocarditis, and Pericarditis as well as more rare side effects. Are they the only ones? It's irresponsible to claim to be certain there aren't.
We know that the incidence of those listed events is higher following infection from the virus than following vaccination against the virus.
1 hour ago, imppress said:
The cavalier attitude of the "vaccinate everybody regardless of data!" crowd is a big part of the problem.
So that's why hospitals across the country are full and overflowing? Isn't "the problem" really a pandemic that is making unvaccinated people deathly sick?
1 hour ago, imppress said:
If you're unvaccinated, you're ten times likelier to need an ICU rescue. That's teh data we've heard. But if you're unvaccinated AND never had COVID? Well....I don't KNOW how risky that is because this critical data is not being provided to the public in that useful, worthwhile format because admitting natural immunity is better than vaccination suggests Pfizer will lose two payments for every immune person.
Is this a problem of you not knowing where to get credible information or is this a problem of you having a "feeling" and that feeling makes it difficult for you to accept any of the data and public health recommendations?
Little sheep keep repeating and regurgitating what you hear on CNN. "Unvaccinated are indefensible
Study out of Israel: "This study demonstrated that natural immunity confers longer lasting and stronger protection against infection, symptomatic disease
How about asking the unvaccinated dead people how their immunity is doing. I don’t know why we bother if those of you have not vaccinated yet and are willing to lose your jobs, put others at risk, and stress your families there is nothing more to say.
Specializes in Pediatrics, Community Health, School Health.
On 9/7/2021 at 2:15 AM, MunoRN said:
she told another nurse that Fauci, the Clintons, and Epstein were are part of "the Lizard People" who have been living amongst us. Covid and the vaccines were all part of their plan to manipulate and control the human population. And that we'd all be finding out about the Lizard People on Wednesday.
Am I the only one horrified that this person is a medical professional and people entrust her with their lives???
I am a nurse and I am experiencing intermittent numbness and neurological symptoms on the left side of my body since receiving the first Moderna vaccination 2.5 weeks ago. I also am now experiencing occasional, almost unbearable joint pain and I am afraid. I had a recent check up before being vaccinated and I am healthy.
I took the vaccine out of fear, fear of suffocating to death with covid. I took the vaccine even though I wasn’t convinced of it’s efficacy or safety. I hope these symptoms go away.
Guillain-Barré syndrome (GBS) is a side effect of the vaccination. Hopefully you don't have that and your symptoms subside. Call on God, but row away from the rocks.
"Vaccination was highly effective with overall estimated efficacy for documented infection of 92·8% (CI:[92·6, 93·0]); hospitalization 94·2% (CI:[93·6, 94·7]); severe illness 94·4% (CI:[93·6, 95·0]); and death 93·7% (CI:[92·5, 94·7]).
prior SARS-CoV-2 infection for documented infection is 94·8% (CI:[94·4, 95·1]); hospitalization 94·1% (CI:[91·9, 95·7]); and severe illness 96·4% (CI:[92·5, 98·3]).
Our results question the need to vaccinate previously-infected individuals."
Not my words. The Health Ministry of (85% vaccinated) Israel.
94% risk reduction of severe illness for vaccination.
96% for natural immunity.
If vaccination provided PERFECT protection, you get a 4% boost.
Best case scenario. For that scrap, you get every potential risk of teh vaccine.
That's my proof. What's yours?
55 minutes ago, toomuchbaloney said:
1 hour ago, imppress said:
We're less than half a year out here and we already know of thrombocytopenia, Myocarditis, and Pericarditis as well as more rare side effects. Are they the only ones? It's irresponsible to claim to be certain there aren't.
We know that the incidence of those listed events is higher following infection from the virus than following vaccination against the virus.
Agreed. Never disputed that. But once you've had COVID anyway, what's the point of taking on the known and unknown risks of the vaccine? I agree with the obvious: avoiding vaccination so as to get naturally immune is more risky. But if you're immune (say...pre-January 2021), the case isn't nearly so cut and dry.
The cavalier attitude of the "vaccinate everybody regardless of data!" crowd is a big part of the problem.
So that's why hospitals across the country are full and overflowing? Isn't "the problem" really a pandemic that is making unvaccinated people deathly sick?
The partial reporting of medical data sows distrust. That makes unvaccinated people less likely to get vaccinated which lets the pandemic affect more people and fills teh ICUs. When natural immunity means Pfizer sells fewer shots, that needs to be shared even if it costs commercial sponsors money. But that info is not being shared. It undermines credibility and has teh appearance of commercial interests taking priority over public health. Then conspiracy theorists can float their ideas as just more of teh same servitude to capital interests. When the Health Ministry of Israel supports a few talking points of the loons, it lends them undeserved credibility.
You don't think that serves the public poorly? Shouldn't all factual information be shared?
If you're unvaccinated, you're ten times likelier to need an ICU rescue. That's the data we've heard. But if you're unvaccinated AND never had COVID? Well....I don't KNOW how risky that is because this critical data is not being provided to the public in that useful, worthwhile format because admitting natural immunity is better than vaccination suggests Pfizer will lose two payments for every immune person.
Is this a problem of you not knowing where to get credible information or is this a problem of you having a "feeling" and that feeling makes it difficult for you to accept any of the data and public health recommendations?
I get my info from CDC cited pre-print medical article servers. The only potentially reputable source of info that isn't three months old.
"Feelings" are what's behind the dismissal of both the dismissal and excessive fear of mRNA vaccine risks. Ignoring CDC cited data about teh superiority of natural immunity damages the health authorities we should be able to count on, but can't. Instead I need to look to the NHS and Israel Ministry of Health.
Irrational fear is indeed behind most opposition to mandatory vaccination policy, but not all of it. If natural immunity would be acknowledged, then your dismissive attitude might have merit.
Instead, you look like the emotional one. I cite data. You take a snarky tone of voice as if that refutes the proof. No. It just proves my point further. Failure to acknowledge the minor facets of truth that don't support universal vaccination undermines the overall wisdom of vaccines themselves, which we agree upon.
"Vaccination was highly effective with overall estimated efficacy for documented infection of 92·8% (CI:[92·6, 93·0]); hospitalization 94·2% (CI:[93·6, 94·7]); severe illness 94·4% (CI:[93·6, 95·0]); and death 93·7% (CI:[92·5, 94·7]).
prior SARS-CoV-2 infection for documented infection is 94·8% (CI:[94·4, 95·1]); hospitalization 94·1% (CI:[91·9, 95·7]); and severe illness 96·4% (CI:[92·5, 98·3]).
Our results question the need to vaccinate previously-infected individuals."
Not my words. The Health Ministry of (85% vaccinated) Israel.
94% risk reduction of severe illness for vaccination.
96% for natural immunity.
If vaccination provided PERFECT protection, you get a 4% boost.
Best case scenario. For that scrap, you get every potential risk of teh vaccine.
That's my proof. What's yours?
That's your interpretation. The expert analysis recommends vaccination after infection.
klone, MSN, RN
14,857 Posts
More recent studies are finding that "hybrid immunity" is even better, and recommends that people who have been infected should still get the vaccine. (links to multiple studies within the article)
https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2021/09/07/1033677208/new-studies-find-evidence-of-superhuman-immunity-to-covid-19-in-some-individuals