Can an employer penalize you for calling-in due to illness?

[Atheos]

Yes, it is legal.

Technically, this is legal. Now, if they give you 'sick hours' you should be able to take them without punishment.

Other than that they can punish you for missing work.

Employees basically have a contract with employers. That contract states you will work a certain amount of time and they will pay you a certain amoutn and give you certain benefits. You doing anyhting beyond that is like a breach of contract.

You agreed to be at work. Now, of course we all get sick, it just seems that in nursing people get a lot more latitude than in other industries.

I understand a parent has to be off to care for their child. It's a hard thing I imagine. But the child is the parent's responsibility. Not the jobs.

[Blee O'Myacin, BSN, RN]

Make sure you give your manager a doctor's note. What does the verbal warning mean? Did you have to sign anything? Do you think you will have to sign something next time? If so, and you are a union hospital, call your union rep and make sure he or she is present with you at that meeting.

Personally, I think that four call outs in a year is not excessive.

[Atheos]

Currently in most states (there are a few exceptions) there is no law gaurunteeing Sick Time.

Many court cases have declared that Sick time is purely voluntary on the part of the employer and offering sick time (which is really only sick PAY) in no way obligates them to allow you time off for illness. The only law (other than the few exceptions) is FMLA.

Even if you NEVER called off in 30 years and then called in sick one time they could write you up.

I noticed that you said that there were attendance problems. The normal way of dealing with attendance problems is to start ruling with an iron fist. If employees can't manage the responsibility on their own then management has to do it. When management does it they usually do it with a heavy fist.

[ohmeowzer RN, RN]

At the hospital where I work after so long the absences drop off. I think it's 1 every 3 months, I called off 2 weeks ago for one shift because my cat passed away. I can't remember when I called off before that.. My manager just said " if you call off more than so many times a year it will affect your raise.

We have a lot of nurses lately call off for cramps (not that it's not valid)... We had 2 on one shift do it a week ago... Some do it all the time... we don't have a union, but I think it depends on the nurse manager. I know I've called off more than 3 times this year. My manager will tell us "don't call off until this date or it will show in HR" so we hang on until that day and we can call off...

My manager is wonderful and I love her. She is for her nurses. We all need a mental health day once in awhile.. We are also human and we get sick and so do our children .. We also get cramps ( for those of us with the curse), and it happens ...

Keep me posted on what they say to you when you go back to work. Your child is sick, that's where you need to be.

[soulofme]

When there is a husband present...or not...why don't they take time off? It seems always the woman's position to do so...it was a 50/50 reproduction thing!

[Princess_M83]

My parents always took turns calling in and I am sure that is what my husband and I do when the need arises. Regardless of who makes more it is unfair for the mother to always have to call in and jeopardize her job to take care of children. It is a shared job not soley her responsibility. I love it when I hear women I am in school with say "my husband helps out with the kids and housecleaning and stuff"..... Well he lives there and they are his children aren't they, shouldn't he? He is not helping, he is performing his husbandly duties.

[racing-mom4, BSN, RN]

In my household when a kid is sick they want thier mom. Moms/dads--Husbands/wifes are different. We are each better equipt to manage different things.

Yes when my husband makes dinner I do look at it like he is helping me, as dinner is typically my job (I am better at it--ask my kids) when I sweep out the garage or take out the trash then I am helping him, as those are typically his job.

My kid can puke in my hair and I will pat thier back and tell them they are OK. Same kid can puke in a bucket 30 feet a way and Hubby will go racing to the bathroom gagging himself.

[CT Pixie, BSN, RN]

When there is a husband present...or not...why don't they take time off? It seems always the woman's position to do so...it was a 50/50 reproduction thing!

A few things:

How many children really want Daddy being the one to tend to them when they are sick? I know, no matter how close to the dad the child is, when it comes to being sick, most kids want Mom. My daughters are as thick as thieves and close with with their dad as you can get and they still want me when they are sick. Something about Mommy makes you feel better when you aren't feeling well. And as a mother, no one can take care of my children when they are sick like I can, even their father, in my opinion. And I think most Mom's would agree, if dad is home with the sick child, your mind isn't at work, its wondering is he giving them plenty of fluids, is he monitoring their temp, did he give the medicine and in the right dose at the right time and on and on..

As the other poster said, most times dad makes a lot more money than mom, and with mom being a nurse, in most cases jobs are a plenty and much easier found and secured than the dad having to find a new job due to being absent from work with a sick child. Its not a fair thing to say, well you make less so you can risk being fired but in todays world, $$ talks. I would rather be without MY pay for a time while looking for a new job than go without my hubbys pay...hands down..any day.

Yes, ideally, it should be a 50/50 thing but its not always do-able when it comes to being the one to stay home.

My family is lucky. My hubby runs our business and can take time off as needed. So thats the reason for him being the one home with them. But there are times when he has something that cannot be put off and he has to go to work, so I am the one who will stay home. When I was in school, hubby was the one to stay home, pick them up from school if they were sick, etc. The school knew to call me as the last resort.

Each family unit is an individual, what some believe should work for yours because it works for them doesn't always float.

[rnkris525]

I'm confused. Some people have said that they can write you up for using sick days. ???? If the company gives you 10 sick days a year (or whatever the #), why are you penalized for using them???? That makes no sense. Everyone gets sick, and why give employees sick days if you get in trouble for using them? Isn't that what they are for?? 3 or 4 sick days in a year is not at all excessive! That is ridiculous IMO.

[caliotter3]

At one former place of employment, the absenteeism was rampant when we had the DON and administrator leave almost simultaneously. The new administrator addressed the problem by instructing the nurses to have the call-in call her at home. The worst offender was given a suspension. This backfired when they had to call the suspended person to come to work. By word of mouth, people just learned to stay away from getting work there due to the bad conditions.

In your case, three justified absences is not enough to warrant adverse action. I see however, that by calling everyone in and giving them warnings to sign, the employer is getting a collateral benefit. The absenteeism problem will most likely improve. But regardless, the employer now has a write-up on everybody that can be used against the employee in the future, when they want to get rid of someone and want to have a strong file against them.

[RNKPCE]

First off if you work full time, 3 absences in a year does not seem excessive. Because our job is physical and we take care of sick people there are times we can't come in but a person with a desk job and a dedicated phone could. Examples would be a sprained ankle or a hacking cough. I hate using the phone after some one who has a cold. The industry would seem to need to allow more sick time because of the nature of the job. But also a cold can linger for a week or more, you can't be out that long for a cold.

In every job there are people who abuse sick time and it makes it harder for all of us. My hospital just re did there absentee policy. It states you get a certain amount of absences depending on your work status. Also if you are out 4 consecutive days with the flu that is one absence. If you have a flu out for 2 days then feel better go back for one and relapse and have to call in sick again that would be 2 absences or occurrences. I think it makes sense but then you have to really decide if you are well enough to go back. Also they put language in the absentee policy regarding patterns, staff who always call in sick on Mondays or Fridays to get a long weekend, or who have a few days off before and after a sick call to get a long stretch off, or people who call in sick on a day they requested off but didn't get scheduled off. They also have language that says manager has discretion. A staff member battling cancer is going to be allowed a lot more leeway than some one with multiple isolated absences not related to major illness.

Now staying home to take care of kids is a different matter. I had a co-worker upset because it counted as a sick day when she had to call in and take her kid to the ER. What should it count as? The hospital is a business. It also isn't fair to people who don't have kids. I worked when my kids were young. Fortunately I worked swing shift and if the kids were mildly sick my mother would watch them til my husband got home from work or my husband would come home early. I agree that most kids want their moms when they are sick. I had a co worker once whose husband was a pediatrician and her kids were calling her at work asking when they could take more Tylenol :) There was only one time my kid was so sick that I felt I needed to be home over my husband. She had severe strep that didn't test positive on the quick test so she kept getting worse at home and had severe throat swelling ended up on steroids.

[Vito Andolini]

If you are not on FMLA already, you might want to try to get on it. Google it, talk to your doctor or your child's doctor and see if they can come up with some reason for you to be able to get on FMLA.

If you can't get on it (and please don't falsify anything to get it; that would be awful if you got caught and not worth lying), then consider getting a new job. Your boss sounds like a heartless jerk who doesn't care or understand that a person with kids will likely have some times (and 4 in a year isn't half bad if you ask me) when those children have needs that will take priority over the job.

You might want to try calling off not for sickness but for a personal situation that you need to take care of. Do not be bullied into saying what it is. It is none of their business to know your personal or family life. You have vacation days and holidays saved up, probably, and should be able, I would think, to use them on occasion when you need them for such personal or family situations.

Or say you'll take a day or a few hours without pay but that you need some time to handle an unexpected situation.

I know that a boss' job is to run the job site and that it is hard to do when people call off. But the reality of life is that things come up. You might want to gently remind your boss of all the times you have worked extra hours, extra shifts, missed lunch breaks (donated them to the job unless you got paid for them) and bathroom breaks, came in early, stayed late, floated without complaint, took extra patients, helped with special projects, whatever. Remind her that you are a very good employee and that you wish she would balance that with the times you have needed to call off. Let her know that it hurts to know that you are only as good as your last time you didn't call off.

Maybe the best way to handle it is to say nothing. Is she really going to impose the discipline you mentioned? Suspension, loss of bonus, etc? Will she really fire you? How much do you want this job? What is she doing to others who have worse call-off histories than you? Or are you the worst offender? I think maybe you should consider not sign any more write-up's. Of course, that will be declaring war. I wish you well.