SORRY - i have to rant about this. I don't want to start a fight- and I'm not going to generalize about all BSN or ADN programs. They have to be evaluated individually on their own merits but....... The constant arguement over ADN vs BSN is driving me crazy!!!! People act like I've really got a choice- like I can just walk out and "get" either one. ya right.
I am a 36yo pre-nursing student at a CC (in greater OKC metro). I have a previous BS in a science. I still have pre-reqs to do and support course to finish just to be competitive. & believe me- competition is HIGH- even for the lowly ADN Last semester there were 300 applicants for 50 spots. I have loved all my instructors, been impressed with the level of instruction, and feel prepared.
I have never seen an ad for a job that said "ADN need not apply"- all they ask for is the RN current license- yes, I understand that the BSN may be needed to go into higher mangement etc.
NOW, why I'm not doing the BSN. Here in OKC we have a few BSN programs at state & private universities, and even a few BS to BSN accelerated. The tuition ranges from $20,000 to over $50,000. Having loans from a previous degree & a husband that makes a good salary- I don't qualify for financial aid. SO....if anyone expects me to get that degree- hand over the $$$$$$, please. Also, the BSN programs don't accept many students- the smaller universities have only 20-50/ year and the larger major university accepts around 120/year. &That particular program had over 700 applicants last year!!!! YA I can just walk in and "get" my BSN- hahahahah
BTW- compare NCLEX pass rates
major university- 83% my CC - 87%
university#2 - 57% cc#2 - 87%
university #3 - 50% cc#3 - 82%
now, tell me- would I really want to go to a program that only 50% passed?? what good is a BSN if I can't pass boards? I realize there are many factors to it, but come on....50%!
Let me give you an eye opening fact---if OKC (local metro areas) went to "all BSN" this year and did away with ADN--they would lose 248 new nurses! (that's how many passed boards from 3 major ccs last year) WOW- you think we're short on nurses now- try cutting out all those new grads.
I'm just frustrated with the whole discussion. Like I've said, people act like all of us have EVERY option available, or that we can afford it, or that these programs are just waiting for me to come and "get" my degree.
At least around here- all the ADN/ASD are very professional, highly technical, and very competitive. There are no "waiting lists". You have to apply every semester, meet basic requirements, then compete with GPA, preference points, etc. NONE of them simply put you on a list for meeting the requirements.
It may be different in your neck of the woods, but that how it sits here.
Everyone has to make their own choice, evaluate their own needs and the programs available. I'm done- I feel better - thanks for listening:rolleyes:
In the end, we will all be nurses!! Some of us with an ADN, others with BSN.
I do plan on hopefully moving towards my BSN eventually, but I have a FT job, a husband, a daughter, a house, a dog (the list goes on and on). Right now, the ADN program will do it for me.
At this last place I worked, I was told by the Education Coordinator of this facility that they should do away with all LPNs and ADNs. Why? Well, because as a nurse you should try to attain the highest level of learning that you can. I told her that I have heard valid arguments for both sides of the coin and that I respectfully did not agree with her. I am an ADN, and some of the best nurses I know are LPNs. It's arrogant to think that only BSN nurses should be doing bedside care. Just my take on the issue.
good to hear from everyone- glad I didn't start something ugly :)
I know some are opposed to loans- believe me I wish had been a little more careful the first time around cuz hubby and I still owe a bunch- he has a MS though so it's worth it. I think done responsibly, loans are worth it.
Just a note- some of the hospitals here offer grants for the BSN..BUT you have to be able to work at least 30 hours/ week for them while in school and then sign a 2 or 3 year contract after graduating. I wouldn't mind the job contract but having 2 little kiddos and other obligations, I can't put in that many work hours and full time school. That's another reason I'm at the CC. After these support courses are done...the nursing classes will be part-time. I'm hoping to get in for fall 06.
good luck everyone!
Hi:lol2:
I live in okc and was wondering what cc here offers nursing and how long it takes if u go full time? How hard was it to get and how many spots they have open each semester? I will be starting fresh with no college so I was wondering how hard will that make it to get in?
At this last place I worked, I was told by the Education Coordinator of this facility that they should do away with all LPNs and ADNs. Why? Well, because as a nurse you should try to attain the highest level of learning that you can. I told her that I have heard valid arguments for both sides of the coin and that I respectfully did not agree with her. I am an ADN, and some of the best nurses I know are LPNs. It's arrogant to think that only BSN nurses should be doing bedside care. Just my take on the issue.
Pam
I have to agree with you. We are ALL apart of a team and i think it is arrogent to say that BSNs are the only type of nurses there should be. There are GREAT knowlegable LPNs who are great at what they do.
hey there...I am hopefully getting my bsn--applying to both adn and bsn and see where I end up--but I just wanted to insert something about pass rates.
A friend suggested that BSN pass rates are lower because the information you learn is spread out over a longer period of time, thus info from three years ago isnt as fresh as if it were two years ago. That makes some sense to me.
I think that people who get BSNs off the bat are those who are chasing after their masters (like myself) or are just looking for more options. I know I will love bedside nursing and will be very happy for many many years but I want to provide options for myself so that I am not 40-50 still running around crazily like Im 20.
I think the ADN is perfect for many people. When my mom graduated her ADN program there were so many young people and single moms and divorcees etc. It is so nice to see a somewhat affordable program that can bring a good income to people who would face difficulties elsewhere.
I've applied to an ADN private program here in NYC. I already have a B.S and an A.A in other majors, hence this will be my 3rd degree i am working on. I originally wanted to go to an Accelerated BSN program, but after going to the open house of the program I wanted I was so discouraged I thought going back to school wouldn't be possible for me. I also investigated the CUNY systems ADN program and they were next to impossible as well. SO after much research I figured that the program that I have currently applied to and am taking the NLN PAX for would be the best route for me. Why? Because I will be able to work, pay my bills and still be able to do this program over 2 yrs, at a school that boasts an NCLEX passrate at 94% and offer clinicals two weeks into the program, which personally is something that is important to me and my learning. Plus they have been around since 1904. It will be a tough committment but one i am willing to take on.
Now I currently work as an admistrative assistant in a chemo unit and I work primarily with nurses, I work with ASN's and BSN's and one level of skill is no different from the other. Infact, unless you ask them you would never know what their degree level is and they are all excellent nurses to whom i have the utmost respect for, and one of the reasons i decided to persue nursing. In the two years I have been working with my nurses, not once have I ever heard a patient ask them what degree they had when they went in to treat the patient, the most a patient would ask is "how long have you been a nurse?" and that is rare in itself.
What really upset me on my path towards this wonderful profession, is when I was asked what type of program I applied to by my nurses I know at the hospital the negative and almost condesending response i recieved from some of them. Its embarsing and fustrating at times to have to defend my choice. I had one litterally call me up and said, what are you doing? you should be applying to a BSN, not an ASN. You will have more options as a BSN, you can't go into management with an ASN. I had to ask her, who says I want to be in management? I then asked her quite simply, are you going to pay my rent ($1000/ month incd utilites for 3 rm studio) here in NY if i don't want to duck gunshots, or hear neighours beating the crap out their kids, step over the chineese food carton that was thown down the stairs of the building, smell the weed coming through the walls, hear the police raiding the next door neighbour apartment or step over people sitting at the entrance to your building thats the kind of money you have to anti up for decent living and thats cheap rent!, I asked her are you going to pay my school loans, are you going to pay my other bills. My employer currently offers tuition reimbusment, I have to be able to put in a certain amount of hours to be eligible for it.
That said, and like i have seen so many others point out, we should be respecting each other and not bashing, it doesn't get us anywhere. ASN/BSN it doesn't matter, at the end of the day we are all RN's.
Now, back to studying for the PAX, 1 month 23 days 9 hrs 45 mins 22 seconds away...I am sooo not ready ugh!!! It sucks studying when you have the flu
hang in there okie..I started out at a cc and would gladly have finished there if it hadnt been for the vocational rehab for veterans affairs requiring me to get a BSN. They refused to pay for an ADN because of my disabilities. I had to get a degree that would allow me to continue to a MSN. I haven't made my mind up but I'm looking into research nursing...but besides all that...I hear it all the time about ADN..BSN and in the town where I go to school it is a huge thing. One of which I am personnally offended by because most of my friends are in ADN programs. From a personal standpoint if I had to pay for it myself I would have stayed with ADN. I find the BSN route more challenging because of all the extra bookwork on top of the clinicals.
I think that is what separates the BSN and the ADN. I don't think it is all about clinicals. I think nursing is a PROFESSION with different aspects to it. Like medicine, it is more than learning about your patients, but it is also about learning about different aspects of the major program also. ADN's may know more about the clinical aspect after they graduates then BSN's, but BSN will eventually catch up because they have the education to be exposed to more aspects and understand the profession more.The BSN is not about the bigger paycheck, but it is about increasing the knowledge of students by learning in a wider scope. I have nothing against ADN nursing, but I think there is a reason why BSN is required to get a masters or any other graduate degree. If you don't want to have a broader scope of the nursing profession, the ADN may be right for you.
I don't know what I will do if nursing was all about clinicals in the BSN program. I want more from college experience than being in a hospital or memorizing conditions as the only thing my college education was based on. Anyways, I am 19, but that is how I see the current situation. I was enrolled in an ADN program, but I think I would've made the wrong decision if I actually started the nursing clinical curriculum straight out of college. Doing the pre reqs have helped me strengthen skills before I start taking care of people.It has helped me learn that getting a degree is more about the education and foundation to help succeed in the BSN program I am currently enrolled in. The last thing I wanted to do is be confronted about a certain condition or aspect of the human body that I wasn't familiar with...Anyways...
Specializes in Critical Care, Pediatrics, Geriatrics.
I think that is what separates the BSN and the ADN. I don't think it is all about clinicals. I think nursing is a PROFESSION with different aspects to it. Like medicine, it is more than learning about your patients, but it is also about learning about different aspects of the major program also. ADN's may know more about the clinical aspect after they graduates then BSN's, but BSN will eventually catch up because they have the education to be exposed to more aspects and understand the profession more.The BSN is not about the bigger paycheck, but it is about increasing the knowledge of students by learning in a wider scope. I have nothing against ADN nursing, but I think there is a reason why BSN is required to get a masters or any other graduate degree. If you don't want to have a broader scope of the nursing profession, the ADN may be right for you.
I don't know what I will do if nursing was all about clinicals in the BSN program. I want more from college experience than being in a hospital or memorizing conditions as the only thing my college education was based on. Anyways, I am 19, but that is how I see the current situation. I was enrolled in an ADN program, but I think I would've made the wrong decision if I actually started the nursing clinical curriculum straight out of college. Doing the pre reqs have helped me strengthen skills before I start taking care of people.It has helped me learn that getting a degree is more about the education and foundation to help succeed in the BSN program I am currently enrolled in. The last thing I wanted to do is be confronted about a certain condition or aspect of the human body that I wasn't familiar with...Anyways...
The original title of this thread is by a poster who is sick and tired of seeing the ongoing debate over "BSN vs ADN: which is better?". To which, many posters have replied WHY their degree is superior/better than the other, like the above post. Does anyone else see the irony in that?
Over and over again, you see nurses frustrated with the image of nursing, the nursing shortage, and the lack of respect the profession gets alltogether. A large contribution is made on our parts with this bickering and stratification among us! LPN vs. RN, ADN vs. BSN, Bedside Nursing vs. Administrative Nurses, etc. etc. etc. It's no wonder our profession is so stagnant in reaching it's goals...we cannot get ourselves unified.
To the above poster, I assure you that ADN students/nurses are no less concerned with nursing as a profession than any BSN student, nor is the focus of their education limited to simple clinical experiences and memorizing s/sx of a disease process. If you are truly concerned about your profession which includes all nurses: LPN, ADN, BSN, MSN, NP, CRNA, CNS, PHD (did I leave anyone out?), then you should not be so quick to judge your peers or place anyone beneath you.
I think that is what separates the BSN and the ADN. I don't think it is all about clinicals. I think nursing is a PROFESSION with different aspects to it. Like medicine, it is more than learning about your patients, but it is also about learning about different aspects of the major program also. ADN's may know more about the clinical aspect after they graduates then BSN's, but BSN will eventually catch up because they have the education to be exposed to more aspects and understand the profession more.The BSN is not about the bigger paycheck, but it is about increasing the knowledge of students by learning in a wider scope. I have nothing against ADN nursing, but I think there is a reason why BSN is required to get a masters or any other graduate degree. If you don't want to have a broader scope of the nursing profession, the ADN may be right for you.
I don't know what I will do if nursing was all about clinicals in the BSN program. I want more from college experience than being in a hospital or memorizing conditions as the only thing my college education was based on. Anyways, I am 19, but that is how I see the current situation. I was enrolled in an ADN program, but I think I would've made the wrong decision if I actually started the nursing clinical curriculum straight out of college. Doing the pre reqs have helped me strengthen skills before I start taking care of people.It has helped me learn that getting a degree is more about the education and foundation to help succeed in the BSN program I am currently enrolled in. The last thing I wanted to do is be confronted about a certain condition or aspect of the human body that I wasn't familiar with...Anyways...
The way I see it is that it's set up almost like in the military. You have your enlisted and officers. The higher the rank, the higher the pay, but with it also comes the larger amount of responsibilities....BSN produces leadership positions....BSN requires more prerequisites, you have lots more general education under your belt when you get in. The BSN program in our area requires 62 credit hrs...that's an Associates going in.
Last semester there were 300 applicants for 50 spots. I have loved all my instructors, been impressed with the level of instruction, and feel prepared.
LMRN10
1,194 Posts
In the end, we will all be nurses!! Some of us with an ADN, others with BSN.
I do plan on hopefully moving towards my BSN eventually, but I have a FT job, a husband, a daughter, a house, a dog (the list goes on and on). Right now, the ADN program will do it for me.