Related to complaints about nursing homes I've heard arguments like "If they really loved her, they wouldn't have put her in a home. They'd take care of her themselves, nothing is more important than family."
Also, "What do you expect when you go to the cheapest possible nursing home/whatever medicare will pay for. If they really cared they'd put her in a more expensive/better nursing home".
Why is it that no one except the pro-nursing home people are allowed to have an opinion here?
Did you even read his post? It had little to do with nursing homes and everything to do with a woman's place in the world. And as someone who has worked in LTC I am offended at the view that we do not "care" (quotes his) for our residents. As someone with friends who have had profoundly disabled children who were placed I am furious on his portrayal of them as lazy.
I agree that home is best if it can be managed safely. I don't know why some find it so hard to grasp that that is not always possible.
I don't agree with that. I think there are some wonderful nursing homes and assisted living places out there. I did clinical at one really awesome one specifically for people with Alzheimer. I have a good friend who has been watching her mother struggle for the last few months trying to care for her grandmother who has very bad dementia now, is often incontinent and has to be locked in at night due to wandering. She is in a "day care" type program in the morning, has CNA's in the afternoon but it's still a lot of work and my friends younger sister still lives at home and has pretty severe learning disabilities and is about to finish high school (the school will force her graduation though technically she can't take most of the tests to avoid spending extra money on sending her to a special school) and no one really knows what the next steps are for her. It's a lot for one person to handle and my friend really wishes her mom would consider a nursing home because she is so stressed out (it doesnt help that none of her 5 siblings even offer to take their mother for the day)
Your friend needs a lawyer to make the school district do what they are legally required to do, I think.
She also needs to stop waiting for the siblings to volunteer. Or else make sure Mom's will specifies that they get $2 apiece and the rest of the millions go to your friend.
As for OP's question, I think it's easy to misjudge, misunderstand, and express outrage without knowing the whole situation. If I had to care for my parents now, I could not do it. I'm somewhat disabled myself and cannot lift and tug and bend like I used to. Plus, I work full-time and can't afford not to. So I'd be forced to hire help or put them in a "home". There are many, many people in similar circumstances.
Why is it that no one except the pro-nursing home people are allowed to have an opinion here?
If someone God forbid has a different point of view they are immediately attacked, criticized and condemned by the pro-nursing home people.
Why don't we just agree to disagree on this subject?
Did anyone attack you for taking care of your parent in your home? Maybe I missed it. Did anyone say you were wrong for doing so?
What I see are a handful of "opinions" calling adult children who choose to "dump" (your word, I believe) their parents in nursing homes "lazy" and "selfish."
I have been watching this thread with great interest. Although it is getting quiet long and I have some catching up to do.
This was a hypothetical question, not based on any one experience but based on the stereotype that I brought up.
I have a personal preference about this and I think I'd prefer to stay home. But at the same time I don't want to be a huge burden to my family. The compromise in my mind is to not allow my life to be unnecessarily prolonged. Once I reach a certain point, I'm bed bound, I can't do any of the things I want to do any more, etc; discontinue all of my medications that don't enhance my comfort and don't take me to the hospital when I get pneumonia. There is a reason we used to call it "the friend of the elderly".
Why is it that no one except the pro-nursing home people are allowed to have an opinion here?
If someone God forbid has a different point of view they are immediately attacked, criticized and condemned by the pro-nursing home people.
Why don't we just agree to disagree on this subject?
That's not true. I gave my opinion and I'm absolutely NOT "pro-nursing home." I tell my parents all the time that I will do everything in my power to keep them home, and my two sisters say the same.
But the fact remains that there is always a possibility that when the time comes, we won't be able to do that (for whatever reason). And yes, it would break my heart to have to take either of my parents to a nursing home. But if I ever did, no one has the right to question my decision. And I would never question anyone else's, despite what my personal feelings may be.
I don't think anyone had a problem with those who have cared for their family member at home. No one criticized or attacked for that. Like xtxrn said, it was in the "delivery" of how you (and others) seemed to degrade those who have opted not to do so.
I am not contradicting myself. Read carefully. I said I can respect that. But if put in that position, I would want to be able to be near by. Therefore, I would have to consider that if my parent were in such a condition that she is unable to orient herself to anything, then why not take the chance to bring her closer despite her wishes. I want to be able to be involved in her care, but to do that actively we would have to be close together. And why am I riddled with judgment just because I want to understand families' reasons? I respect their decisions to place family in the nursing home. That wasn't my question. My question was why don't they ever visit? If they are close by and are not estranged due to family conflicts what reasons are there? I'm not saying there isn't any reasons. I want to know the reasons so I can put them into perspective. I want to understand for mere curiosity. I can argue and give reasons for both sides because of the information brought up here. It's research, it's curiosity, it's trying to understand. I get furious when I see my residents alone on holidays. Of course we are there to betheir family, but I want to know why family can't be there. Or even send a card or some sort of contact. I am trying to understand others because for me, regardless of what a family member could have done to me, it wouldfeel coldhearted to just leave them there alone. If I couldn't face them, then I would send a letter or gift or whatever during holidays. Because I wouldn't want them to feel alone. But that is me. So me asking these questions helps me understand others views. It's not about judging it is understanding others. I am not debating to win. I probe with more questions to get explanations and comprehend them. So don't attack.
You contradict yourself right there, do you not see it?
You say you can respect that (a persons decisions) then immediately go on to say that you would DIS-respect your own parent's wishes if they were not in a position to argue. That is no different than someone's POA disregarding their advanced directives or living will.
They don't visit because for whatever reason they don't want to.
If you really did respected their decision you wouldn't need to ask why to better understand.
Curiosity and probing to better under stand are just polite words for being nosy, it's none of your business why some families make they decisions they do.
So say you did find out the that sweet little old person's family dumped them is because they spent a lifetime terrorizing multiple generations...what difference does it make? Is it going to change the care you give or just your judgment of the family?
Some people, before that became that sweet little old lady or man did things to their family that are so crappy that they deserve to be alone. Be glad you don't have any point of reference, if you did, maybe you'd 'get' it.
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
several of the pro-nursing home posters mentioned that their "loved" ones, either child or elderly parent, died while in the nursing home, and i wonder if anyone has ever considered the possibility their family member died as a result of the shoddy "care" and heartbreak of being abandoned by their family? fifty years ago elderly parents and grandparents lived in multiple-generational homes where the grandchildren learned to respect and value their elderly family members. i've always been perplexed about pro-nursing home people talking about how people have their own families to care for, as if that's an excuse for dumping elderly parents into a nursing home? don't people realize that elderly parents and grandparents are legitimate family members, too? they are setting a bad example of family values to take the easy way out and put their elderly family members in nursing homes. as for adult children needing to work, i realize that men with families to support need to work as do single women without a husband, father or male relative to support them, but a large number of women who should stay at home taking care of their kids and parents place an inordinate emphasis on careers at expense of family.
one of the posters was right on target about how in asian and southern european societies people take the high road, not the easy road, and show personal responsibility by taking care of their elderly parents. the easy way is not always the right way, and it is a sign of selfishness and weakness to be unable or unwilling to care for ones parents. if there's a family with four adult children, why can't the men with families and single women hold jobs outside the home and let the married women contribute by working inside the home taking care of their parents and grandparents? it also burns me up to no end to have to pay taxes to support the medicaid program, most of which is spent on nursing homes, instead of providing financial assistance for home care. i am a caregiver to my elderly father and pay out of pocket for home health workers on days i'm in the office, and my employer let's me work from home 3 days a week. my sisters and i plus our dad are paying in the upper five figures on home health care plus having our hard earned money be funneled away in taxes supporting medicaid for lazy people who've gotten rid of their parents and disabled kids by putting them into long term "care" facilities. these places do not provide care, they simply warehouse the pts and provide a recession proof job for their employees.
how lovely that you're both willing and able to dare for your elderly relatives. but how very judgemental and hateful your post is toward those of us who don't share your advantages or your values.
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
why is it that no one except the pro-nursing home people are allowed to have an opinion here?
if someone god forbid has a different point of view they are immediately attacked, criticized and condemned by the pro-nursing home people.
why don't we just agree to disagree on this subject?
everyone gets to have an opinion, but it's the anti-nursing home people who are judging everyone without the same advantages that they have. "pro-nursing home people" aren't attacking anyone else for a difference of opinion; we're objecting to the judgemental tone of some of these posts.
Several of the pro-nursing home posters mentioned that their "loved" ones, either child or elderly parent, died while in the nursing home, and I wonder if anyone has ever considered the possibility their family member died as a RESULT of the shoddy "care" and heartbreak of being abandoned by their family? Fifty years ago elderly parents and grandparents lived in multiple-generational homes where the grandchildren learned to respect and value their elderly family members. I've always been perplexed about pro-nursing home people talking about how people have their own families to care for, as if that's an excuse for dumping elderly parents into a nursing home? Don't people realize that elderly parents and grandparents are legitimate family members, too? They are setting a bad example of family values to take the easy way out and put their elderly family members in nursing homes. As for adult children needing to work, I realize that men with families to support need to work as do single women without a husband, father or male relative to support them, but a large number of women who should stay at home taking care of their kids and parents place an inordinate emphasis on careers at expense of family.
One of the posters was right on target about how in Asian and southern European societies people take the high road, not the easy road, and show personal responsibility by taking care of their elderly parents. The easy way is not always the right way, and it is a sign of selfishness and weakness to be unable or unwilling to care for ones parents. If there's a family with four adult children, why can't the men with families and single women hold jobs outside the home and let the married women contribute by working inside the home taking care of their parents and grandparents? It also burns me up to no end to have to pay taxes to support the Medicaid program, most of which is spent on nursing homes, instead of providing financial assistance for home care. I am a caregiver to my elderly father and pay out of pocket for home health workers on days I'm in the office, and my employer let's me work from home 3 days a week. My sisters and I plus our Dad are paying in the upper five figures on home health care plus having our hard earned money be funneled away in taxes supporting Medicaid for lazy people who've gotten rid of their parents and disabled kids by putting them into long term "care" facilities. These places do not provide care, they simply warehouse the pts and provide a recession proof job for their employees.
You're funny.
How about the husbands stay home and the wives got to work...but then they might get a little taste of freedom and we can't have that now can we?
scares me that there are so many idiots out there, unaware that other people have different lives and abilities and not everyone can spend every 2 hours turning and repositioning someone.. some of them in healthcare themselves.
about to start page 18, but to all those stating that "other cultures care for their elderly" are these cultures where people routinely live VERY LONG? I don't think so. and the more that changes there more they will increase placements in ltc.................. how do you guys purpose a 75 year old take care of her 90-95 year old parents? i know people like this . i am sure we all do.
SuesquatchRN, BSN, RN
10,263 Posts
Did you even read his post? It had little to do with nursing homes and everything to do with a woman's place in the world. And as someone who has worked in LTC I am offended at the view that we do not "care" (quotes his) for our residents. As someone with friends who have had profoundly disabled children who were placed I am furious on his portrayal of them as lazy.
I agree that home is best if it can be managed safely. I don't know why some find it so hard to grasp that that is not always possible.