I remember being taught in nursing school the rights of medication administration -
Right patient
Right medication
Right dose
Right route
Right time
Right documentation
Right situation
Right place
RIGHT TO REFUSE.
I also remember my nursing instructor stressing how important number 9 is and that we as nurses have a duty to ensure that the right to refuse any medical care or medication is honored and upheld. To advocate for our patients and protect them. Protect them from what you may ask? To protect them from other medical professionals and “people” who think they can bully, manipulate, control and dominate any patient to force a medication, procedure or any type of medical care.
And wouldn’t you know that this RIGHT to refuse has been what I have had to defend more than anything? As an RN of more than a decade, I will forever support the right to choose and also the right to REFUSE any form of medical care. I can’t believe anyone feels that mandates of any form of medicine or medical practice or procedure is acceptable. Even more shocked that some nurses and NURSE LEADERS feel this is acceptable after a career of fighting for, defending and advocating for our patients rights.
Forced healthcare is NOT healthcare and I stand for the freedom this country was founded on. I have stood for my patients right to choose. And now that nurses and other healthcare workers rights are being threatened, I stand for their right to choose as well. COERCION is not CONSENT.
They'll either get sick n die or get sick and develop immunity like the vast majority do.
Or they’ll get it and have long term sequelae like a friend of mine who used to be an ER nurse and got COVID early in the pandemic and is in the years-long process of applying for SSD because she’s now permanently disabled and will likely never be able to work again. IDK why people forget that there are more potential outcomes than get it and die or get it and be A. OK. Perhaps they just don’t care about them?
Anyway, I’m sick of how dry my hands are from all the constant handwashing and handsanitizing. I’ve decided to stop washing and hand sanitizing at work because it’s my body and my choice and I thank all the antivaxxers in advance for their support.
1.Or they’ll get it and have long term sequelae like a friend of mine who used to be an ER nurse and got COVID early in the pandemic and is in the years-long process of applying for SSD because she’s now permanently disabled and will likely never be able to work again. IDK why people forget that there are more potential outcomes than get it and die or get it and be A. OK. Perhaps they just don’t care about them?
2.Anyway, I’m sick of how dry my hands are from all the constant handwashing and handsanitizing. I’ve decided to stop washing and hand sanitizing at work because it’s my body and my choice and I thank all the antivaxxers in advance for their support.
1. Correct. All the more reason to stop with the hostility in hopes people are more receptive to protect themselves
2. Hand washing wasn't discovered 9 months ago and isn't injected in your body. You're not afraid to wash your hands. People are afraid of new drugs they are being coerced to take receiving conflicting information about.
Specializes in Pediatrics, Pediatric Float, PICU, NICU.
34 minutes ago, jive turkey said:
2. Hand washing wasn't discovered 9 months ago and isn't injected in your body. You're not afraid to wash your hands.
mRNA vaccines also weren’t discovered 9 months ago, they have been researched for decades. Stop with your “I’m not against vaccinations BUT…” BS. You are the most dangerous type of devil’s advocate and you continue to spew it on post after post.
mRNA vaccines also weren’t discovered 9 months ago, they have been researched for decades. Stop with your “I’m not against vaccinations BUT…” BS. You are the most dangerous type of devil’s advocate and you continue to spew it on post after post.
These specific vaccines, for this specific virus....9 months boo boo.
Just because the automobile was invented over a century ago doesn't mean newly manufactured automobiles cease to have recalls.
Get your facts straight!
I am not against the vaccine. I am against a one size fits all approach and the mandates that come with them.
The Most dangerous are people with your attitude who are hostile towards anyone who has an objection to these vaccines. Many people don't have a one dimensional sheep mentality perspective about things. Your attitude suggests the goal isn't to increase vaccination awareness rather to feel empowered by criticizing and belittling people and stroke your own ego.
2. Hand washing wasn't discovered 9 months ago and isn't injected in your body. You're not afraid to wash your hands. People are afraid of new drugs they are being coerced to take receiving conflicting information about.
Fair to say that some are.
Others verbalize views that seem to be more focused along lines to which the analogy easily applies: Just not wanting to be told that they should do something, because reasons (inconvenience, don't want to be told what to do, whatever).
There are indeed reasons other than fear. Just like with masks. Like handwashing, masks aren't injecting anything into one's body. But from practically day one of the recommendations I encountered people already mad about why they should have to wear one. How is that? What great threat does a mask pose, besides perhaps feeling a little odd (silly/weird) at first? I think masks are an even better example than vaccine resistance of the spirit of a lot of what is going on. Sure, now that something has to be injected it's easy to say that the misgivings are about genuine fear and uncertainty. And yet those same undertones were and are present with regard to masks, which are not injected, were not "recently invented," have been used heavily in various industries and roles and really pose almost zero threat of physical harm to the grand majority of people.
I bet if all we had to do to stop covid was to wear a magic covid-killing sticker on our shirt there would be people who refuse to do it. Don't you think? Can you really say that is an exaggeration, because I sincerely don't think it is at this point.
This is just really difficult to understand; I think bewildering is a decent word.
Others verbalize views that seem to be more focused along lines to which the analogy easily applies: Just not wanting to be told that they should do something, because reasons (inconvenience, don't want to be told what to do, whatever).
2.There are indeed reasons other than fear. Just like with masks. Like handwashing, masks aren't injecting anything into one's body. But from practically day one of the recommendations I encountered people already mad about why they should have to wear one. How is that?
3.I bet if all we had to do to stop covid was to wear a magic covid-killing sticker on our shirt there would be people who refuse to do it. Don't you think? Can you really say that is an exaggeration, because I sincerely don't think it is at this point.
This is just really difficult to understand; I think bewildering is a decent word.
1.Many are
2. I hear you. The mask isn't very invasive for those without challenges breathing normally
3. I would say that's an exaggeration. I get your point that there are people that are blatantly defiant.
mRNA vaccines also weren’t discovered 9 months ago, they have been researched for decades. Stop with your “I’m not against vaccinations BUT…” BS. You are the most dangerous type of devil’s advocate and you continue to spew it on post after post.
I am fairly sure the damage he can do is limited.
I have asked several times what kind of nursing he does, no answer. Unless it was buried amongst the heaps of petty, unsubstantiated noise.
He has saturated this forum with debate, the sifts through and cherry picks nit picky errors to prolong it.
As far as the effect? Hopefully negligible amongst patients. Most nurses here are in one of two camps. One side is the overwhelming consensus of medical, scientific ,and nursing experts and organizations, and the other is driving the spread of the pandemic. I do worry a bit about nurses who are somehow on the fence. Maybe they need a just a little more doubt to push them over.
In that case, it's collateral damage. The point of it isn't exchange of ideas, it is maintaining center stage, and driving the narrative.
It's not semantics. You're misreading what I'm saying and made a smart alec remark.
You're correcting me on something I wasn't saying.
The ignorance comes from your comments and your negative, condescending, unproductive attitude.
I'm not picking on your practice I'm picking on your attitude. An attitude like yours is what turns people further away than they already were. You need to drop the high and mighty holier then thou attitude when people come to you. When people come to you with "excuses" as you call them it's their way of saying "I'm afraid"!
That's your job to stop and acknowledge their feelings, show empathy and respect for what they have to say instead of "countering" them a you say.
Same goes for the rest of you. Talking crap about the hesitant DOES NOT HELP. Be better than the "anti vaxxer" and show some compassion. Otherwise you make it clear you're more concerned with being correct than increasing vaccinations.
Was that remark "smart alec" when you used it a few posts above?
You like to lecture people about what they should and shouldn't do. The truth is, you have no idea what working at the provider level is, or running a practice, or having a few thousand people you are responsible for, or what it's like to have the buck stop with you, so maybe save the unsolicited advice for things you have some clue about.
Letting false information, pseudoscience, and incorrect statements stand without being countered does no one any good.
At least we are on the same page now, vaccines benefit both those that receive them and those that don't.
1.Was that remark "smart alec" when you used it a few posts above?
2.You like to lecture people about what they should and shouldn't do. The truth is, you have no idea what working at the provider level is, or running a practice, or having a few thousand people you are responsible for, or what it's like to have the buck stop with you, so maybe save the unsolicited advice for things you have some clue about.
3.Letting false information, pseudoscience, and incorrect statements stand without being countered does no one any good.
At least we are on the same page now, vaccines benefit both those that receive them and those that don't.
1.I use smart alec responses when somebody comes at me that way FIRST. I don't lead with it. You interjected on a post replying to someone else.
2. I see, so that's your "excuse" for your attitude. I don't have to operate at a provider level to see how provider attitudes affect patients. I see how it affects staff when providers are rude when giving orders but more importantly when I see how their attitude affects patients. I don't doubt for a second it is stressful and challenging for you Boston. That's no excuse to have that attitude about people's fears if you're going to also give them advice.
3. Nobody says you should let that stuff stand. You don't have to be judgemental when you coach people. I get it, there will be those that you cast get through to and will go around spreading nonsense. That's not everybody. Just like you speak up when people spread misinformation I speak up when I see misguided attitudes.
Remember how you used to lecture me about how concerned you were lay people would come to this form and read my comments? I have the same concern for them regarding yours. Imagine a hesitant person reading that a provider thinks that their fears are just stupid pseudo science excuses.
I have asked several times what kind of nursing he does, no answer. Unless it was buried amongst the heaps of petty, unsubstantiated noise.
He has saturated this forum with debate, the sifts through and cherry picks nit picky errors to prolong it.
As far as the effect? Hopefully negligible amongst patients. Most nurses here are in one of two camps. One side is the overwhelming consensus of medical, scientific ,and nursing experts and organizations, and the other is driving the spread of the pandemic. I do worry a bit about nurses who are somehow on the fence. Maybe they need a just a little more doubt to push them over.
In that case, it's collateral damage. The point of it isn't exchange of ideas, it is maintaining center stage, and driving the narrative.
You were being ignored. Take a hint.
If you REALLY wanted to know what nursing experience I have a simple click on the profile name would have answered that.
When arguments are weak and failing a common tactic on this forum is to challenge the credentials of the poster in an effort to launch personal attacks.
I've seen you do that to others.
Once I saw you attempt that, it was clear all I needed to do was go to my side of the ring leave your responses laying on the canvas like Sonny Liston.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
2 hours ago, jive turkey said:
Imagine a hesitant person reading that a provider thinks that their fears are just stupid pseudo science excuses.
Just imagine that they encounter professional opinion that their beliefs (which cause them to remain unvaccinated) are poorly sourced and increasing risk for everyone around them, are not in line with the data, evidence, expert opinion or recommendation. Imagine that they encounter health professionals passionately encouraging vaccination.
Now imagine that confused and hesitant lay person reading this thread and believing that people who call themselves nurses are arguing that if they think they've had covid previously they really don't need to vaccinate.
Specializes in OR, Nursing Professional Development.
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HiddencatBSN, BSN
594 Posts
Or they’ll get it and have long term sequelae like a friend of mine who used to be an ER nurse and got COVID early in the pandemic and is in the years-long process of applying for SSD because she’s now permanently disabled and will likely never be able to work again. IDK why people forget that there are more potential outcomes than get it and die or get it and be A. OK. Perhaps they just don’t care about them?
Anyway, I’m sick of how dry my hands are from all the constant handwashing and handsanitizing. I’ve decided to stop washing and hand sanitizing at work because it’s my body and my choice and I thank all the antivaxxers in advance for their support.