Why are so many nurses against unions?

[Icunicenurse]

I really don't understand. I am a newish nurse that landed my "dream job" in the icu. My hospital is the biggest and best in the area and we are currently on a journey to magnet. I feel like I was lied to about how this would help nurses and we would be supported and taken care of.

In my icu we have a very high acuity. We are constantly short staffed and tripled. 1:1 for ccrt pts is advertised but never actually happens!

I have seen a patient self extubate during the holy interdisciplinary rounds due to that nurse being tripled and spread out across the unit. None of the bosses said any thing and just went on to round on the next patient.

The majority of our assistants will not help unless asked and it's like pulling teeth just to get them to help with a blood sugar check. Often they are sitting on their cellphones or just catching up on gossip. But since they have worked there a long time it is widely accepted by the staff.

We have are losing staff nurses left and right.

I have been talked down to by our surgeons and blatantly disrespected on more than one occasion for trying to help a patient but not enough to be considered abusive so that I could report it. Once, I calmly asked a doc to update the close family members of a dying patient at their request. Since a distant family had been updated, the doctor was visibly offended and proceeded to call my charge nurse and say "I got in her face" which was completely false. Luckily the charge was within ear shot and heard everything. This was swept under the rug.

During my new nurse orientation the nursing instructor preached against unions especially since we were going magnet and would have so many benefits.

I feel like a strong nurse union could solve many of our problems and help our patient care. But the majority of nurses I have talked to are completely against it. I can't understand this for the life of me.

Sadly, my dream job has turned to hell. I love my sick patients and family but sick of being overworked, tripled, never even getting a lunch break, all while being talked down to and humiliated by the Dr.s that see me as a stupid new nurse.

[subee, MSN, CRNA]

5 hours ago, Nurse Pompom said:

I'm not against unions. I just wish mine didn't suck. They get nothing done, send derogative letters, and recently let several nurses get fired so that they could get replaced by an external agency. They also let us work without the proper equipment for months in the COVID 19 crisis with no compensation, while the guy at JobLot was getting a paycheck increase and 2% of the price increase that was applied to ALL the items in the store in his pocket. This happened to most nurses. Nurses signed up to help people, yes, they didn't sign up to work in such conditions. Every time I receive a letter from the union I can't help but think of them as bouffons now.

But, are you an RN only union? I could be wrong, but it is my prejudice at this point:) that an ALL RN union is a different beast from one that represets the trades.

[travelingrn2001, ASN, BSN]

I have reached out to a couple of unions that are active or want to become active in south Florida and am only able to get their voicemail.

I find it scary that this is my only contact when I feel like my career may be at risk if I initiated union contact at my facility. I wish the initial information gathering and process information could be obtained anonymously.

[subee, MSN, CRNA]

The FNA or NNU are also not answering the phones? I believe those would be your only all RN alternatives. I'm guessing with Covid here, they are occupied with immediate safety issues. I live in a pretty conservative area but our hospital's nurses succeeded in unionizing just two years ago after getting the citizens of the city behind them. It is a magnet hospital and the dispute wasn't over pay. It was more focused on staffing and floating issues.

On 5/18/2020 at 12:21 PM, Nurse Pompom said:

I'm not against unions. I just wish mine didn't suck. They get nothing done, send derogative letters, and recently let several nurses get fired so that they could get replaced by an external agency. They also let us work without the proper equipment for months in the COVID 19 crisis with no compensation, while the guy at JobLot was getting a paycheck increase and 2% of the price increase that was applied to ALL the items in the store in his pocket. This happened to most nurses. Nurses signed up to help people, yes, they didn't sign up to work in such conditions. Every time I receive a letter from the union I can't help but think of them as bouffons now.

But, are you an RN only union? I could be wrong, but it is my prejudice at this point:) that an ALL RN union is a different beast from one that represets the trades.

[DannyBoy8, RN]

On 5/18/2020 at 12:21 PM, Nurse Pompom said:

I'm not against unions. I just wish mine didn't suck. They get nothing done, send derogative letters, and recently let several nurses get fired so that they could get replaced by an external agency. They also let us work without the proper equipment for months in the COVID 19 crisis with no compensation, while the guy at JobLot was getting a paycheck increase and 2% of the price increase that was applied to ALL the items in the store in his pocket. This happened to most nurses. Nurses signed up to help people, yes, they didn't sign up to work in such conditions. Every time I receive a letter from the union I can't help but think of them as bouffons now.

Nursing unions can suck because of the political environment that they have to operate in. Much of this country has been fed irrational logic about why unions are bad and if you work hard, you'll be fine on your own, so our laws don't empower unions even in states where they have "considerable" power.

[Nurse Pompom]

On 7/26/2020 at 3:25 AM, DannyBoy8 said:

Nursing unions can suck because of the political environment that they have to operate in. Much of this country has been fed irrational logic about why unions are bad and if you work hard, you'll be fine on your own, so our laws don't empower unions even in states where they have "considerable" power.

I mean in an ideal world, you'd work hard and would not lose your job or your benefits. The world is not ideal though, and we do need unions. I think mine could be more efficient, however I do recognize that unions are needed.

[myoglobin, ASN, BSN, MSN]

I also think that it is also important to recognize that many nursing unions are also highly political and this can create challenges for those with different viewpoints. Thus, someone might support the union on work issues, but if they are conservative, libertarian, and or Republican they may find it difficult to support the larger political issues that unions often take (such as Medicare for all or frequent support of Democratic administrations.).

[RNatloss]

I worked at both unionized and non-unionized hospitals before. With the unionized hospital I feel more protected but I get less pay. After paying my union dues, I ended up getting a couple hundred dollars less than what I am getting paid right at a non-unionized hospital. A couple hundred dollars less each month winds up to be a couple thousands a year. I have no opinion on unions. I know there are good ones and bad ones. I won't go out my ways to find one nor will I try to bypass non unionized ones.

[Wuzzie]

46 minutes ago, RNatloss said:

With the unionized hospital I feel more protected but I get less pay.

That’s unfortunate. Our union pay is what drives the non-union hospitals in my city to raise their pay to match ours. It happens like clockwork every time we negotiate a new contract.

[Catedi]

On 1/26/2016 at 9:38 PM, XNavyCorpsman said:

When you have a Union you loose flexibility. I'll give you an example; Most of us Nurses want to adjust our work schedule so that we get more days off in a row. We can't because that would require the LPN's, which are Unionized, to adjust their contract. If you know anything about Unions, once you join a Union, you now work for the Union and NOT the hospital. The biggest thing is you loose flexibility.

I don't know where you get your information at, but I work for a union protected facility and we have plenty of flexibility. If we want a day off, we can trade a day with a coworker and we don't have to use our personal time. But we do get lots of personal, vacation, and sick time to last. Also, if we work an overtime shift, instead of getting paid overtime we can get straight pay at our regular rate, then get the overtime hours worked as comp-time. I know one nurse who's at the top of seniority who parlayed her leave to nearly 6 months off of paid leave a year. The hours are the best. The pay and benefits are the best (I'm making $49 per hour in a market where the rate at the local hospital is only $29 per hour), and I can take every single day off I'm entitled to without a hassle or a cross look. My vacation pay is 3 weeks a year @ 7 years, and my personal time is 60 hours a year, and I have an additional 80 hours a year sick time. Why would I ever want anything else, and why would I ever care if someone thought it unprofessional to join a union? I hope their measly paycheck keeps them warm at night.

[VivaLasViejas, ASN, RN]

On 8/16/2020 at 7:05 AM, myoglobin said:

I also think that it is also important to recognize that many nursing unions are also highly political and this can create challenges for those with different viewpoints. Thus, someone might support the union on work issues, but if they are conservative, libertarian, and or Republican they may find it difficult to support the larger political issues that unions often take (such as Medicare for all or frequent support of Democratic administrations.).

Nailed it. ??

[londonflo]

On 1/21/2016 at 10:47 AM, mpct said:

Organized nursing labor is very important or nurses will get shafted.

I only worked the last 20 years of my working life with a college that was unionized. I wish it had been all my working life. 2 other nursing schools I worked at had this policy: if you were sick for a clinical instruction day,  you had to find your own replacement and they had to work for free. Same went for if you wanted to be off for a funeral, or a conference. For both days you had to take PTO which irritated me because if someone covered my clinical, you bet I would obligated to cover theirs when they were sick (and not get paid). I had to work someone's maternity leaves for both children as I was told "we all help each other out." And I wasn't told I was doing it until that instructor went into labor. I was so thrilled when "caller id" came into existence. 

Now Union college, the Dean finds a replacement and the replacement gets paid an hourly rate per contract. Every 3 years, with renewal of the contract that rate goes up.

I do not have to support who the Union endorses in politics. Some faculty objected to some of their funds going to certain candidates the Union backed. Other places to donate that were not political were identified but the same amount did have to be donated.

[herring_RN, ASN, BSN]

On 6/17/2019 at 1:36 PM, BrentRN said:

I would say that one experience good or bad should not determine how a nurse chooses to join a unionized hospital. I always suggest speaking to some of the nurses of the unit you would be working for the pros and cons of the working environment. This goes for union and nonunion work. It can be hard to get a true picture on a recruiter's tour.

I remember one place that really had me ready to work. After the interview I went back to the unit and spoke privately with some of the nurses. To a person they told me to run away, and they outlined the problems. It saved me a lot of grief.

A former travel nurse told me how she decided which offer to accept. She would call the unit she was interested in two weekends in a row during the time of the offered shift and ask to speak with a direct care nurse. If it wasn't too busy she had conversations with any nurses willing to talk.  She believes that is how to get honest answers. 

Guess what? She had done that before working with US for 12 weeks.