How do you guys feel that student nurses (in CA) now have to have a 3.5 to 4.0 GPA to even be considered into school? Also TEAS standardized testing has to be at least 90 or above in order to be considered competitive. The GPAs are calculated by Microbiology, two levels Anatomy, Physiology, and overall science GPA. Even if students get past that threshold, they have to write essays, go to panel interviews, and are run through the ringer just to get into school which sorts through hundreds, if not thousands (SDSU) of applicants every cohort.
I'm curious to know if you think you could pass the standards that are employed today for today's nursing students. These students could probably be competitive candidates for medical school, where as in the 70's, 80's, and 90's you probably just had to sign the dotted line to get in. Do you think that if you had to do it again right now that you could get into a program and become a nurse?
I think anybody can become good at something if they do it long enough, especially nursing. But with the level of students that are applying today, the future of nursing looks very bright. I anticipate these new grads will stand on the shoulders of their predecessors and drive the profession into something great.
Mister Red Wino, I do disagree with you and you need to re- read what I said about a minimum GPA of 3.0 compared to what the students being accepted all having 3.5 or higher every cohort, every semester. No waiting list, no need for one because those with the highest GPA,s got in. Now most GPAs dropped during nursing program due to different grading scales ( >94 A; >83 B; > >76=C & < 75.9 Failed, search these forums it’s similar in most nursing programs . I remember only 2 graduating with high honors in 10 years.
Fourth time having to repost this. Mister Red Wino, this is your first post, and what is the point? It only servers to promote division of highly seasoned experienced nurses from the latest generation, insinuating that in the past it was easier to enter nursing programs, nothing positive in claiming that newer generations of nurses stand on shoulders of previous nurses as if they are new & improved version. The post is meant to create conflict among the nursing profession. The claims he makes have no basis.
It depends. GPA does not automatically mean you will be a good RN. I think critical thinking skills should be factored in. I can't stand when people equate high GPA, test taking skills, and writing ability to being a good nurse. I've seen my fair share of nurses like this. As other older nurses have stated nursing school has always been hard to get into. In fact I would go one step further and say nursing school was harder to get into (and stay in) then than it is now. I've talked to many an experienced nurse who told me how hard it was with some hospital run nursing programs.
When I read these threads, the most common causes for a failure in a nursing career are usually things independent of GPA, intelligence or test taking ability.
An inability to get along with others, uncontrolled anxiety, unrealistic expectations, inability to adapt to new situations, laziness, irresponsibility, and other factors play a bigger part in nurses who struggle in nursing.
Specializes in Psych (25 years), Medical (15 years).
On 4/21/2020 at 5:07 PM, M1ST3R3DW1N0_RN said:
I think anybody can become good at something if they do it long enough, especially nursing. But with the level of students that are applying today, the future of nursing looks very bright. I anticipate these new grads will stand on the shoulders of their predecessors and drive the profession into something great.
To stand on someone's shoulders, to make progress due to the previous work of those who have come before, takes appreciation and some deep self-reckoning and illumination, resulting in a higher understanding and/or change of consciousness.
That higher understanding is not the result of the ability to score high on tests; a high intelligence does not necessarily coincide with a higher consciousness.
The ability to render good nursing care takes knowledge, experience, and empathy.
The nursing profession does not have to be "driven into something great", for it is, in and of itself, already great.
Realizing goals utilizing knowledge experience and empathy will keep the profession great.
what I am seeing in new grads is a higher percentage of book smart and not much common sense or critical thinking ability ?
This. Not to mention I didn't hear of anyone starting jobs and then quitting within a couple months because it was too hard....even the gal I worked with at my first job who failed Boards the first time didn't quit, she just buckled down, worked harder at work and studied.
Specializes in Psych, Addictions, SOL (Student of Life).
16 hours ago, mmc51264 said:
what I am seeing in new grads is a higher percentage of book smart and not much common sense or critical thinking ability ?
Here here! I am the master preceptor at my facility and am amazed at the lack of common sense and critical thinking skills many of the last crop of new grads posses. High grade point averages might be an indicator of success in school but not necessarily an indicator for success in the work force.
Specializes in ICU/community health/school nursing.
In many places there is no real nursing shortage. In north Texas there are three colleges/universities and four junior colleges all lined up to get their students into clinicals with THREE hospital systems and a public hospital.
I realize it's different other places.
But schools can afford to be particular when they KNOW that there are more students than jobs. Also the schools have a vested interest in saying that 99% of our students pass the NCLEX. I don't like it but as I was reminded when RJ Junior was applying to colleges - GPA and how you do on a standardized test are intertwined in the minds of most administrators.
Nursing school has always been difficult to get into as well as the actual program itself. Mine was based on a point system with the majority of points coming from the science classes (micro, A&P etc). Also a few points for general ed, if you lived in the area etc. The school (after I graduated) went to a lottery system only and later went back to the point system bc too many people were not making it through the program. I don't think that nurses are brighter now just different skills/knowledge than previous generations etc.
Also, I think it may be harder for new nurses to get a job bc the market is saturated in many areas due to both more schools and foreign students than in previous days.
Grade point averages are pretty meaningless unless you can show that they represent a consistent level of learning or ability. In some schools, half the students get A's on a course. In other schools, only the top 2 or 3 percent get an A.
Standardized test scores are very difficult to compare from year to year as they evolve over time.
So ... most of these threads end up being pretty much just a collections of personal opinions.
And to the people who say they went to a nursing school that was really terrible ... I say, "Well, then you made a bad decision. You should have done your homework and found a good school -- with a curriculum that you liked. There is lots of curricular variety out there."
Specializes in Community Health, Med/Surg, ICU Stepdown.
I agree with many above that GPA and test scores do not mean you will or will not be a good nurse. They may show you are good at taking tests and don't have test anxiety. And as stated above someone who gets a high GPA at one school may not get one at another school depending on grading, competition, etc. I got an almost perfect SAT score and I was a mess in my first Clinicals... anxiety, poor time management...
I went to a "prestigious" BSN program and learned the most in my science and patho classes and in clinical, not the other high level theory classes I had to take. Honestly these classes took time away from me practicing skills and studying things relevant to nursing practice. If my program focused more on practical skills I would have been a better new grad. I think courses like ethics are important, but maybe don't force nursing students to tack on high level philosophy and history courses! It was a great program but I wish I could have kept the nursing/medical classes and skipped everything else. Maybe that would make me a less "well rounded" person, but people study non-nursing topics once they graduate and have time!
mmc51264, BSN, MSN, RN
3,319 Posts
what I am seeing in new grads is a higher percentage of book smart and not much common sense or critical thinking ability ?