Future Nurses are Brighter Than Ever

[M1ST3R3DW1N0_RN, BSN]

How do you guys feel that student nurses (in CA) now have to have a 3.5 to 4.0 GPA to even be considered into school? Also TEAS standardized testing has to be at least 90 or above in order to be considered competitive. The GPAs are calculated by Microbiology, two levels Anatomy, Physiology, and overall science GPA. Even if students get past that threshold, they have to write essays, go to panel interviews, and are run through the ringer just to get into school which sorts through hundreds, if not thousands (SDSU) of applicants every cohort.

I'm curious to know if you think you could pass the standards that are employed today for today's nursing students. These students could probably be competitive candidates for medical school, where as in the 70's, 80's, and 90's you probably just had to sign the dotted line to get in. Do you think that if you had to do it again right now that you could get into a program and become a nurse?

I think anybody can become good at something if they do it long enough, especially nursing. But with the level of students that are applying today, the future of nursing looks very bright. I anticipate these new grads will stand on the shoulders of their predecessors and drive the profession into something great.

[brownbook]

At first I thought you were complaining the requirements were too strict.

Not sure if "anybody can become good at something if they do it long enough, especially nursing". For too many reasons to mention that doesn't make any sense at all.

I started nursing prerequisites in 1979. To be admitted to the ADN program you took all the required courses. Anatomy, physiology, Microbiology, Chemistry, etc. You were given "points" for your grades. So the nurses with the most points, highest grades, got in. TEAS hadn't been invented yet.

A co-worker, (CNA). about 8 years ago started the journey to get her RN degree. The schools she applied had a lottery system. Any nurse who passed all the required courses was eligible regardless of their grade and pure luck if you won the lottery.

This was all in California public schools.

"Sign on the dotted line"

[M1ST3R3DW1N0_RN, BSN]

Started her journey 8 years ago pretty much sums it up, I've heard of people taking longer for their journey. Is she an RN yet? There hasn't been a lottery for about 7 years now as far as I know, and there are hundreds of applicants. As far as getting a job is concerned:

I've heard from experienced nurses that it was wide open back in the day, you could literally choose any specialty that you like. I heard of a recent graduating cohort in 2020 that only 8 out of 50 have jobs yet, and the competition to get a job in SoCal is fierce. So again I ask: Under those odds, do you think you could rise above your competition and still be an RN in your specialty of choice? It's a legitimate question.

[PollywogNP, ADN, BSN, MSN, LPN, NP]

Getting into nursing schools has always been challenging even in the 1970’s/80’s. Was competitive then & still is. I taught in BSN program with minimum GPA to be allowed to apply was 3.0; however those selected had 3.5 & higher GPA. All schools in USA have various entry exams (HESI, TEAS, etc) meant to screen those that are likely to succeed. As an 18 year old LPN nursing student, I was told my nursing program only took ONE student from each High School in my state, I didn’t know that when I applied & we were told that during first week introductions. GPA was also a consideration, and no we didn’t “ just sign on dotted line” ?. So yeah, I could get into a nursing program now, nothing has changed as far as requiring high GPA. Where did you got the idea that it was easy to get accepted into nursing program the 70s/80s?? The same pre req courses were required then.

[Wuzzie]

4 hours ago, M1ST3R3DW1N0_RN said:

I'm curious to know if you think you could pass the standards that are employed today for today's nursing students.  

Oh please. Three decades ago it was just as hard. We had to go through the same thing except instead of the TEAS we had the SAT AND the ACT (on which you had to score a 30 or better). Interviews with battle axe instructors who had no wish to be our friends, 3 letters of recommendation and if we got into a school we failed at a C. Followed that with a 2 day long exam on scantron sheets with, as I recall, 2000 questions. So to answer your question, yes, I would have passed the standards and while I don’t disagree that nursing students today are bright they aren’t any brighter than any of us were. You don’t know what you’re talking about and Lord I hope you’re wearing your asbestos undies.

What a stinker of a thread.

[buckchaser10]

42 minutes ago, Wuzzie said:

ACT (on which you had to score a 30 or better)

Is this a typo or did the ACT used to be scored differently? Top score is 36. National average is something like 20. I know plenty of nurses who couldn't even dream of hitting 20 (don't get me wrong they are still great nurses.) Your asbestos undies comment killed me! ?

As far as OP, yes nursing school is hard to get into in some places. In my state it is as simple as finishing anat and phys and you are on the list at many schools. Even with requirements as stringent as the ones you are listing poor nurses will make it into school and graduate in a field they should never be allowed in. With requirements as stringent as you said, potential future all star nurses will never make it into that school.

We are in a country facing an aging workforce and no one to replace them. With the aging population more nurses will be needed. Should we really be denying those who want to be nurses because they can't write for crud? Let me tell you, while I may get peeved at my fellow nurses spelling the education you receive in grade school for sentence structure would suffice for charting. I want nurses who are compassionate and able to critically think. Not nurses who can tell me the history of the world from 1500-present and can tell me all the elements on the periodic table but can't even work their way out of a wet paper bag.

This is coming from a nurse who has achieved A's their whole life and scored a 31 on their ACT so don't think I take this stance because I am dumb. Far from it actually.

[M1ST3R3DW1N0_RN, BSN]

6 hours ago, PollywogNP said:

It sounds like you may disagree with my opinion. 3.0 is a very low cut off, and becomes exponentially more difficult to get and maintain a GPA higher than 3.7, especially in a nursing program. I would say 3.6 is on the lower end these days for acceptance into a nursing school. I took a peek at the student forums and that confirmed some of my suspicions. It's a good thing for sure.

[brownbook]

Now you're changing your question.

Yes it is hard to get into nursing school now because there are a lot of applicants and not a lot of teachers, among other reasons.

Yes it's hard to get a job after you graduate because the nursing market is saturated.

Yes until around 2000 it was easier to find a job and go right into the speciality you wanted.

My friend persevered. Got her LVN degree, ADN degree and BSN degree. Has a great job now. It was hard and frustrating but she refused to give up.

My "generation" of nurses had it easier. But not because the educational requirements were less rigid.

[M1ST3R3DW1N0_RN, BSN]

1 hour ago, buckchaser10 said:

Is this a typo or did the ACT used to be scored differently? Top score is 36. National average is something like 20. I know plenty of nurses who couldn't even dream of hitting 20 (don't get me wrong they are still great nurses.) Your asbestos undies comment killed me! ?

As far as OP, yes nursing school is hard to get into in some places. In my state it is as simple as finishing anat and phys and you are on the list at many schools. Even with requirements as stringent as the ones you are listing poor nurses will make it into school and graduate in a field they should never be allowed in. With requirements as stringent as you said, potential future all star nurses will never make it into that school.

We are in a country facing an aging workforce and no one to replace them. With the aging population more nurses will be needed. Should we really be denying those who want to be nurses because they can't write for crud? Let me tell you, while I may get peeved at my fellow nurses spelling the education you receive in grade school for sentence structure would suffice for charting. I want nurses who are compassionate and able to critically think. Not nurses who can tell me the history of the world from 1500-present and can tell me all the elements on the periodic table but can't even work their way out of a wet paper bag.

This is coming from a nurse who has achieved A's their whole life and scored a 31 on their ACT so don't think I take this stance because I am dumb. Far from it actually.

This I agree with. I think the nursing education model as is stands is a joke. It needs to be renovated with more hands on training, patient care, and simulation rather than BON mandated hoop jumping. I think being a CNA should be a prerequisite as well. As it stands, nursing education only prepares the student for NCLEX, not the floor, and many schools don't even do that. I could write an entirely separate post about my ideas for overhauling nursing education; maybe I will.

2 minutes ago, brownbook said:

Now you're changing your question.

Yes it is hard to get into nursing school now because there are a lot of applicants and not a lot of teachers, among other reasons.

Yes it's hard to get a job after you graduate because the nursing market is saturated.

Yes until around 2000 it was easier to find a job and go right into the speciality you wanted.

My friend persevered. Got her LVN degree, ADN degree and BSN degree. Has a great job now. It was hard and frustrating but she refused to give up.

My "generation" of nurses had it easier. But not because the educational requirements were less rigid.

Thanks for sharing.

[buckchaser10]

1 hour ago, buckchaser10 said:

Let me tell you, while I may get peeved at my fellow nurses spelling the education you receive in grade school for sentence structure would suffice for charting.

Uff da, I say that and screw up my sentence. Pretend there is another comma after spelling. I can't find the edit button.

[Wuzzie]

6 hours ago, buckchaser10 said:

Is this a typo or did the ACT used to be scored differently?

Not a typo. That's how hard it was to get in the school I went to. ACT score of 21 is average. They didn't want average. Getting in was only half the battle. Anything below a B was a fail. The rules were militant. We started with 175 students and graduated 27. They failed 3 people the last week of school. But apparently the current crop of young nurses thinks we didn't do the hard "sciency" stuff because everybody knows illness comes from not praying hard enough. ?

[NotMyProblem MSN, ASN, BSN, MSN, LPN, RN]

I’d just like to add that, interestingly enough, the NCLEX has a way of leveling the playing field. Straight-A students have failed it; barely-C students have passed it.

When I see new nurses in the break room literally crying and saying, “they didn’t tell us it would be like this”, I simply respond with “Of course not, Sweetie”; and hand them a paper towel (Kleenex is reserved for paying customers).?