Women's Right to Choose

[River&MountainRN]

I haven't seen this conversation come up on AllNurses, even after Scrubs Mag addressed the erosion of women's right to choose. I apologize if this is too much of a hot-button issue to open up for discussion, but I'm curious as to where folks on here stand when it comes to the increase in states passing restrictive abortion laws, in some cases nearly eliminating it altogether. If the mods are afraid, like I am (especially after seeing how some of the Facebook discussions devolved after Scrubs Mag posted their article there), that this can't remain a civil discussion, please feel free to take it down now. I just feel that this is an important discussion that needs to take place. After Missouri Rep. Barry Hovis spoke of the vast majority of rape being date rape and "consensual rape", Virginia State Sen. Steve Martin (R) stated "A pregnant woman is just a “host” that should not have the right to end her pregnancy", and VP Pence's comments about being "proud to be part of pro-life administration", I'm feeling increasingly disturbed about this country's lack of regard toward women.

[Persephone Paige, ADN]

7 hours ago, JadedCPN said:

Oh my goodness. Is this real life? Are you foreal? Contraceptives fail, both oral and condoms and even IUDs. It’s a small percentage, but it happens. Science backs this up. It is possible.

Science backs it up because there's no way to prove the woman is lying when she claims she used F/C for the entire rest of her cycle if she missed a pill or needed a course of antibiotics.

Like I said in the post you quoted me in:

It's amazing how OCs worked perfectly for us, the people who followed the instructions to a T and did it for a living.

Why didn't our contraceptive methods ever fail?

Why do they 'fail' for the general public?

1. Don't show up at the health dept for continuation of FREE ( or very low cost sliding scale ) birth control... And have sex anyway...

2. Forget to take a pill and don't use a back up method for remainder of cycle. And have sex anyway...

3. Use a course of antibiotics without following instructions to use a back up method for remainder of cycle. And have sex anyway...

And on and on this goes! This is a two step process in which laziness or a lackadaisical approach to birth control and making the decision to have sex anyway results in pregnancy.

Anyone with a car, insurance, money, and an average IQ should be held to even higher standards. At least the poor and unintelligent have a legitimate claim to special circumstances. But, if you can secure a ride, there is no reason to believe you have to wind up pregnant accidentally.

[Persephone Paige, ADN]

Maybe it was mentioned and I didn't see it, but what about the women who use pregnancy to get what they want from a man?

The ones who deliberately stop taking birth control and don't tell their lovers? The ones who poke holes in condoms?

It's been going on since the beginning of time. Very often neither sex has any respect for the wishes of the other. But, it doesn't support the dialog that women are the victims of everything.

Some women are victims, and I support those women. I do not blindly support women who fail to utilize their power when it counts most: prevention.

[LilPeanut, MSN, RN, NP]

8 hours ago, sswinner said:

1. If my body my choice is a thing why cant their be a legal "my money my choice"? I suppose the money would be taken from taxes as it already is.
   
2. I also dont understand why abstinence is so evil to people. Why cant you teach it as the best choice but still talk about all the others. I did not have sex till mid 20's. I am abstinent with my fiance of 2 years. Is a bit of self-control that hard? Perhaps I have low testosterone levels.

Pt 1: I agree with you fully on that. A mother can abandon the child with no consequences as long as the child is healthy, and never give any clue as to father. Maybe that father wanted the child and was more capable than she was? But no one should be responsible for a child they did not want.

Pt 2: Clearly you're religious, which is great for you. I was devout for a long time before I became an atheist (it was a process catholicism>Deism>agnostic theist>antitheism (not necessarily against churches, as long as they do no harm, but don't believe in gods, and moreso, if there becomes proof that is objective and verifiable, that gods exist with the powers ascribed to them in the stories, I do not think they are benevolent creatures. I do not believe the ends justify the means, nor that people should ever be killed as object lessons to others. So there is no possible justification of all of the murdered people in the world, the millions of jewish people and others killed in the holocaust, slavery, internment camps, inquisition, crusades, Genghis Khan, Bathory, Cromwell, Bundy, Manson family, babies drowning on purpose and by accident, babies born with their hearts, intestines, liver, and stomach outside their chests, babies who lived for months and months of tortured life, sometimes never knowing their parents' touch before they died, babies who had tortuous courses and then right before they were going to go home, die suddenly, SIDS in general, genocides in general, I mean...I can keep typing forever. No one deserves that to ever happen to them or someone they love. No one. And if a creature had the power to stop the events, but didn't, they are not a good creature that I feel is worthy of worship and following, because they do not value human life like I do.)

(Whew, that was a long explanation LOL And yes I am open to discussing my views off thread, either in a thread of its own (ask an atheist!) or via PMs. )

Please know though that you won't convert me, and I will likely make you angry if you try. ?

Anyway, it's great you believe, as long as you harm none and do not attempt to force your religious rules and morality on the populace. We have separation of church and state for a reason. Your feelings, not backed by science, is not important to how the rules should be made.

Abstinence is no sex outside of marriage, so someone who doesn't intend to get married should never be able to have sex? Your religious views do not get to determine whether I have sex. I want my children to safely have more than one partner, so they can know what they might accept as normal but isn't.

Plus, sex drive is pretty deeply ingrained. Like the urge to feel happy (even if it means chemically) It's not one you can easily beat out of yourself, without using drugs or hormones. I unfortunately know that one first hand. You're never going to be able to get people to use sex or drugs only in a responsible way, because they provide comfort to people who are not happy; happiness, if only temporary. It's not a viable solution.

[Une Infirmiere, BSN, RN]

Help! How do I unsubscribe from this thread? Please help. Thank you

PS: I am very serious ?

[Bjulissa19]

2 minutes ago, Une Infirmiere said:

Help! How do I unsubscribe from this thread? Please help. Thank you

PS: I am very serious ?

Go to your account Notification Settings. try Top Right of web-page.

[Une Infirmiere, BSN, RN]

1 minute ago, Bjulissa19 said:

Go to your account Notification Settings. try Top Right of web-page.

Thanks you Bjulissa19, this topic is getting too much all over the place to my taste. My mailbox my choice!

[NurseBlaq]

48 minutes ago, Une Infirmiere said:

Thanks you Bjulissa19, this topic is getting too much all over the place to my taste. My mailbox my choice!

???

[guest22519]

On 5/28/2019 at 9:09 PM, morte said:

your brought the claim, you bring the citations. again, the feds do not pay for elective abortions. you claimed they do, prove it.

I gave you a source, you simply choose to ignore it because you don’t agree with it.

[JadedCPN, BSN, RN]

2 hours ago, Persephone Paige said:

Science backs it up because there's no way to prove the woman is lying when she claims she used F/C for the entire rest of her cycle if she missed a pill or needed a course of antibiotics.

Like I said in the post you quoted me in:

It's amazing how OCs worked perfectly for us, the people who followed the instructions to a T and did it for a living.

Why didn't our contraceptive methods ever fail?

Why do they 'fail' for the general public?

1. Don't show up at the health dept for continuation of FREE ( or very low cost sliding scale ) birth control... And have sex anyway...

2. Forget to take a pill and don't use a back up method for remainder of cycle. And have sex anyway...

3. Use a course of antibiotics without following instructions to use a back up method for remainder of cycle. And have sex anyway...

And on and on this goes! This is a two step process in which laziness or a lackadaisical approach to birth control and making the decision to have sex anyway results in pregnancy.

Anyone with a car, insurance, money, and an average IQ should be held to even higher standards. At least the poor and unintelligent have a legitimate claim to special circumstances. But, if you can secure a ride, there is no reason to believe you have to wind up pregnant accidentally.

I am truly speechless. Wow.

I am intelligent enough to understand my IUD could fail. Not because of my socioeconomic status, not because of antibiotics, not because I forgot to do something, or that I don’t have a ride, but because birth control isn’t 100% effective.

I have worked with several colleagues who have gotten pregnant while using contraceptions because again, it is not 100% effective. Not because they did anything “wrong,” as you’re insinuating.

[kbrn2002, ADN, RN]

3 hours ago, JadedCPN said:

I am truly speechless. Wow.

I am intelligent enough to understand my IUD could fail. Not because of my socioeconomic status, not because of antibiotics, not because I forgot to do something, or that I don’t have a ride, but because birth control isn’t 100% effective.

I have worked with several colleagues who have gotten pregnant while using contraceptions because again, it is not 100% effective. Not because they did anything “wrong,” as you’re insinuating.

Exactly this. My daughter that I love dearly is living proof that contraceptives do fail. Sh'e over 30 years old now so this was quite awhile ago and before I knew anything well, about anything! I had only been dating her father for a couple of months at the time and we were nowhere deciding to start a family. My MD gave me an ABX for strep and declined to tell me it affected oral contraceptives and I never thought to ask so, long story short I ended up pregnant! While I have no problem with women that choose abortion as an option I decided it wasn't an option for me.

[Hoosier_RN, MSN]

27 minutes ago, kbrn2002 said:

Exactly this. My daughter that I love dearly is living proof that contraceptives do fail. Sh'e over 30 years old now so this was quite awhile ago and before I knew anything well, about anything! I had only been dating her father for a couple of months at the time and we were nowhere deciding to start a family. My MD gave me an ABX for strep and declined to tell me it affected oral contraceptives and I never thought to ask so, long story short I ended up pregnant! While I have no problem with women that choose abortion as an option I decided it wasn't an option for me.

This is how it should be, an independent decision for anyone who is pregnant. While I could have never done it (my babies are 32 and 27), who am I to decide what someone else should do?

[lorias]

So what circumstances would your mother have had to have for it to be ok for her to have aborted you. It's easy to pick and choose who deserves to be born and who doesn't by the ones who have already been born. Since all on this forum have taken biology and anatomy, they know that when it comes to a pregnant woman (or teenager), there are two bodies involved. And by the way, the 12 year old rape victim is such a small percentage of abortions that it is hardly worth discussing when it comes to abortion. The majority of abortions are from middle class to upper class women. Besides, why should someone have to be killed just because his or her father acted like an *** towards his or her mother. It's the rapist that needs punishing, not his child. I've heard that women who have been raped and then have an abortion say that the abortion was much worse. that's because it is not in our nature to kill our unborn children. You can call it whatever you'd like, but it's murder of the most innocent and helpless of human life. A wise man once said, "Isn't it interesting how those that are for abortion have already been born?"