Vaccination Mandating

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I'm in NY. Wonder how other NURSES are feeling about mandatory COVID vaccination?

Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
1 minute ago, JKL33 said:

Excellent. I'm glad to hear that. Sounds like you have made an assessment of the situation in your area and I will stand by my original comment as well.

Take care.

 

 

Actually I made my assessment across the whole country. That's why when I found what I was looking for it meant I had to move half way across the country. From West coast to Midwest.

   It was an excellent decision for us. 

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Specializes in Dialysis.
6 hours ago, PMFB-RN said:

Thing is, we are already making these choices. We (my hospital) have already turned away patient needing ICU beds because we don't have space thanks to the unvaxxed choosing to clog up our ICU. 

    Why is a vaccine refuser more entitled to a bed than a car crash victim? I don't know but we have already made this choice and, at least here, the unvaxxed are getting the bed and the car crash victim is having to be moved out of state (in a few cases).

    I'm not proposing to do anything we aren't already doing, that being deciding who is and isn't going to get access to a scarce resource. I'm just proposing we rethink our priorities. 

   I would never suggest we refuse to care for anyone we have the ability to care for. Why are the unvaxxed more worthy of life sustaining medical care than everyone else?

Ahhh, but you aren't refusing to care for the MVA victim, there isn't a bed. I understand your frustration, but you are making it seem like your facility is making a choice to refuse to care for the MVA victim, which isn't the case

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On 9/19/2021 at 5:46 AM, OUxPhys said:

So you are against the military mandating vaccines and public schools mandating vaccines? 

The military if your active duty pays for your housing, food, health benefits, and I believe child care. It is pretty hard to get let go, you may be reassigned. Putting your kid in school is mandatory. I would think vaccinating kids is a condition of that. A nurse who doesn't want to get vaccinated is free to seek employment elsewhere or adhere to strict exception rules.

Those rules are a pain and complicated. If someone really wants to have an exception they should have no problem following them.

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On 9/19/2021 at 12:09 PM, pclaybrooke said:

Yes I am against mandating. I have no problem with highly recommending, but mandating “or else” is taking away the ability of choice and that’s a freedom many have fought long and hard for.

I don't think mandating is all that effective. It will get some, but it will make more people resistant. People do have a choice. The vaccine marketing could of been better.

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Specializes in Emergency Department.
1 hour ago, DesiDani said:

The vaccine marketing could of been better.

I don't see what else could have been done. 

"Take the vaccine because that is the way to get out of the pandemic, it will save yourself, your family, your neighbours and your country."

Yes, there are some side effects but these are minimal and very rare. Yes there is the occasional person who gets a problem with the vaccine but not taking it can give the complication of dying."

Did I miss anything? Oh yes, "We have given 4 and a half billion vaccines so we know what is happening."

Keep it simple and keep the morons with their tin foil hats away from people.

 

ETA;

Make it a criminal offence for news purveyors to spout lies, half truths and untruths. If they say something they must back it up with verifiable facts.

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1 hour ago, GrumpyRN said:

I don't see what else could have been done. 

"Take the vaccine because that is the way to get out of the pandemic, it will save yourself, your family, your neighbours and your country."

Yes, there are some side effects but these are minimal and very rare. Yes there is the occasional person who gets a problem with the vaccine but not taking it can give the complication of dying."

Did I miss anything? Oh yes, "We have given 4 and a half billion vaccines so we know what is happening."

Keep it simple and keep the morons with their tin foil hats away from people.

 

ETA;

Make it a criminal offence for news purveyors to spout lies, half truths and untruths. If they say something they must back it up with verifiable facts.

Like I said the marketing could be better.

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
3 hours ago, Hoosier_RN said:

Ahhh, but you aren't refusing to care for the MVA victim, there isn't a bed. I understand your frustration, but you are making it seem like your facility is making a choice to refuse to care for the MVA victim, which isn't the case

We are choosing to deny the MVA victim care and choosing to care for the unvaxxed. In my opinion we should be making different choices. 

1 hour ago, GrumpyRN said:

 

Make it a criminal offence for news purveyors to spout lies, half truths and untruths. If they say something they must back it up with verifiable facts.

YES! THIS! 100%

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
12 hours ago, RETNAVYTHENMEDIC2RN said:

I think posting being replied to referred to staffing issues being fixed, not the fact that COVID is contagious. To that end, the number of DKA, COPD, CHF, etc., in the non-compliant patient category certainly DO clog up the system and are part of the problem with staffing. In my particular area, it certainly is not COVID + straining us. Returning visits by the same frequent flyers needing emergent care are the ones causing 10, 14, and 18 hour waits to be seen in the ED and then 20-40 hour waits for their admission beds. Why, they want to smoke when they have COPD. They choose to miss dialysis because their back hurts. You name the B.S. excuse, they provide it. Burn patients needing ED/ICU beds because they choose to smoke with oxygen on. In fact, this year, we actually had a patient do that TWICE. So, if we want to start limiting care due to shortages of staff, I say add these who don't follow medical guidance as well. Opens plenty of beds for trauma, MI, stroke, etc. Then we can teach the next wave of patients who will be none compliant with meds and life style changes. And the wheel continues to turn. Just my two cents, but I didn't sign up to take only the patients who followed all the rules and guidance the doctors gave them.

I've worked here 11 years. Never in all that time have we refused an ICU bed to someone in need because the ICU was full of DKA, CHF, or COPD patients. 

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
2 hours ago, DesiDani said:

I don't think mandating is all that effective. It will get some, but it will make more people resistant. People do have a choice. The vaccine marketing could of been better.

Incorrect. In fact the data shows that vaccine mandates are quite effective at getting more people vaccinated. 

 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/vaccine-mandates-are-lawful-effective-and-based-on-rock-solid-science/

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14 minutes ago, PMFB-RN said:

Incorrect. In fact the data shows that vaccine mandates are quite effective at getting more people vaccinated. 

 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/vaccine-mandates-are-lawful-effective-and-based-on-rock-solid-science/

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/dec/03/do-covid-vaccine-mandates-work

More people sure, but at a point you will reach a slag. You going to put mandate eggs only in your basket. Not everyone has to  adhere to a mandate. There are already roadblocks. Your flaring you arms wildly about the unvaccinated not going to help. People will not listen to "science says so stupid". They will listen to "It's okay I understand if you think ivermetcin will work". Yes if you have to repeats the facts over and over and over (infinity) with a forced smile on your face, you do it.

 

After all the goal is get more people vaccinated, not worry about annoying some.

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The folks that don’t want the vaccine appear to have similar reasons: freedom, came out to fast etc. and in my limited scope the mandates have worked at our facility and a very few left are in the disciplinary process and leave without pay. They always had a choice. I think it will be a risk managers nightmare to navigate the lawsuits of those who either contracted the virus in the facility or suffered greatly due to a delay of care. Lastly, due to the length of time and surges of the pandemic I think we can foresee insurance companies dropping those choosing to be unvaccinated with co-morbities. And I will always feel very sorry for those that lost their lives to covid.

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2 hours ago, DesiDani said:

I don't think mandating is all that effective. It will get some, but it will make more people resistant. People do have a choice. The vaccine marketing could of been better.

When you say mandates aren't effective, what do you mean?  Do you have access to data unavailable to public health experts?  If so, you should release it immediately.  They must be working with outdated data.  A lot of these "experts" don't even use some of the valuable information readily available on facebook. 

As far as effective marketing?  What would you like to have seen done?  Unfortunately, those advocating for public health are bound by ethical constraints not shared by the other side.  The massive marketing campaign to reduce vaccination utilized the worst fear mongering.  Believe it or not, there are actual nurses who have bought into this marketing.  As a nure, I am embarrassed.

FOX could probably get the marketing award for it's extremely effective marketing of the catastrophe we are dealing with.  While there are others in the game, they have made massive contributions to vaccination prevention effort.  What makes them so special here is that they clearly know the product they are selling is as much of a scam as the extended warranties offered by robo callers.  You think the guy behind that bought an extended warranty based on a robo-call?

Same for FOX.  While their vaccinated sales reps, Shaw, Laura, Tucker are out pushing the scam, the company itself has a more stringent policy than the one advocated by Biden.  They profit enormously from the fear and disinformation they sow, but have a business to run, and refuse to allow their own employees follow the garbage they are imposing on their gullible suckers.   Unfortunately, their marketing strategy, while extremely effective, is unethical, and public health experts are bound by principles ,not profit.

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