I'm surprised there has been no mention of the Stanford rape trial and sentence on all nurses. I'm opening up the discussion as I feel it pertains to us in many ways. One as people who may have been victims or know others who have been victims of sexual violence and two as nurses that have taken care of others in this situation, whether directly in ER or a patient suffering from PTSD with other health problems as well.
I applaud the survivor's bravery and her impact statement that has gone public. I hope this will comfort other survivors, but even more I hope this will discourage rape in general. Campus rapes are common and rapes at frats are in the news frequently. Once again a college athlete got off with just a slap on the wrist, although I don't think he counted on all the negative publicity this case has garnered.
What disturbs me the most is the letters of the parents to the judge. The father's don't punish him for 20 minutes of action. Then the mother's letter, who by the way is a nurse for gynecological surgeries and in the past as a pediatric nurse, who had not one iota of empathy for the victim. Her letter simply astonished me. I can't believe as a woman, as a nurse, as a mother of a daughter she had no empathy for the victim! This troubles me the most! I imagine in her years as a nurse she must have taken care of a rape victim and her total lack of empathy for the victim disturbs me greatly!
The way many older nurses grew up is, I see from comments here by the younger crowd generally, much different.
Baloney. I'm willing to bet the farm that there are nurses replying in this thread who are in the same ballpark as you in terms of age. Your "I'm old fashioned" defense is nothing but a smokescreen for "I am sexist and incredibly judgmental."
My point being that women can rape too. Exactly what I said in the post actually...
I guess I can expand on that and say that I was disagreeing with Ruby Vee's comment that men are causing all the problems by raping.
"Women can be rapists, too" can mean two very different things. In some contexts it is said to ensure that men who are victims are included in protections and that they are provided a safe place to acknowledge their experience, process, and heal from it. In other contexts, it is a poorly masked attempt to get women to shut up about their experience with rape.
Women can and do rape, and men can be and are victims. But the reality is that most sexual violence is perpetrated by men against women, and that male victims also frequently have a male perpetrator.
The reality is also that women who rape rarely do so by physical force, meaning little of that whole stranger-in-the-dark-in-a-bad-neighborhood "real" rape. And that men who are victimized, if they are able to be taken seriously (because unfortunately, "men can't be raped" is a common side effect of the toxic gender-based assumptions inherent to rape culture) are not subjected to the same dissection of their looks, clothing, behaviors, attitude, etc that female victims are.
To sum up: as has already been said, this observation is irrelevant to the discussion at hand.
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
That's not even close to the situation though, it assumes that rape is inevitable. A better example is that you have damn. At this damn, no one cares about the people living down river, and occasionally they open the flood gates, just because they want to.
Asking the people down river to move just because the damn controllers are selfish a**hats is like asking people to dress modestly so they don't attract the rapists.
If the people downriver knew that they occaisionally open the flood gates and knew that they were buying a home that would be flooded when that happened and bought the home anyway, they should expect to be flooded every time the damned dam controllers opened the damned floodgates for the damned dam. Asking women to dress modestly so they don't attract rapist is a whole 'nother thing. A woman ought to be able to walk naked down the street without being molested. I would expect anyone she met to see if she needs help or if she's just doing as she damned pleases.
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
I think it's actually a pretty normal fear reaction. If they admit others didn't deserve it, they admit it can happen to them. Blaming the victim allows a false safety of "I wouldn't be do something that puts myself at risk." I see similar with being a DV survivor and women going "I'd never let someone hit me"
This is a pretty good interpretation. I am a domestic violence survivor and I'm dismayed at how many people tell me that very thing. Right after they tell me that my ex- is such a NICE guy.
"Women can be rapists, too" can mean two very different things. In some contexts it is said to ensure that men who are victims are included in protections and that they are provided a safe place to acknowledge their experience, process, and heal from it. In other contexts, it is a poorly masked attempt to get women to shut up about their experience with rape.
Women can and do rape, and men can be and are victims. But the reality is that most sexual violence is perpetrated by men against women, and that male victims also frequently have a male perpetrator.
The reality is also that women who rape rarely do so by physical force, meaning little of that whole stranger-in-the-dark-in-a-bad-neighborhood "real" rape. And that men who are victimized, if they are able to be taken seriously (because unfortunately, "men can't be raped" is a common side effect of the toxic gender-based assumptions inherent to rape culture) are not subjected to the same dissection of their looks, clothing, behaviors, attitude, etc that female victims are.
To sum up: as has already been said, this observation is irrelevant to the discussion at hand.
Wow, okay, I spent six years of my life being molested by two men, so definitely not trying to shut women up about what they've suffered when I've experienced it as well.
A comment was made that men are the ones causing problems, and I made a comment back. My response may not have been relevant to the discussion as a whole, but it was relevant to THAT comment.
This whole thread has derailed into an argument that is going no where anyway so I guess I will just bite my tongue on anything else I would like to comment on for the duration.
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
Not at all what she said. Re-read, try to stop being angry and actually try to comprehend what the writer wrote.
The way many older nurses grew up is, I see from comments here by the younger crowd generally, much different.
For the past couple of generations and for today's young women, they have been and are told they can do and be whatever they want, behave as strong, independent, self-reliant people. That's good in general.
But if it includes the behaviors Conqueror mentions, it can have disastrous consequences. And she is a survivor of sexual assault/rape, so her call for being wise carries real weight.
Again, I don't know how old YOU are, Kooky, but I'm in my 60s and while I did grow up much differently than the millenials, nothing about my upbringing included being told that if I didn't dress modestly, control my alcohol intake and remain pure until marriage I deserved to be raped.
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
Women can be rapists too...
Of course they can. But the vast majority of rapists are male. And I didn't really expect anyone to take that suggestion seriously. Although if they did, it makes more sense than locking up all the females so they can't be raped.
If the people downriver knew that they occaisionally open the flood gates and knew that they were buying a home that would be flooded when that happened and bought the home anyway, they should expect to be flooded every time the damned dam controllers opened the damned floodgates for the damned dam. Asking women to dress modestly so they don't attract rapist is a whole 'nother thing. A woman ought to be able to walk naked down the street without being molested. I would expect anyone she met to see if she needs help or if she's just doing as she damned pleases.
Horseshoe, BSN, RN
5,879 Posts
Baloney. I'm willing to bet the farm that there are nurses replying in this thread who are in the same ballpark as you in terms of age. Your "I'm old fashioned" defense is nothing but a smokescreen for "I am sexist and incredibly judgmental."