Sexual harrassment or just an old creep?

[CBlover]

Ok yall so I need some insight. I've been working at my current job for almost 2 years. There is an older guy that works here, a pharmacist, in his 60s that has often chatted with me and I literally never thought anything of it. He's a very interesting individual. Used to work for the DEA part of FBI and raided drug neighborhoods and things of that sort. He was always friendly and spoke and I was friendly and spoke.

So now all of a sudden, it's dawned on me like, goodness he's down here a lot lately. Well he's coming down to my unit (ER) 4, 5, 6 times in a 12 hr shift and comes over and wants to talk. He's said "Hi beautiful" to me twice and once came up behind me a whispered really close to my face in what I consider a creepy way. He'll come down before his shift is over to say bye and talks to me like I'm his wife. It's embarrassing! My coworkers are like "Boy he's really on to you" and laugh. They'll even tell me if they see him so I can go hide somewhere. He looks for me they say, if he can't find me. I'm getting really tired of it and quite honestly I want him to go AWAY. I'm married in my 30s and am not interested dude. I am even giving him a straight face and he still isn't getting it. He said "You don't seem like yourself today. You're not as happy." Not only is it just getting old, I have work to do. what do yall think? I am overreacting??

[Julius Seizure]

Julius Seizure, it was just a gut instinct. He could be just a dirty old man or dipping into his mega stash at the pharmacy.

For some reason I am immediately imagining him having a secret cache of Viagra hidden away back in the hospital pharmacy. Secretly swapping out patient's sildenafil for aspirin so that he can have the pills for himself. Hey, narcotics aren't the only drugs that can be diverted :)

[Chrispy11, ASN, RN]

I had something similar happen with a male co-worker. My husband worked in the same place and he knew both of us. He'd come looking for me, asking co-workers where I was. It got annoying. I'm more the direct type. I asked him why he was interrupting my co-workers from their work looking for me. Then I said, I thought we were friends, this is just getting too weird and I don't like it. If you want to chat if and when I have time, fine. Just knock off the stalking.

He seemed a bit embarrassed, but I never had a problem again.

If I had to guess about the friendly pharmacist... Probably harmless. He just doesn't know he's bothering you. Tell him. It will take less time to handle it than it took me to type this out.

[Davey Do]

Okay. I might have this situation figured out. Please bear with me.

You've heard of:

Perhaps this Guy belongs to:

He could you know.

[Swellz]

For some reason I am immediately imagining him having a secret cache of Viagra hidden away back in the hospital pharmacy. Secretly swapping out patient's sildenafil for aspirin so that he can have the pills for himself. Hey, narcotics aren't the only drugs that can be diverted :)

I worked in retail as a pharmacy technician for years before nursing and all the ED meds were kept in the safe with the narcs for this very reason!

[Lunah, MSN, RN]

It should be enough, but women are socialized to believe that they should not communicate assertively or directly. I think that is changing a bit in our culture but it's still certainly the norm to be passive. All of these comments about excuses or lighthearted jokes to make are pretty disheartening to me. A man who sneaks up behind a woman and says "Hi beautiful" is a creep, and he needs to be directly told to leave you alone.

So glad I wasn't socialized in the US! I believe in the very direct approach, and not because I am married and my husband would object, but because *I* object.

The DEA/FBI story rang false. I was going to ask if he were really in the CIA...

[neonn965]

I think telling a woman "hi beautiful" in a work environment is sexual harassment. Same as if I walked up to a male co-worker and said "hi hot stuff" or something like that. Inappropriate in a professional environment.

[hppygr8ful, ASN, RN, EMT-I]

I think telling a woman "hi beautiful" in a work environment is sexual harassment. Same as if I walked up to a male co-worker and said "hi hot stuff" or something like that. Inappropriate in a professional environment.

The problem is that from a legal standpoint it does not matter what you think. The legal definition of sexual harassment does not prohibit simple teasing, offhand comments, or minor isolated incidents-that is due to the fact that they do not impose a "general civility code". Sexual harassment is defined as Unwelcome sexual advances, requests for sexual favors, and other verbal or physical conduct of a sexual nature that tends to create a hostile or offensive work environment.

This is the legal precedent. People have successfully won cases where they were fired for uncivill behavior in the form of flirting. This is why many work places illegally adopted non fraternization policies.

Hppy

[cec0007]

I've had time to read only the first three or so pages, but I agree with the posts that advise you speak more clearly to him and let him know his attentions have become excessive and inappropriate. Mention your husband and family, and then stop talking to him any longer than it takes to say you have work to do.

I would not involve management at this point, as it appears (forgive me if I'm mistaken) you haven't really directly and clearly told him that his attentions are unwelcome. People don't always "get the hint," especially if they truly have no bad intentions. Until you explicitly make your feelings known, I don't think he can be accused of sexual harassment. And as someone already advised, don't make it sound as though your only concern is what others may think. That can be taken as "I like this but we need to be more private with it." Certainly don't say your manager has said something to you that he or she has not said! Also, I wouldn't even offer to go on break with him with things as they are now. He might take that as a mixed message. (Well, other than maybe one break time to privately and clearly tell him this must stop.)

In other words, don't beat around the bush. Unfairly or not, it's on you to address the matter with him now. You can be polite and even kind, and still clearly make it known to him that this is inappropriate and must stop, or you can't even be friends.

That might come as a total shock to him, or it might not, but either way it needs to happen. I'm sorry you're having to deal with it, btw, and understand your dilemma in dealing with an old friend.

[CocoBug20]

I think telling a woman "hi beautiful" in a work environment is sexual harassment. Same as if I walked up to a male co-worker and said "hi hot stuff" or something like that. Inappropriate in a professional environment.

Most people wouldn't think of it like that old men using inappropriate endearments are 'just being friendly' and 'grew up in a different environment'..........old ladies doing the same are considered predatory and embarrassing. I think people need to ask themselves more..if a woman was treating a man like this, would I be comfortable with it?

[Julius Seizure]

Most people wouldn't think of it like that old men using inappropriate endearments are 'just being friendly' and 'grew up in a different environment'..........old ladies doing the same are considered predatory and embarrassing. I think people need to ask themselves more..if a woman was treating a man like this, would I be comfortable with it?

A doctor once walked up to me and said "hey beautiful". It made me really uncomfortable and I thought that it was inappropriate.

[Libby1987]

This must be a cultural thing :) I'm Scandinavian and right now I literally look like this ---> after reading all the posts offering similar advice.

I've been married, have had a couple of other serious relationships and right now I'm in a longterm relationship. I have never once thought to use a husband or a partner as an excuse or reason for attempting to stave off unwanted attention.

Why isn't it enough to say that you don't want the attention or that you aren't interested? Does one really need to use a partner as a "support structure" to give ones wishes more weight? What a person wants for themselves matters, all on its own. No added "legitimizer" required.

If married women should mention their husbands when they're faced with unwanted amorous or sexual attention, who should single people use as a "fortifier" when they try to ward off unwelcome attention? They of course have as much right to not be subjected to it as a married person has. I'm assuming we all agree that married status isn't the only legitimate protection against creeps and sexual harrassment?

In my opinion people need to learn to speak up for themselves and women in particular I think, sometimes struggle with making demands for themselves and laying down the rules.

Again I'm not an American, but do pharmacists actually participate in raids? Here that's the job of law enforcement officers and the pharmacists gets to sift through whatever stuff in the form of pills, powders, iv meds etc. that was seized during the raid. They generally get to do that in a nice and calm environment, like a lab.

Anyway... That's not what you came here asking for advice about.

If a dude did that to me, I would definitely assume that his interest in me goes beyond that of a coworker. In my former career I used to be the lone female in a group of a couple of dozen men. They weren't in the habit of leaning in real close and whispering non-workrelated stuff. If they had, I would have thought them a bit strange and told them so. And we actually trained together, weightlifting, cardio and practising various self-defense techniques, for about ten hours every week. So we got physically very close when it was warranted but at other times they were aware of and respected my personal space.

I honestly have no idea whether the specific scenario that you've described is motivated from a place of "creepiness" or if he thinks that it's appealing and perhaps that you find it acceptable/are interested in him.

It's hard to offer advice when you don't have access to all the details and haven't had the opportunity to gauge this person for yourself. But for me personally, if something similar happened to me, I'd just tell him clearly and firmly that I don't want him to lean in so close, that I prefer to be called by my name and that three to four visits per shift is over the top (or whatever you happen to feel).

in your case, only you can decide if what you want from him is that he gives you bit more personal space and stops with the beautiful & whispering parts, but that you're still okay with talking to him every now and then OR if you want the visits to stop altogether.

If you know that it's safe for you to do, then whatever you feel is the desired outcome for you, is what I think needs to be clearly articulated to him.

In my experience it's possible to be firm and direct without being mean. It allows the other person to save face in case their interest is benign and they just enjoy your company, but it's generally also a good first step in case this needs to be escalated to HR or further, in the future.

Since I haven't met the man in question I can't know if he's 100% benign or if he has some predatory tendencies. Whatever you decide to do, please be mindful of your own safety!

Best wishes OP!

Edit:

Many people aren't great face readers. It's not generally an effective method of communication. When you imagine that you're clearly telegraphing a specific message, that might be completely missed or misinterpreted by another person. Words are better.

You said early in your post that he's a "very interesting individual". He might not be aware that you now feel that the attention is too much and not wanted.

Totally agree, be kind, direct and don't use your husband as the reason his behavior needs to change.

[CBlover, BSN, RN]

A doctor once walked up to me and said "hey beautiful". It made me really uncomfortable and I thought that it was inappropriate.

Exactly. I do not agree that in any fashion is it "a term of endearment" as some have suggested when a male calls a female coworker "beautiful."

To follow up, word must have gotten to him. I have not seen him but maybe twice since I posted originally, and when I do he is extremely quick about his work and goes on his way. I think I told enough coworkers and they noticed it themselves and something was said to him. So problem solved. Thanks y'all for all the advice!!