I have a vent about coworkers who have kids playing the "Kid Card," by claiming that they have to come in late sometimes, need more sick time, or that it isn't as bad to call out, when compared to workers who don't have kids. Now, I have a child myself, but I have never felt that it entitled me to special treatment at work.
Lately, some coworkers have been calling out, coming late, or leaving work early. They claim that since they have kids, it's "expected" that this should happen, and that the NH should be more understanding, and that they should not be written-up. Also, they argue that they should get preference for holidays off over workers without kids. (I know this is a big concern around Christmas.) I feel that all workers should abide by the same attendance rules, and that nurses and CNAs who have kids should not, on that basis alone, be "allowed" to come to work late, or have more sick time. What do you all think?
If I have to stay over 10 minutes to cover for someone who can't get their kids to day care or if I get called in on my day off because someone didn't have a contingency plan for an illness with their child, it pretty much ticks me off.
My time is just as important to me; my holidays are just as important to me. Every minute I have to cover for someone because of their kids is a minute I sacrifice with my own family (it's a minute I could be making a baby with my own husband.)
At my particular institution, it feels - from my childless point of view - like things have gone beyond trying to be flexible towards the working parent towards almost punishing the childless individual. At my institution, parents get to:
come in at 8:00, instead of 6:45, in order to take their kids to school.
take 1.5 hour lunches, so they can pick their kids up from school and deliver them to day care (childless people get 30 minutes)
take personal calls at work (even if it's not in relation to their children) without being reprimanded
call in sick for their children's illnesses without incurring any punitive repercussions (the childless earn a point for every sick call - 12 points and you're fired)
randomly remove themselves from the schedule without finding a replacement nurse for that shift (no one else is allowed to do this)
if they are breast feeding, take 4-5 20 minute breaks through out the day to pump (even though non lactaters get NO breaks besides lunch)
store their personal breast milk in our staff food fridge, even though we have a dedicated breast milk freezer and fridge just because the breast feeders find it more convenient and don't want to share with the patients (never mind that some of the non breast feeders find it gross to have someone's bodily fluids next to our food.)
So my understanding and empathy for parents is pretty darn limited at the moment. After all, no one forced you to either have children or choose hospital nursing for your line of work. Why should I have to work harder or longer just because of your choices? Honestly, if I'm late because I was out partying the night before or call in sick because I have a hang over, I imagine your sympathy me is pretty much nil, right?
I think that some of those are valid complaints while the others are not. For instance, staff and patient breastmilk should be stored separately. Is their BM not in a cooler or bag?
I know that I work pediatrics and our BM fridge is rarely used because we are a small unit, so I always used it - except when a patient used it. Then, I moved it to the staff fridge in my little black cooler, and no one even knew because it was so discreet. Unless people are making a big deal about what it is, then they will probably never know.
I do think that breastfeeders should have at least 4 breaks in a 12 hour period... it is stupid that you are lucky to get a lunch break to pump IF you are LUCKY!!! My 15 minute breaks! Ha! I could barely let down in the amount of time it took the set up, let down, and the stop... I would get like one ounce. Then, I would have to clean up my supplies and workstation (I would have to use an empty patient room)... I would still try though. Our 15 minute breaks at our facility are not mandated but are "if time allows". Therefore, most of the time "time did not allow" and I did not get to pump. I suffered and so did my child. I would like to see child and mother friendly legislation come through to allow this, and I think that we would see the health of our babies and mothers both get better because of this. As a nurse who works peds, nursery and NICU I think you should agree as well. Maybe someday!!
I remember going home at night, not having pumped for 8 hours, not having peed, eaten, or drank at all - running a temp - because my coworkers were too busy for me to pump. it was not nice for me not to get my break but they got to smoke!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That should not have happened. You're lucky you didn't get mastitis or a UTI. Most mothers spend a relatively small part of their working years pumping; it should not be a big deal for moms to excuse themselves to pump. And for nurses not to have time to pee or eat, well that's another thread .
We have a lot of nursing moms and pumping is just considered part of the day. If their roommate is too busy to watch the babies, the charge nurse will come in or find someone who has the time. After all, this is something that only the mom is able to do for her baby :). Of course, I work in the NICU and it would be a little hypocritical to encourage moms to bf if we didn't make the same allowance for the nurses.
I don't think parents should be able to pull the "I've got kids" card just to make life easier for themselves, but if we don't have a working environment where we can support people in all stages of life--moms who need to pump, dads who need to call in because a child is sick, nurses who need to work half-shifts because their health doesn't allow 12 hour days--then we are hurting all of us.
i don't think parents should be able to pull the "i've got kids" card just to make life easier for themselves, but if we don't have a working environment where we can support people in all stages of life--moms who need to pump, dads who need to call in because a child is sick, nurses who need to work half-shifts because their health doesn't allow 12 hour days--then we are hurting all of us.
the above qoute sums up what the bottom line of this discussion should be. won't it be a glorious day if people see the light and it becomes reality? unfortunately, i don't forsee it happening in my lifetime.
i think part of the problem is that people use the terms fair and equal interchangeably. they're not the same. fair is allowing everyone some flexibility. equal is offering the same thing to everyone regardless of one's individual needs.
I think part of the problem is that people use the terms fair and equal interchangeably. They're not the same. Fair is allowing everyone some flexibility. Equal is offering the same thing to everyone regardless of one's individual needs.
i agree.
equal = objective
fair = subjective
in the world of business, decisions need to be made w/equal consideration.
that's just the way it is.
letting someone pump breastmilk would be equally as warranted as a single person needing to care of a sick pet or family member.
what we allow for one, we need to allow for all...
Definitely. It shouldn't be a problem either as long as it's not abused. Unfortunately, there's always a bad apple that takes advantage and the whole class has to be punished. We wouldn't want to be accused of discrimination or favoritism, would we? It seems like these people (and we all work with or have worked with at lease one) are the same ones that whine that they're being "picked-on."
I do think that breastfeeders should have at least 4 breaks in a 12 hour period...
Well, since on my unit, the non-breast feeders don't even usually get LUNCH, I guess I need to force myself to lactate just to get a break.
I'm sorry, but even as a pedi, NICU, and current PICU nurse, I just can't agree that breast feeding mothers should get 4 15-minute breaks, plus lunch, per shift especially when the rest of the staff aren't getting ANY breaks. That's just ridiculous to me. Perhaps the rest of us should take up smoking in order to rank enough privilege to be granted a break now and then ...
For instance, staff and patient breastmilk should be stored separately
Why? This makes no sense to me. We only have one nurse who insists on keeping her milk in our staff fridge, much to the disgust of several of her co-workers. The rest of our many, many lactaters store their milk in the dedicated breast milk freezer or fridge without any problem. We also have one who chooses to store her milk in a cooler rather than keep it in the patient fridge or in the staff fridge, which I think is very considerate. I'm just a tad turned off by the idea of having someone else's bodily fluid's stored next to my lunch, and I happen to think that my opinion about it should be as valid as any other of my co-workers.
When I didn't have children I did work every Christmas, and I didn't really mind. I also covered for others and came in if they had call outs. I never called out.
Now that I have children, they come first. I don't feel entitled to anything, but I don't feel guilty trying to arrange my schedule as it works best for my family. I figure when they get to be adults, I'll probably go back to working Christmas, etc. Since I've been in healthcare for 17 years already and my oldest is only 9, it'll all be even in the end.
I work at a place that is very accomodating as to schedules and times. We have Nurses and CNAs who go to school and have to leave early. We have employees who have to be home to get their kids off the bus. We have some that leave a little earliar because the bus doesn't come after their shift is done at 11:30pm When I said I needed Mondays off , we worked it out. Major reason I still work there. Ask any worker anywhere how much flexibility means to their happiness. I bet they value it more than the $!
Oh, and I think its a good idea to try and help out your co-workers when they need a break for breastfeeding or anything else. If your not into it for altruistic purposes, at the very least they'll have your back when you need it.
I don't mind if people who have kids need to leave early or call in if their child is sick as long as they respect my time and understand that just because I don't have children doesn't mean I don't have people I love that I would like to spend time with off work. I had a job once where I was the only person who didn't have children and basically their view was that their time was more valuable than mine. I even had one woman tell me that I should arrange my schedule around theirs since I didn't have anything else to do when I was off work (her words.) I do have a social life and enjoy seeing my husband from time to time. Another woman even complained about me because I took off to go to my uncle's funeral.....the week before I worked two days for her because her kids were sick, never made that mistake again. I think the key is equal treatment and consideration for all people and not those who have children, we all have family and outside commitments. I understand someone with children requesting holidays off but don't expect me to always cover and think my holidays off aren't as valuable.
My biggest complaint is extra consideration for smokers. Both my husband and I have had jobs where no one could take breaks because it was too busy but smokers always got breaks no questions asked. One job I had I would get questioned for getting a drink of water down the hall but smokers could sit outside for up to an hour at a time several times a day and that was perfectly fine.
My 4 children are all grown now but, I never in my life missed a day of work due to a child being ill. I used private babysitters that took them even when they were ill. I guess I was lucky.
As an employer, I do not make allowances if your child is ill. We have a strict attendance policy. Three absences and it's a verbal warning, 5 absences and it's a 1st written, 7 absences and it's a 2nd written, 8 and it's a suspension, and any more and it's termination.
I do have some employees that have children with chronic medical conditions. They have FMLA papers in place and when that child gets sick, they go to the doctor and the absence is covered.
In the medical field, these patients, residents, clints pay dearly to have the help they need and deserve. If you can not be there when expected, then maybe you are in the wrong field of work.
While it's true that those without dependent obligations should not be "dumped on", just wondering how many good bedside nurses we lose because the work does not agree with family life and obligations. Let's not forget all the nurses who have elderly parents to take care of- I know a few who struggle so they can get mom/dad to their appointments. A great nurse I worked with came to work each night, worried sick about her dad she had to leave at home (had Alzheimer's) while she came to work. It really took a toll on her. I think if we want to keep good nurses in the profession, our workplaces need to provide the support we need. How many places out there have sick child care? How many places offer on-site day care- including "off" shifts? I mentioned sick child care here once and got laughed at.
While it's true that those without dependent obligations should not be "dumped on", just wondering how many good bedside nurses we lose because the work does not agree with family life and obligations. Let's not forget all the nurses who have elderly parents to take care of- I know a few who struggle so they can get mom/dad to their appointments. A great nurse I worked with came to work each night, worried sick about her dad she had to leave at home (had Alzheimer's) while she came to work. It really took a toll on her. I think if we want to keep good nurses in the profession, our workplaces need to provide the support we need. How many places out there have sick child care? How many places offer on-site day care- including "off" shifts? I mentioned sick child care here once and got laughed at.
I quit a job once (I wasn't a nurse back then, but a CNA) because when I applied for the job in June of that year, I requested Thanksgiving off. I was throwing the family reunion, and I knew I would never see some of these people again. Well, sure enough, they tried to make me work Thanksgiving despite repeated assurances that I would have it off.
I quit that day and have never regretted it.
I choose any job based on how good a fit their needs and mine are. But when push comes to shove? Family first. After all, I can always get another job.
Also, they argue that they should get preference for holidays off over workers without kids. (I know this is a big concern around Christmas.) I feel that all workers should abide by the same attendance rules, and that nurses and CNAs who have kids should not, on that basis alone, be "allowed" to come to work late, or have more sick time. What do you all think?
. 
.thumb.jpg.6eeb2c01c27cfd151d706238b7f6d6b7.jpg){kind=small}
jeepgirl, LPN, NP
851 Posts
I think that some of those are valid complaints while the others are not. For instance, staff and patient breastmilk should be stored separately. Is their BM not in a cooler or bag?
I know that I work pediatrics and our BM fridge is rarely used because we are a small unit, so I always used it - except when a patient used it. Then, I moved it to the staff fridge in my little black cooler, and no one even knew because it was so discreet. Unless people are making a big deal about what it is, then they will probably never know.
I do think that breastfeeders should have at least 4 breaks in a 12 hour period... it is stupid that you are lucky to get a lunch break to pump IF you are LUCKY!!! My 15 minute breaks! Ha! I could barely let down in the amount of time it took the set up, let down, and the stop... I would get like one ounce. Then, I would have to clean up my supplies and workstation (I would have to use an empty patient room)... I would still try though. Our 15 minute breaks at our facility are not mandated but are "if time allows". Therefore, most of the time "time did not allow" and I did not get to pump. I suffered and so did my child. I would like to see child and mother friendly legislation come through to allow this, and I think that we would see the health of our babies and mothers both get better because of this. As a nurse who works peds, nursery and NICU I think you should agree as well. Maybe someday!!