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Nursing Student From Hell

Posted

You are reading page 3 of Nursing Student From Hell. If you want to start from the beginning Go to First Page.

If the claims are real and true about this student.

Guys and gals, failing will not do her any good. What I think she truly needs is a new brain! :wideyed:

Is this a bit harsh, no? :wacky:

Edited by Ben_Dover

NurseCard, ADN

Specializes in Med/Surge, Psych, LTC, Home Health. Has 13 years experience.

The only part of your post that I have just SOME issue with... before

you went into the room with Alice to admit that patient, did she know

what was expected of her? Did she know she would be doing the

entire admit? Starting the IV? Was she okay with it? Did you make

sure she would be comfortable?

I mean, I understand the whole gist of your post, but... shew I'm

with a couple of other posters... after 13 years, this girl still HATES

starting IV's on most patients, and if put on the spot about starting

one, there are times when I will STILL shrink like a violet.

Other than that, I get what you are saying, I do. I vote to let

her do the rest of her preceptorship, make her fully aware that

her passing grade is on the line, and see how she does. Maybe

she will redeem herself?

Unlike some others have mentioned, my final rotation in school years ago was similar to what you described, just on a different unit. Towards the end I assumed my preceptor's entire patient load, I started many IV's, etc, and essentially functioned independently like I would be required to do at an actual job after graduation. My preceptor stood back and only assisted if needed, and we were largely expected to function with minimal assistance.

All of my rambling is just to say that your student is not functioning in the capacity required to pass. It's a difficult decision, but I get the impression that as her preceptor you already know this. It sounds like you've gone to great lengths to help her, so I hope you don't blame yourself.

It's not her future employer's responsibility to teach her basic nursing skills and motivation, and for this reason she should fail.

ETA: At this late stage, I doubt that there's anything that she can do to prove to you that she is a safe, prudent nurse, and to prove to you that she's mastered the required skills, has obtained the necessary knowledge base, or even has the needed motivation to care for patients who are relying on her.

Edited by saskrn
I forgot to finish my thought. Too tired!

I'm a little surprised at all the fail her posts. She's a student. A student. I feel like some of you have way high expectations of students.

Have you asked why she is hiding? It could be she just doesn't feel comfortable. Also, since you decide whether she passes or fails, have you clearly laid out your expectations? Do you interact with her outside of the room? Try to bring down her nerve level a little?

I always try try to find out a little about my students and I tell them a little about me. I get our conversation going so they aren't a bundle of nerves. It helps us work together better and even though they really can't do anything, they help with turns and some oral care.

You have every right right to fail her, but realize you are failing her and she may or may not get a another chance and this will affect her life in a big way. It's very difficult to get into other programs and it may very well be the end of her career. I just don't feel a few hours a week as a student is indicative of how safe of a nurse they will be. I would most certainly not give a recommendation if she were to ask for it and I would discuss my concerns with her, but fail????

pixierose, BSN, RN

Specializes in ED, psych. Has 4 years experience.

Reading through more of the posts ...

I still stand by my original statement: a failing grade.

Maybe because school is still so fresh in my mind, and the fear is still very real ... again, like I stated before, learning new skills can be intimating. Hiding sounded pretty good sometimes (esp. with trach care, my kryptonite). Being a new grad, on a new floor, it's still damn scary!

But ... YOU DO IT! This isn't a new nursing student. This is an almost new grad! Why are we giving this special snowflake so much leniency? I'm sorry if this sounds harsh; however, this student completely knows the responsibilities more often than not, they have been stated in the beginning of this semester (and semesters prior). Gone over during her midterm evaluation. OP herself seems pretty organized, giving her handouts/readings on policies/topics/etc to prepare for next time. Many students don't even get this of which the OP is providing (at least, I didn't).

It sounds like this student really lucked out in getting the OP. She's missing a great opportunity to learn. Confidence (or lack thereof) ... it doesn't matter. It's time to buck up.

This student is learning something alright; that she can disappear when the going gets "tough" and not face the penalty.

SmilingBluEyes

Specializes in Specializes in L/D, newborn, GYN, LTC, Dialysis. Has 24 years experience.

If she is hiding out as a student, what can we expect as a nurse? You can't just hide out when the going gets tough. That is my biggest concern here. That and if she IS lazy, that won't do either.

Maybe, you should let the above concerns guide you on what to do. I don't see a lot of redeeming value in this person as a nurse, if everything you say is accurate, OP.

Otherwise others have pretty much said it all; won't rehash or pile on.

NICU Guy, BSN, RN

Specializes in NICU. Has 6 years experience.

I'm a little surprised at all the fail her posts. She's a student. A student. I feel like some of you have way high expectations of students.

She is a senior student that is a few months away from graduation. This is not her first clinical. She needs to be held to the standard of a new grad hire. The expectations of a senior Capstone student is to be engaged in the clinical, ask for oportunities to increase her knowledge, attempt all skills ask for by the preceptor, be at the hip of the preceptor at all times, and by the completion of the final clinical- be able to independently care for a patient.

Have you asked why she is hiding? It could be she just doesn't feel comfortable. Also, since you decide whether she passes or fails, have you clearly laid out your expectations? Do you interact with her outside of the room? Try to bring down her nerve level a little?

She is hiding because that is what she has always done in group clinicals. The problem is that this is a one-to-one clinical and it is difficult for it to go unnoticed. She stated that she clearly laid out her expectations. The student "claimed" to have went to the bathroom and couldn't find the preceptor- BS. If she had told the preceptor that she is going to the bathroom and came back promptly, it would not have been a problem. The problem is that she told no one where she was going and then claimed she couldn't find her, so she hid somewhere. It is hard to believe that if she asked any of the other nurses, they wouldn't have a clue where the OP was.

My assumption is that since she is student and not a nurse you feel there are no expectations and she can hide out instead of participating in the clinical. Even if there were no defined expectations, she is an adult and should take it upon herself to learn as much as possible.

Pixie.RN, MSN, RN

Specializes in EMS, ED, Trauma, CNE, CEN, CPEN, TCRN. Has 13 years experience.

OP, is there any way that her instructor from school can drop in for a visit during these last shifts?

I would alert your student that she is on thin ice and needs to shine.

"Failing to fail" is a real phenomenon in nursing schools across the country. No one enjoys failing students, it is difficult and everyone suffers in the process; but we have to ensure that patients are going to be safe and cared for, and there are a lot of red flags here (namely the hiding). Just because a student has made it to practicum/capstone or whatever the school calls it does not mean they were stellar in their other clinicals.

OP, I am sorry you signed up for what you thought would be a nice swan song. It's clear that this is distressing to you, I suspect because you already know what you need to do. But it's the student who passes or fails, we don't just inflict it on them. Good luck!!

NICU Guy, BSN, RN

Specializes in NICU. Has 6 years experience.

OP, I'm not going to weigh in on whether or not the student should pass/fail her preceptorship; you are the only one that has spent enough time with her and has the full knowledge of the situation. I can appreciate that you are using us as a sounding board to work through the seriousness of the decision you're trying to make.

What I want to tell you is this: there are presently a couple of posters on your thread that have/will have you scratching your head wondering how they've read so much into the situation and have the opinions they do. I would suggest (if you have the time or inclination) that you read through some of those posters' previous posts as it may help give you some clarity of their thinking/online personalities. It may help you decide how much time you want to spend considering their opinions and advice.

Best wishes.

and this is why we have the "special" snowflakes.

Rose_Queen, BSN, MSN, RN

Specializes in OR, education. Has 16 years experience.

OP, is there any way that her instructor from school can drop in for a visit during these last shifts?

This was standard during my capstone- the instructor had to drop in at least 4 times. We were asked questions just like we would have been in a normal clinical with an instructor. Concerns were addressed.

Rose_Queen, BSN, MSN, RN

Specializes in OR, education. Has 16 years experience.

I'm a little surprised at all the fail her posts. She's a student. A student. I feel like some of you have way high expectations of students.

And I think you're not getting that this student is near graduation and should be held to high standards. A student doesn't stay a student forever; expectations become higher as more classes are completed. A student in the last semester with a one on one preceptorship should be nearing new grad expectations.

AceOfHearts<3

Specializes in Critical care.

My first thought was fail- not because she is scared or hesitant to perform tasks, but because she is going AWOL. There is really no reason for her to not be soaking it all in.

I think a very blunt conversation needs to be had with a written contract that she signs stating the goals/objective of the next 4 clinical days. This will CYA and make it perfectly clear to the student what she needs to do in order to have a chance at passing.

NicuGal, MSN, RN

Specializes in NICU, PICU, PACU. Has 30 years experience.

Yes, she's a student who will be graduating soon! I have taken on capstone students and the expectation is that we treat them like a new grad and they are expected to be able to function somewhat independently by the end. This is a student who most likely will be looking for a job on your unit. This girl has some issues. That student should be glued to her preceptor, it is NOT her preceptor's job to be hunting her down all shift to remind her of what she needs to be doing.

And four shifts is not enough time to "redeem" herself. She obviously has not picked up skills and shirks her duty. Four shifts, not enough time.

I stick with fail her.

DowntheRiver

Specializes in Urgent Care, Oncology. Has 7 years experience.

Wish you had been my preceptor.

I mean, my preceptor was great, and by the time I was done I was able to care for 4 patients on my own with minimal to no assistance. But she never stayed late with me or gave me articles!

I wouldn't want her as my nurse. Its your responsibility to make sure patients are safe once she goes out into the real world. If you dont work, you dont pass.

CelticGoddess, BSN, RN

Specializes in Palliative, Onc, Med-Surg, Home Hospice. Has 6 years experience.

I'm a little surprised at all the fail her posts. She's a student. A student. I feel like some of you have way high expectations of students.

I am thankful my school had such high expectations. My preceptorship I was expected to do anything allowed by my school and the facility. That meant, at least attempting IV starts, passing meds, IV meds (no chemo, obviously, no blood per state law), assessments (though I was not allowed to chart them). I did my preceptorship on a critical care unit (bone marrow transplant), and I took advantage of that opportunity.

What the student did in the OP is not acceptable. The student brought this on herself. Not the nurse precepting her. She is weeks or a couple of months at most shy of graduation. I don't know about anyone else, but nothing magical happened to me when I graduated from nursing school that made me more knowledgable about nursing care than when I was still in my practicum. And nothing magical happened when I passed my boards, except that I was now legally a nurse. I knew the same amount that I did when I finished my practicum.

The student is digging her own grave. Should she fail out and not be able to continue, that is on her, not the nurse precepting her. She needs to be held to professional standards. Yes, even as a student.

Ruby Vee, BSN

Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching. Has 40 years experience.

Expectations have been discussed multiple times with her. The biggest issue is that she just laughs it off when you call her out on disappearing. So I'm walking in to go push with the patient and I saw her in an empty room opening a can of bleach wipes (she later told me she was in the bathroom) but I didn't have time to call her because the patient was about the birth. Later when we had a chance to talk and I said "why did charge have to come find you when our patient was complete and pushing?" she laughs and says "oh I was in the bathroom and didn't know where you were. If I had known where you were I would have been there." I was in our room for almost an hour before she finally showed up.

Failing someone is a difficult thing to do. But you've discussed the issues and there's been no improvement, so fail her you must.

Here.I.Stand, BSN, RN

Specializes in SICU, trauma, neuro. Has 16 years experience.

from LovingLife123: "I'm a little surprised at all the fail her posts. She's a student. A student. I feel like some of you have way high expectations of students."

Quote button not working at the moment.

She's not in her first clinical. (Not that hiding is EVER ok). She is in her final practicum. She has finished the classroom portion of nursing school, and has finished her clinicals.

In my practicum (in fall 2002), I worked my way up to managing an entire med-tele assignment by myself, with my preceptor in the wings for guidance. I did all of the tasky things like placing IVs, med administration, and chart checking. I did discharge teaching with my preceptor present (obviously can't discharge someone without an actual nurse present), I checked labs and told my preceptor what I thought about the abnormals. I even had the required pt-related conversations with the drs. Again with my preceptor present, but she was silent as long as I was providing the required info.

Someone days from graduation (4 remaining shifts = days away) has NO business disappearing and declining the offer of practice that she hasn't had. Really, if she'd never inserted an IV yet, why would she NOT be all over it?? I get it's intimidating, but how is watching the RN do them going to get HER competent?

But the disappearing/hiding? Inexcusable. Her presence is a VERY reasonable expectation.

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