Nurses Eating Their Young- A Different Perspective

[Kyrshamarks]

Nurses eat their young. It happens and people complain about it like it is a bad thing. It may be in your eyes if you are the one being eaten, but in my eyes I am going to eat you alive and spit out your bones into something that resembles a nurse. You are entering the cauldron of fire, so expect to get singed.

That above statement is already setting some of you on edge. I understand that and I accept that. I felt the same way at first, but as the years have passed by I have learned why we do it and more importantly, the reason. Let me explain to you why in a way that is not nursing.

Imagine if you are a soldier ... Lets take it from there

1. Patient = fire team
2. Pilot = Nurse Practitioner
3. Officers = management
4. Your squad mates = your fellow nurses with more experience
5. Enemy = death
6. MD = (sometimes the enemy) a fellow service member form another branch

You enlisted in the service, you passed basic training (nursing school) and now you are ready to join your unit. ( I know I skipped AIT, for those military among us) You show up on the bus all excited and happy to be chosen for this special unit. It is everything you wanted, it is just where you wanted to be. Great, happy to have you aboard, now get out the salt and pepper, or maybe the opposite is true. You do not want to be here, but rather this is the only place you could get to right now.

Fine, get out the salt and pepper

Be prepared to be eaten. I am your new squad Sargent. I am there to help you get acclimated to the unit and the patrols as FAST AS I CAN. You show up in your new shiny uniforms, new boots and the new weapons (ie: stethoscope, tablet, etc) and look around you and see the older squad mates' uniforms are faded, they may even be a bit tattered, our combat boots may not be shiny, heck they may even be a bit soiled. But you know what, to us your uniform looks uncomfortable on you and those ugly boots we are wearing, they are like a second skin to us and those new ones you got are going to blister your feet. We accept that and realize that with age your boots are going to get broken in and your uniform will fade. Just don't point out to us how yours is better or newer. New does not always mean better, sometimes our weapons that you think are old and stupid are the ones that never fail in combat. You start out like that and I will eat you so hard right there that you will wish you were never born. Your old Drill instructors (nursing instructors) have nothing on me in making you feel small if I choose to.

I introduce you to your squad mates and I show you around

I know you are new and do not know where everything is, but LISTEN to me when I am talking to you and pointing things out. I know it is a lot of information to digest, but it may save your life and your fire mission's life if you listen. I expect you to ask me questions, but think about the question first. Did I already answer it? Did I not just show you where the supply tent was? Did I not point out where to keep your gear? Did I not show you how to reload your gun or program in the fire coordinates on the fire control computer? I probably did and if you keep asking I am going to start to wonder about you and think maybe you are going to get me killed or the fire team killed.

Time for your first patrol

The officers come by and gives us our mission. We need to work as a team to complete it, there are no Rambos in our unit. Accept the mission, I will be there to help guide you and keep you alive, for now. I do not want the fire mission to fail at all costs. When I feel you are strong enough to do more of the mission on your own, I am going to let you, whether you think you are not.

So now we go into the field for combat against the enemy. I know you learned all these supposedly fancy new ways of combating them, but the enemy doesn't always react the way you were taught it would. Things are different in the field, than in the classroom. Don't tell me how to do something unless I am asking you how it is done the new way. Listen to me how to set up an ambush. I have been fighting these battles many years and I am still alive. Don't look above at the pilots flying around doing their thing while we are in the trenches and say you would rather be there. It takes time to learn to fly, and I skin you and filet you alive if you think you are better than the rest of your squad mates. If you express an interest in learning to fly, I will be happy to help you get to the point you can learn to fly. I want all my squad mates to succeed, because the fire mission will then succeed.

I am going to jump on you during the training I give you, I am going to eat you up, I am going to speak bad of you, I am going to report on you to the officers. I will make your life miserable for a while. I may not let you take lunch with your buddies from basic who are now in an another unit in your command. They may have their own mission to conduct, or our mission is going badly. Sometimes I may make you work extra hard helping another soldier out, who is up to their butt in crocodiles. I am also going to praise you when you need it, but don't count on it very often. I am going to ride your butt so hard, you are going to wonder why you even enlisted. You are going to think I am unfair, that I am trying to get you killed, that I am giving you too big of missions at times, but know this. AT ALL COSTS THE FIRE TEAM MUST DO THEIR BEST! Sometimes we don't win all the battles and death does come for the mission. we accept that and expect you to accept it and pick yourself up and carry on soldier. The time to grieve is later in private when it fails, but know this; we old eat their young and are also grieving about the loss, but realize there are other missions we are needed on at that moment.

My Goal

My goal in eating you up is to toughen you up so that you may lead other soldiers in combat and save the fire missions, maybe even help you get to be a pilot or an officer, which not all of us want. Some of us were previous officers but decided we liked the trenches with the blood and guts and muck better. My goal is to see you succeed and carry on our legacy and eventually replace me when I fall. Which one day I will fall and become a distant memory. Until that moment I am going to eat you up and spit out your bones into proud strong self reliant Nurse. That is why eating our young is not a bad thing.

Related topics...

Why Do Nurses Eat Their Young?

Nurses Eating Their Young Is Not Okay

Watch WHY Nurses Eat Their Young?! My Story video...

[SmilingBluEyes]

Personally, I don't like getting eaten by younger nurse, myself...(YES---- GASP, THIS HAPPENS!!! Happened to me with my last preceptee...ugh...).

It's kinda simple. I teach others how to treat me. And being nasty/mean/****** or you-name-it is not going to bring positive results. Being tough? Yes. I do that. When I precept, I am tough after they (new nurses) have been with me a bit and about ready to hit the floor on their own. I throw everything I got at them and keep on them to get it done because I know when they hit the floor, it will tough, and it will be coming at them hard. But I remain a safety net and try to be someone they are not afraid to approach when they have trouble or questions.

Been on the receiving end of some vicious new nurse-eating when I started out 17 years ago. Remember it vividly. Can't say I liked it. I had stomach pains every day before I went to work. Made me more determined than ever to remember how it felt and not to perpetrate it on others......But I did not whine either. I hung tough, got smart and kept my nose clean. This earned the respect of my coworkers and the "eating" stopped.

That's right: I don't have to be mean to get a point across. I just don't. And I can't sleep at night if I am mean. I have acted out of frustration or temper at times, and EVERY TIME, I ate a bit of crow and apologized. That was the only way I could live with myself. I hate eating crow, so to avoid it, I try to treat my coworkers, new/old and in-between how I would like to be treated.

What a concept.

Oh, and I was military, so I have comparison to draw from, and I did not see the back-biting and bytchiness I have in nursing. Not even close. It's a whole new ball game here. I am a survivor and I can handle it, but that does not give me the right to dish it out.

As I said, eating crow is not fun.

[Bezoars]

Yeah, this is NOT the military. I think we can teach others and do it in a respectful, kind manner. What's wrong with kindness? It's not what you say... it's all in the delivery. We who teach others need to hone that skill. If you wouldn't treat a patient that way, don't treat those entrusted to you to teach that way either.

[RNdynamic]

If you wouldn't treat a patient that way, don't treat those entrusted to you to teach that way either.

A golden quotation. Thank you. If it's not okay to treat a patient a certain way, there's no reason to treat a nurse or coworker that way either. If you wouldn't behave that way toward a total stranger on the street, then you have no business behaving that way toward a near-stranger at work. Truth.

[starlane]

nursing and nurse education does not have to be like this.

I COMPLETELY agree, and GrnTea I hope you are never my preceptor-no offense. I have had a few preceptors who were drill sergeants and would laugh and smirk at you if you didn't know the answer or stuttered while coming up with something. I would freeze every time I was asked something because I had anxiety and fear of judgement. I would go home and cry because of the way these nurses were "teaching" me, and i did not learn as much as i should have because there was no trusting relationship. On the opposite side I had another preceptor who was calm and quizzed me and talked to me about her experiences but in such a nice manner, and if i didn't know the answer she was forgiving and understood. In that type of relationship where there is mutual respect, trust then you FLORISH sooo much more. :-)

And sure, maybe you will learn a lot from someone who is extremely knowledgeable and tries to humiliate you if you don't know something--because boy then you will work hard to get it right! wrong-- is that justifiable if the person is going home every day depressed and crying, i don't think so.

[Tenebrae, BSN, RN]

My clinical manager who gave me my first nursing job was fairly awesome. She was not afraid to kick my ass, however unlike the examples given always left me with a sense of where to go from there and how I could ensure I didnt make the same mistake again. I know of other colleagues who felt that this manager was as hard as nails.

The thing about constructive critisism is that its always specific. ALWAYS. I came out of the encounter knowing exactly where I had gone wrong and what to do about it.

I was on placement with other nursing students who were given their patient and pretty much told "now go look after them and dont bother me'

I get that yes, some nurses are somewhat overly precious. However I dont agree with the 'one sized fits all, if you dont like it tough' approach

[AmyRN303, BSN, RN]

There's a difference between riding someone hard to get them to critically think and succeed on their own and just being an intolerable human being. I'm an older new nurse. No one needs to hold my hand and call me sweetheart.

That being said, a paragraph of the original post doesn't translate well for me:

"I am going to jump on you during the training I give you, I am going to eat you up, I am going to speak bad of you, I am going to report on you to the officers. I will make your life miserable for a while."

Why? If by this you're meaning that you will be extra tough and point out mistakes and areas that need to be worked on, that's fine by me. But making someone's life miserable for the sake of doing so seems more akin to hazing than to orientation.

Kyrshamarks, I've read many of your posts and agree often with you. Perhaps I'm reading more into this than you had intended. I've had some wonderful preceptors in my program, many of whom might be considered by some new nurses to be very tough. Personality differences don't faze me. I know that nursing at times can be a trial by fire, especially on my step down floor. That being said, everyone has a different personality and different gifts. I also know some amazing nurses who teach well to whom "chew you up and spit you out" isn't in their lexicon. I've learned much from both types. I tend not to have PVCs as often around the second type, though

[Esme12, ASN, BSN, RN]

I have always been in a nurturing environment as a student. Were there the hard nosed no nonsense nurses that felt they needed to put you through your paces...sure...but I took that as a challenge.

I think that nursing has it wrong since they stopped training preceptors and ensuring that new nurses are nurtured in a supportive environment so they can feel safe enough to learn and retain what they are being taught. When you have a new nurse who is constantly on guard and stressed he/she is not learning nor retaining what they are being taught...so who is at fault when the new nurse isn't "moving along" properly...to me in some instances it is the preceptors fault and their inability to teach.

But "Bully" and workplace violence are new buzz words and not all cases of NETY are actual cases of bullying. Just recently in the student section a student asked for assistance with their assignment. When they were told we do not do the work for them they became defensive and cried NETY. There is a current environment of "everybody wins" which I think is detrimental to an individuals development to deal with adversity and disappointment. Not everyone wins....and we do not do your work for you. The OP became defensive and cried "I'm being bullied" NO....you aren't being bullied you were caught trying to cheat the system and you are angry.

Just because corrections are not delivered with sunshine and rainbows doesn't mean you are being bullied. Nurses don't mince words. We don't have time to molly coddle new nurses. Not all criticism is being bullied....mistakes in nursing can cost someone their life. It is important that the new nurse realizes the implication of their mistakes. There is very little leeway in healthcare for mistakes. Too often I have seen the new nurse with the "Whatever" attitude as they roll their eyes, snap their gum, and make some statement about just getting their time in to move on to the real jobs like NP or CRNA....just to point out as you gain more responsibility your mistakes will become more dangerous.

I think we need to find a happy medium...tough love mixed with support. Just because a new nurse is told they are wrong is not being bullied. Do I think nurses eat their young no...but there are some that do.

[mariebailey, MSN, RN]

Yes Drill Sergeant, but may I point out we aren't fighting the Vietcong with Gump?

[Ruby Vee, BSN]

The military way of life is not for everyone. But just because a person isn't cut out for military life doesn't mean that they can't be a productive member of society. That style of training is not for everyone -- and just because it is not right for a specific new nurse doesn't mean that orientee can't become a great nurse.

The BEST teachers/mentors/preceptors/colleagues/etc. can adapt their style to suit the needs of the learner and the situation. Education is not "one size fits all."

I opened this thread hoping to find a good explanation about why nursing education, orientation, etc. sometimes seems harsh and why we have to uphold high standards -- even if that means some unpleasantness at times. I don't believe in over-coddling our young, either. Some new nurses do need to toughen up a bit.

But I definitely believe in kindness and compassion ... courtesy and inter-personal respect ... etc. should prevail in the way we treat each other. We should not be "speaking bad" about one another: we should not be committing violence upon one another. Metaphors such as "skinning you alive" should not accurately express how we treat each other. We can and should do better.

Not every orientee gets the BEST teacher, mentor or preceptor. It would be wonderful if only those who were interested in, skilled at and well suited to precepting were made preceptors. It would be wonderful for the orientees, and it would be fabulous for all other senior staff who are drafted kicking and screaming into precepting. On a recent shift, we had 8 senior staff, three newbies within a year of hire and 9 orientees. Every single senior staff member had an orientee, and one of them had two. Not all of those senior staff wanted to be preceptors and some of them actively hated precepting. But we all have to step up to get the orientees through their orientation so that they can become independent (or reasonably so) members of our staff.

I know this sounds harsh, and perhaps it IS harsh, but often times new nurses have to make the best of what they get in terms of preceptors. It is certainly harsh for senior staff to be told "I know you've been continuously precepting since 2003, are totally burned out on it and have asked for a break from precepting, however you are the ONLY person on shift who can take this new grad." I'm pretty sure the new grads don't see that side of the equation, and from what I've been reading on allnurses, most of them wouldn't care anyway. They DESERVE an orientation with the preceptor from heaven, they shouldn't have to bend any to learn from a preceptor who may be more skilled at nursing and less skilled at precepting. Their preceptor doesn't teach in the way that they learn best -- they need a new preceptor. And there are always plenty of other newbies on line to tell them to step right up and insist upon getting a different preceptor because they DESERVE it. Perhaps so, but the experienced nurse who is burned out deserves a break from precepting, too. There are two sides to that equation and often the newbie sees only their own side.

[~Shrek~]

People like this is why nursing is essentially known as an uneducated and "ghetto" career choice by the General public.

[USMCRN2015]

Fellow Servicemen, can you spell Sergeant correctly in regards to a Fire Team position? That would be great.

[Purple_roses]

Politely disagree. I would want a new nurse to feel comfortable seeking advice and wisdom from more experienced nurses, and they will not feel that way if you "eat them and spit out their bones."