MSN Nurse without clinical experience please help!!

[Sspino]

I'm a new nurse that has worked in a private home setting that really shouldn't be called a nursing position for three years. I am 90% with my MSN program in Leadership and Management and would like to know what opportunities will be available with my lack of clinical experience? I'm trying to avoid doing floor nursing for a long period of time. Any suggestions?

[Mavrick, BSN, RN]

This is a trend. 90% of the students in my program claim that they NEVER want to work bedside...period. Furthermore, a few are going right into MSN programs with NO CLINICAL experience. To top it off, the few that are moving to med-surg jobs after graduating were placed by nurse recruiters at very well known hospitals, that themselves did not have clinical experience and after getting BSNs, went straight to recruiting! Does this make any sense?

And it shows.

Nursing "leadership" is getting stupider and stupider. The edicts that come from on high are chock full of booksmart rhetoric, scripts, customer service la-la BS. You can tell the policy writers have no idea the ridiculousness of implementing their plan.

[klone, MSN, RN]

It feels like there are three different threads all mashed together and everyone's responding to a different thread.

I also feel like some posters are reading from some weird app that doesn't show quoted post or something.

This whole thread is strange.

[joanna73, BSN, RN]

OP you would be wise to find a bedside role and stay in it for at least 2 years before advancing to a leadership role.

How are you supposed to be effective and offer advice to working nurses with no experience? How can you be an effective change agent?

Without the bedside experience, the degree has no merit. I've worked with nurses like this and they have no credibility with the staff.

[Vishwamitr]

May I suggest that you try out Utilization Review nurse position where you do not need to do bedside nursing but rather deal with the insurance companies and physicians?

[joanna73, BSN, RN]

Additional options could be research based work, clinical trials or some type of quality improvement role.

[roser13, ASN, RN]

May I suggest that you try out Utilization Review nurse position where you do not need to do bedside nursing but rather deal with the insurance companies and physicians?

I don't think so. Insurance companies rely on a nurse's background and experience to make rational judgment calls.

[elkpark]

I don't think so. Insurance companies rely on a nurse's background and experience to make rational judgment calls.

And all the UR positions I've seen over the years on the provider side have required years of clinical experience. You have to be clinically savvy to be a good UR person.

[kalevra, BSN, RN]

I think the the confusion that surrounds the CNL scope lies in the word "bedside".

The "direct-care" that the CNL is doing is patient teaching. The CNL is not meant to be in the staff mix as a bedside nurse.

The CNL is a systems - engineer of the healthcare system flow of the Microsystem. There is a reason why it was decided that the CNL required a Masters level of education versus a Bachelors level of education. It is a unique, specialized education that allows the one educated to function with a more in depth knowledge level and expertise than what is taught in nursing school.

When they say that a CNL is not a Management role, they're meaning one of administration~ the CNL should not be the one balancing the budget, or dealing with administrative tasks. Instead: the CNL is managing the flow of the Microsystem.

The UNIT is his/her patient.

Exactly so! I must have not been clear enough in my definition of bedside. When I speak of bedside, I refer to the usual bedside responsibilities of staff nurses who are included in the count in terms of patient care and existing census. A CNL is not to be showing up to work and given a patient load in order to provide coverage for patients on the floor. Their responsibilities are not to include passing out medications, enemas, getting consent, transferring/picking up pt. Rather, their responsibilities are focused on educating staff and patients, researching new implementations, investigating/applying new policies and protocols etc. It is a rather complex role, and with a Master's degree it allows them to take directorships or higher level positions. My hospital requires directors to either have 4 years experience as a unit/house supervisor or a Master's in Business/Nursing.

In any case, if someone does wish to be a CNL and work as a bedside staff nurse with a patient load, I am sure it can be arranged.

[dream'n, BSN, RN]

I'll be brutally honest. In my opinion you will need some real world bedside experience before moving up the ranks of administration. I'm honestly tired of students getting advanced nursing degrees that have never and don't ever want to touch a patient. It's just ridiculous. Experience in patient care is an automatic requirement prior to nurse management in my opinion. It's like a dental student saying they never want to touch a mouth or a student in car mechanics saying they never want to touch a car; but they want to be the boss of those that do. It's BS.

On a related note, I've had a couple non-nursing/non-medical friends that went to for profit schools to get an Associate or Bachelor degree in Healthcare Administration (and accrued tons of debt for it). Then they want to know how to get a job at my hospital in upper nursing/medical management. They are not very happy when I tell them that those jobs go to Doctors and Nurses with experience and advanced degrees (usually in Business Admin.)

[applesxoranges, BSN, RN]

Having worked with my ex's mom, I will say it is hard to appreciate a nurse with no clinical experience that is in a management position. She worked infection control and a little bit of research and chart auditing. She fell into that position because her friend was in charge of infection control for years. She is also very manipulative and scary. I will not work at facilities she works at.

[VANurse2010]

Exactly so! I must have not been clear enough in my definition of bedside. When I speak of bedside, I refer to the usual bedside responsibilities of staff nurses who are included in the count in terms of patient care and existing census. A CNL is not to be showing up to work and given a patient load in order to provide coverage for patients on the floor. Their responsibilities are not to include passing out medications, enemas, getting consent, transferring/picking up pt. Rather, their responsibilities are focused on educating staff and patients, researching new implementations, investigating/applying new policies and protocols etc. It is a rather complex role, and with a Master's degree it allows them to take directorships or higher level positions. My hospital requires directors to either have 4 years experience as a unit/house supervisor or a Master's in Business/Nursing.

In any case, if someone does wish to be a CNL and work as a bedside staff nurse with a patient load, I am sure it can be arranged.

that's the role of a CNL after they have several years of experience. I've yet to work with one who *didn't* work in a regular bedside position. Every RN I've seen who does what you're describing has been a CNS.

[Libby1987]

I suppose this happens everywhere and I can see how an educated adminstrator could be successful managing say a distributing warehouse having never worked with their back.

I'd like to hear from people who have successful middle managers who never worked in any patient care capacity..

Do they perform as well or even more effectively than those with clinical experience?

Is not being able to provide clinical support or not having a working knowledge of clinical care and implications been an obstacle?