Advanced Practice Columnist / Guide juan de la cruz, MSN, RN, NP 9 Articles; 4,338 Posts Specializes in APRN, Adult Critical Care, General Cardiology. Has 31 years experience. Dec 12, 2020 Our hospital was designated by our state as one of 7 institutions to receive the first batch of the Pfizer vaccine. Based on the preliminary email, there is an option to accept, postpone, or decline the vaccine. Presumably, other institutions will have their own policies regarding deployment of vaccines to their employees. I will accept the vaccine based on what I know about it with my thoughts in parenthesis): - mRNA, 2 doses (not a new technology but a new way to deliver a vaccine) - 43,661 were enrolled in all phases of the trial (large enough sample in my eyes) - 162 participants in the placebo group developed COVID, 8 participants in the vaccine group developed COVID (means it doesn't guarantee I won't get COVID but it's 95% effective) - injection site and systemic reactions were common (as in other vaccines) - long-term immunogenicity is unknown (another less reassuring data)
subee, MSN, CRNA 4,754 Posts Specializes in CRNA, Finally retired. Has 51 years experience. Dec 12, 2020 These are dire times and we are being forced to re-examine our sweet spot of comfort about Covid vaccines. People who don't even get that sick with the disease are coming out of the woodwork as long-haulers and a long of them are young, athletic people unable to get well. I am going to force myself to crawl out of my comfort zone and take it, although I would like to wait for the Astra Zeneca.
Advanced Practice Columnist / Guide juan de la cruz, MSN, RN, NP 9 Articles; 4,338 Posts Specializes in APRN, Adult Critical Care, General Cardiology. Has 31 years experience. Dec 12, 2020 @subee, just from my own curiosity, is it because the Astra Zeneca vaccine is not mRNA that makes you prefer it? From what I've read, the Astra Zeneca one is made from adenoviral vectors which seem rather new as well in terms of vaccine delivery. I have relatives in Asia whose national governments made arrangements for ordering this vaccine. I personally think it's a good thing that we have many options that offer layers of protection regardless.
Jedrnurse, BSN, RN 2,776 Posts Specializes in school nurse. Has 31 years experience. Dec 12, 2020 What in the world do you mean by a $1500 stimulus (bribe)..? Sounds like inaccurate reporting.
chare 3,942 Posts Dec 12, 2020 29 minutes ago, Jedrnurse said: What in the world do you mean by a $1500 stimulus (bribe)..? Sounds like inaccurate reporting. Quote Millions of Americans are still hoping for a second round of stimulus checks to help them cope with the financial fallout of the Covid-19 pandemic. Meanwhile, the U.S. government is preparing to distribute vaccinations to the American public in order to put an end to the public health crisis. Now, one proposal aims to help both efforts by giving people $1,500 stimulus checks in exchange for getting immunized. [...] Would you be willing to get a Covid vaccine in exchange for a $1,500 stimulus check? How one bold proposal would work
Jedrnurse, BSN, RN 2,776 Posts Specializes in school nurse. Has 31 years experience. Dec 12, 2020 47 minutes ago, chare said: Would you be willing to get a Covid vaccine in exchange for a $1,500 stimulus check? How one bold proposal would work Okay, so an "entrepreneur" and FORMER elected official has floated the idea. It's rubbish. The two things (money to help with economic security and vaccinations) should have no relationship. I hope this idea stays just that, an idea. On the other hand, I was planning on getting the vaccine anyway. If it happens to come with a bonus...?
Advanced Practice Columnist / Guide juan de la cruz, MSN, RN, NP 9 Articles; 4,338 Posts Specializes in APRN, Adult Critical Care, General Cardiology. Has 31 years experience. Dec 12, 2020 Forgot to mention in my previous post that a former neighbor (in her early 60's) when I lived in the Midwest (who we still communicate with) was part of the Moderna vaccine trial. She felt sick (body aches) after the second dose of the trial vaccine for a day. So far, she hasn't reported any symptoms and is COVID negative. She was told that as a participant, once Moderna gets FDA approval, she will be informed if she received the placebo during the trial and if she did, she will be one of the first in line for the Moderna vaccination.
askater112 44 Posts Dec 13, 2020 I have been trying to educate myself over the past 5 months bc I saw this coming. I have listened to podcast. They can be very informative. The Wire is especially interesting. Also listen to covid Question and Answer podcast. I read an article about covid immunization and fertility. I couldn’t find the article. When I Google looking for article all that pops up is “debunked” articles. Monday “The Wire” talked briefly about it.
Missingyou, CNA 718 Posts Specializes in Long term care. Has 20 years experience. Dec 13, 2020 Last week we were told the vaccine would be mandatory in our nursing home for all staff. Today, we were told it is NOT going to be mandatory AND they are offering $50 to anyone who gets the vaccine NOW while we have first stabs at it.
myoglobin, ASN, BSN, MSN 1,453 Posts Specializes in ICU, trauma, neuro. Has 15 years experience. Dec 13, 2020 I do not plan on taking the vaccine (unless forced by my 1099 employer) and if I am forced may consider other employment. Heck if it comes to that I may live as a walking nomad in the wilderness. My objection is that we do not have data on the long term immunological consequences of this vaccine. For example might it increase diseases that have an autoimmune component such as arthritis? Also, I do have religious concerns as I do feel that forced vaccination as is already being seriously discussed in the UK https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8986867/Could-UK-employers-force-staff-coronavirus-vaccine.html could be a prelude to an eventual "mark of the beast" system where if one does not participate in a forced system they are excluded "from buying and selling." To me liberty is almost always a priority over safety (there are of course limits). I feel that there is no more basic right than the right to say what medicines (or vaccines) we are forced to take in to our bodies. Also, we lack data on the long term effectiveness rate for these vaccines. Even most seasonal influenza vaccines are no more than 40-60% effective https://www.CDC.gov/flu/vaccines-work/vaccineeffect.htm and the antigenic drift of Covid seems if anything higher. Then there is the fact that if you are a health care worker you have probably had multiple exposures to this virus and have developed either antibodies or adaptive cellular immunity (which cannot be easily tested for).
Cowboyardee 472 Posts Dec 13, 2020 16 minutes ago, myoglobin said: Even most seasonal influenza vaccines are no more than 40-60% effective https://www.CDC.gov/flu/vaccines-work/vaccineeffect.htm and the antigenic drift of Covid seems if anything higher. Then there is the fact that if you are a health care worker you have probably had multiple exposures to this virus and have developed either antibodies or adaptive cellular immunity (which cannot be easily tested for). To the best of my knowledge, none of the quoted section above is correct (with the exception of your mention of the flu vaccine's 40-60% efficacy, which I included to preserve your context). Sars-cov-2 appears to have less genetic drift than the influenza virus, which is promising for higher efficacy of the vaccine and longer immunity. And I have heard nothing at all about health care workers developing immunity without contracting covid and would appreciate a citation of any reliable source for that claim. Initially, there was buzz about healthcare workers actually faring worse than the general public after contracting disease based on reports out of the wuhan region. Though I have not heard much continued support for that claim, I have certainly not heard any compelling argument or evidence that healthcare workers are somehow at lower risk either.
myoglobin, ASN, BSN, MSN 1,453 Posts Specializes in ICU, trauma, neuro. Has 15 years experience. Dec 13, 2020 Well here is one article that discusses many different strains https://medium.com/microbial-instincts/many-strains-of-covid-19-are-out-there-but-only-one-is-important-878b1ee1f829 . Although the article suggests a "low" mutation rate it goes on to examine a variety of mutations (of covid) and their characteristics: Compared to the reference Wuhan strain (wild-type or original SARS-CoV-2), their molecular analyses discovered that 68 variants (or strains) with altered biological characteristics (see figure below): 24 variants had lower infectivity: All had a 4- to 100-fold decrease in infectivity, except for two variants (V341I and N331Q+N343Q) with over 100-fold reduction in infectivity. 8 variants had increased infectivity: One variant has the D614G mutation alone, and the other seven have the D614G plus one more mutation. But no difference in infectivity was found between single and combined D614G mutations, which indicates that the D614G mutation alone is responsible for the enhanced infectivity. 9 and 10 variants had increased and decreased sensitivity, respectively, to neutralization by monoclonal antibodies. 5 and 12 variants had increased and decreased sensitivity, respectively, to convalescent sera — the blood component of recovered Covid-19 patients that contain a mix of antibodies, which may or may not be specific to SARS-CoV-2 proteins. Also, you say "none is true". How can you know my religious concerns? I assure you they are valid to me. Also, I provide a link to a UK article concerning possible mandatory vaccination in the UK being required by employers. My point on the health care workers is that this virus is extremely transmittable and that although healthcare workers are at increased risk (due to increased viral load). They are also often younger than the general population and most people under the age of 60 are at relatively low risk of death from this virus.
