Young women, and societal expectations/professional strangleholds

Nurses General Nursing

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I am an "old" nurse, and also a returning student.

Many of my classmates are just kids-- around twenty years old. I am currently retaking a couple of science classes, and my project partners in one class are young ladies pursuing a nursing degree.

A discussion I had with them in class today got me thinking. Has anything really changed in the last twenty years? I see "me" in them some twenty years ago, thinking I had to be a nurse because it was a natural progression as a CNA, I loved biological sciences and medicine, and the world (society) told me that as a young woman trying to make my own way in the world, nursing was my best chance at job security.

A couple of them are absolute whizzes at higher math, and love math/technology. One is not so keen on biological sciences, but can knock out a stats course with her eyes closed. Really? It's fairly rare to find people that can knock out stats like they're brushing their teeth. The other one thinks Algebra/calculus/trig is a cake walk, and loves and lives for anything math. Her heart is in math.

I asked them why then, are trying to get into the nursing program when their hearts lie elsewhere, and the job market for nurses is currently engineered to provide a nursing surplus?

I cannot remember being encouraged to do anything else with my knack for biological science and medicine...except for one dear anaesthesiologist in my surgical rotation who, point blank, asked me "Why don't you go to med school?"

Why didn't I? I don't know. I suppose, like them, I was a wide-eyed young woman, and unsure of my place in the world.

As I discussed the need and possibilites for the STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering Mathematics) fields, I saw little glimmers of realization in their faces.

I let them know nursing is not easy, and that they will not only have to think hard and have some degree of medical expertise , but they will be so while running mach-ten on their feet for hours on end.

Just thinkin'.

Specializes in Case mgmt., rehab, (CRRN), LTC & psych.
I asked them why then, are trying to get into the nursing program when their hearts lie elsewhere, and the job market for nurses is currently engineered to provide a nursing surplus?
Speaking from personal experience, not all young adults are encouraged to pursue their dreams or follow their hearts when it comes to higher education and career selection. Instead, guidance counselors and family members often stir young people into pathways that are considered more 'practical.'

Many parents, educators and authority figures, especially those who once hailed from the lower rungs of the economic and social ladder, view college strictly as an entity for practical job training. A large number of young women across the country are actively encouraged to select majors that are likely to lead to jobs at the end of the pipeline, even if they have the aptitude for and interest in something else.

Nursing, early childhood education and social work are favored college majors that lead to jobs (well, not so much anymore due to the economy). These majors are also dominated by females.

With the increased cost of college, picking a major that leads to a secure well-paying job does make sense when you will have to repay tens of thousands in loans.

That said, I think a lot of young people have little idea about what jobs are available.

They are heavily trained to "go to college" but little thought is given to what comes after.

When I was 20, I had never heard of respiratory therapists, ultrasounds techs, or many other jobs.

In my sheltered world, all I knew about were jobs that were visible: nurses, teachers, receptionists etc.

I do wish I had done some study about jobs before college. Wouldn't that be a useful thing? Anyone who is undecided about a career after high school take a gap year to do some exploration about how they want to spend 40+ hours a week for most of the rest of their lives?

Do they want to pursue other careers and were told not to, or did you infer that and then ask?

When I was younger I excelled at English. I loved reading, writing, etc. I always got A's and to this day I still write for pleasure almost every day.

But I never once thought to be a professional writer or English teacher. Just because you have a knack for something doesn't mean that is your only life option.

These girls might be great at stats or calc but that doesn't mean they have to be in those particular fields.

And yes, it's good to be realistic when making a career choice. I like nursing but I'm terrible at science. I barely passed A and P. I chose nursing in part because its a good income (and I got to interact with people which I love!). I make a lot more money than my peers. That is definitely nice.

Specializes in Neuro ICU and Med Surg.

I actually wanted to be a teacher at one time. I changed my mind in high school due to a class that I took where we helped elementary kids with their reading skills. I realized I wouldn't like being a teacher so I changed to nursing as I have always one good in science classes.

Specializes in Critical Care, Education.

Despite all the rhetoric & Title IX hoo-haw, sexism is alive and well. In fact, I (second wave feminist) think it is worse than ever as evidenced by the hyper-sexualization of very young teens these days. Miley Cyrus? Courtney Stodden? Any Kardashian? Girls who dare to follow a different path are villified & bullied by the 'mean girls' & humiliated by their male peers... in much more dreadful ways than ever before.

One of my daughters is a software engineer (MSCS) - so I have had a very close look at this phenomenon. She had to deal with huge amounts of negative pressure in nearly every STEM course in undergrad and grad education. She deals with it on a daily basis in her (> 80% male) workplace.... she copes with it gracefully and manages to maintain her dignity when colleagues & supervisors continue to behave inappropriately. Honestly, I don't think I could have done it without resorting to violence at some point.

So - yeah, all those female 'advances' in education and workplace rights??? They are still pretty much theoretical. The actuality is different. It's no wonder that a 'female' profession remains such a popular option for anyone who doesn't want to deal with the alternatives.

I find this interesting. I went back to school in my 40s to be a nurse. I am married to an engineer, and I don't know why more women don't go into engineering...I chose nursing because it is so flexible with many opportunities for diverse areas of expertise. Plus I can work as many or as little hours as I want to and switch from full-time to part-time to PRN whenever I want (if the job market allows). I still think about NP, but I fear that their schedule would not be as flexible. I recently saw an NP job listed part time as 7 days on (12 hour shifts) and 7 days off. In whose world is that part-time? And a physician, do they get time off? From what I've seen, they work way too many hours for the kind of life that I want to live.

Specializes in SICU, trauma, neuro.

They could have their reasons, did you ask? As an 18 y/o college freshman I had aspirations to get my PhD in musicology and become a music history prof. I changed majors two years in b/c I realized how limited those positions were and that chances were very good I wouldn't use the hoped-for PhD. Part of my decision for nursing--on my own, nobody pressured me that nice girls become a nurse, teacher, or secretary--was the flexibility. I am a professional with part-time options, off-hours options etc. I don't have to choose between leaving my job and working FT. Of course that wasn't the only factor...I had worked as a CNA and realized that I would like nursing. My sister is a geologist and pregnant with her first baby; staying home isn't a solid option for her, but she's already agonizing about putting the baby in daycare full-time.

Specializes in Hospice.

In my case it was influence from family. I had always wanted to be a lawyer, (I loved Matlock), but my father wanted me to be a NEUROSURGEON. No way! But I was always trying to please him, I went to school under the premise of becoming a doctor. I hated it and needless to say, I ended up dropping out after my first year because my heart was not in it. Fast forward....16 years later I went to nursing school, I love being a nurse and I am good at it, but I often think what my life would be if I had went to law school.

I don't even remember speaking to a school counselor except for my junior year when I took the SAT. It is sad, that not much has changed from the time I graduated in 1985 to now.

Specializes in Hospital Education Coordinator.

maybe they can pursue a nursing informatics career or nurse researcher. Or hospital administration----

Specializes in Nursing Professional Development.
Do they want to pursue other careers and were told not to, or did you infer that and then ask?

Good point. Just because these girls have intelligence and other options in life doesn't mean that there is anything wrong with them choosing nursing.

I excelled at all subjects in school except Spanish. I was my high school valedictorian, went to an elite university on their highest academic scholorship ... etc. etc. etc. .... and yet, I CHOSE to study nursing because it was a profession that I cared about. It is a good blend of ALL the academic areas -- science, math, humanities, social sciences ... and I liked them all. Nursing combines them all.

I knew that by choosing nursing, I would be able to use ALL my interests and talents to serve humanity and help make the world a better place. I knew I could get a graduate degree in nursing and be a leader in this profession rather than "just another physician" or "just another ...whatever." I liked the flexibility that a nursing career offers, the ability to switch specialties, work varied hours, in varied settings, doing varried types of work.

I made an informed choice and I don't regret it. Sure, some days, I hate my job -- but that's because of certain individuals I have to work with or because of particular job circumstances. I have never hated the root mission of nursing or felt that nursing was "beneath" my talents. Now in my late 50's, I still see so much work that needs to be done within nursing -- and only wish I had the time, expertise, and energy to do it all.

llg, PhD, RN-BC

Specializes in Cardiology, Cardiothoracic Surgical.

I'm not quite so sold anymore on the idea that we need to keep pushing more young women into the traditional STEM degrees. Why?

I was a structural and molecular biochemistry major during my first college rodeo, with highly theoretical coursework, long labs, and lots of homework. The expectation after graduation was to go to grad or med school. I worked as a research tech for years, and decided against getting my PhD and went for my BSN instead because I didn't want to gamble away 4-8 years of my life on more grueling education. Smart move.

Jobs in academia for those with science PhDs are currently very difficult to secure, have long hours and low pay, to say nothing of the declining state of grant funding. Jobs in government are even more elusive. I know a lot of unemployed PhDs in my area right now, or just as bad, those stuck in adjunct professor land. And if you don't have your PhD? Very little opportunity to move up in your field- perhaps into industry, but the GLP and GMP certifications can be hard to get.

I think the prospects for success are improving for female engineers, as their work environments shift from assembly-style project design to more interactive innovation and teamwork. That is, of course, if they can successfully run the gauntlet through the courseload in college. I would also argue that skills seen as traditionally belonging to the 'humanities'- writing, speaking, communication, networking- are very important to all fields. For example, advanced math skills are extremely important to pediatric and oncology nurses.

Lastly, I think as medical care becomes even more influenced by technology and evidence-based practice is instituted, nursing will need more STEM types to handle the "background": systems admin, informatics, research and institution organization.

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