Denied PTO for my marriage

[ryuunohime]

Hey fellow nurses,

I just need a place to vent and get some feedback. I've been dating this guy for about 4 years, and he proposed on Christmas day 2016. Naturally I'm ecstatic, and as soon as we get back from visiting his folks, I start planning the wedding. Its my first marriage/engagement, so I really have no idea what I'm doing. After many many phone calls and negotiations with family members and venues, I get my date. July 29th. Fantastic.

At work, our bi-annual PTO sign up starts Jan 1st to the 14th for PTO through the month of august. I sign up on the 4th of Jan for my wedding week and the week after. I'm in a hospital, work 3 12s a week. By the time my wedding rolls around I will have more than enough PTO to cover. I also email both my manager and clinical coordinator and let them know I am getting married.

Yesterday, my PTO was denied. Naturally I'm hurt and heart broken, and I ask them why. I get told PTO is handed out based on seniority, and only so many nurses per shift can be off. I'm a full time night shift nurse. During my week I wanted, there are 5 day nurses and only 1 other night nurse off, but I get told they are full for vacation that week. When I point out the numbers, I get told I'm being difficult to coach. I was told that I should have picked a date at a less busy time for our unit. I was told that if I want my wedding off I need to find someone willing to cover my shifts for me.

I'm heartbroken and enraged and I can feel my emotions eating away at me. I love being a nurse, I've been in the field since 2010, but I hate coming to work any more. Especially now.

My unit is a busy medical unit in a small magnet hospital in a rural state. I will have been on this floor for 2 years in July, and plan to have finished up my BSN by the end of this year. I'm thinking of bailing after the wedding and going to another floor, perhaps float pool where I imagine its a much more flexible schedule.

What do you guys think? How would you handle this?

[nursefor]

I have been reading these comments and to those who make silly comments like I never take vacation in the summer is just plain silly.

If you give your time in advance you should be able to take a vacation when you want this is not the army there was no contract signed when you become a nurse implying you are never allowed to take vacation or make significant plans during the summer.

There is no other profession that would tolerate this foolishness.

And for your work not to honor something as important as a wedding with plenty of time in advance to make alternate arrangements is ridiculous.

And what if one decides to quit wont they have to get a replacement. Give me a break.

[Ruby Vee, BSN]

I have been reading these comments and to those who make silly comments like I never take vacation in the summer is just plain silly.

If you give your time in advance you should be able to take a vacation when you want this is not the army there was no contract signed when you become a nurse implying you are never allowed to take vacation or make significant plans during the summer.

There is no other profession that would tolerate this foolishness.

And for your work not to honor something as important as a wedding with plenty of time in advance to make alternate arrangements is ridiculous.

And what if one decides to quit wont they have to get a replacement. Give me a break.

If you are low on the seniority list, it is better to plan to take your vacation time during the "off time" when little kids are in school and their parents are unlikely to wish to take family vacations. That doesn't mean you can NEVER take a summer vacation; it just means that you may not get your first choice, so you must have a Plan B and a Plan C.

For the poster to begin wedding planning without having assurance of having a specific block of time off is utter ridiculous. The FIRST step would have been to have requested and received in writing permission to take that block of time off. If the vacation requests book is pretty full and the poster knew or had reason to suspect that the vacation requests for her preferred time had been granted, she had the option to choose another block of time that would be granted and start the wedding planning with that date in mind. Or, she has the option to go to her manager with a plan for taking the time off without using PTO to try to work something out. She hasn't done either of those things.

The poster's manager and department is not responsible for the poster's disappointment at not being given the PTO for her requested time period. The OP has worked there for two years and should be aware of the procedure for requesting PTO and the policy for granting it. She just went ahead assuming that her special plans trumped everyone else's plans. She was wrong.

[Wuzzie]

I have been reading these comments and to those who make silly comments like I never take vacation in the summer is just plain silly.

Wow, rude much?! I never take vacation in the summer and I'll thank you to not call me silly. I choose not to do so because I do not have school age kids so I can go whenever I damn well please but many of my co-workers cannot because, you know, school. So in the interest of being a team player I choose to go during the fall with the upshot being awesome weather, cheaper rates and the pool to myself.

[llg, PhD, RN]

Wow, rude much?! I never take vacation in the summer and I'll thank you to not call me silly. I choose not to do so because I do not have school age kids so I can go whenever I damn well please but many of my co-workers cannot because, you know, school. So in the interest of being a team player I choose to go during the fall with the upshot being awesome weather, cheaper rates and the pool to myself.

\

Me, too. I'm single with no kids. I have always minimized my use of vacation time in the summer months as there is always a lot of competition to get that time off -- and there is too much going on for us staff development specialists at that time. I plan my big vacations for fall -- when I have no trouble getting the time off, and benefit from the cheaper rates and fewer people at the vacation sites.

[RNKPCE]

If you are low on the seniority list, it is better to plan to take your vacation time during the "off time" when little kids are in school and their parents are unlikely to wish to take family vacations. That doesn't mean you can NEVER take a summer vacation; it just means that you may not get your first choice, so you must have a Plan B and a Plan C.

For the poster to begin wedding planning without having assurance of having a specific block of time off is utter ridiculous. The FIRST step would have been to have requested and received in writing permission to take that block of time off. If the vacation requests book is pretty full and the poster knew or had reason to suspect that the vacation requests for her preferred time had been granted, she had the option to choose another block of time that would be granted and start the wedding planning with that date in mind. Or, she has the option to go to her manager with a plan for taking the time off without using PTO to try to work something out. She hasn't done either of those things.

The poster's manager and department is not responsible for the poster's disappointment at not being given the PTO for her requested time period. The OP has worked there for two years and should be aware of the procedure for requesting PTO and the policy for granting it. She just went ahead assuming that her special plans trumped everyone else's plans. She was wrong.

Ruby Vee I love your responses! Thanks for keeping it real. It may not be pretty but it is the reality of many nursing positions. It is continuously happening where I work. If you have the time off in your bank there is no limit on how many different weeks you can take a year. Some of us don't have school age kids so prefer to take our vacations off season. However the most senior nurse with young children signs up for vacation every single school vacation, Thanksgiving, Xmas, Spring break and a week or two in July. All the other less senior nurses get the leftovers. A little more options in summer but not for Spring break etc.

[elkpark]

3. if you already booked a venue etc, call out if you can't find coverage. what are they going to do, fire you for calling out? illegal. just make sure between now and then you don't call out.

Yes, they will fire the OP for calling off for her wedding (calling off for two weeks?), when she previously requested the time off and was refused -- they'll just find something else to say that they're firing her for. I've seen it happen many times. Few things get you on the wrong side of management quicker than calling off on days that you requested off and didn't get.

[SmilingBluEyes]

I wonder what the OP decided to do. I hope she has the wedding she wants/dreams of, (really I do)----- but it may come at the price of WHEN she chooses to do it. Hopefully this is a lesson to any lurkers out there who think they can just put management (and their coworkers) "over a barrel" and demand time off for their "special occasion", thinking their plans trump all else. And calling out sick won't cut it either. Doing that can get you fired quick.

Everyone has "special" occasions, plans, loved ones and things going on that matter. A wedding does not trump all else, no matter how important it is to the person planning it. Key word: Planning.

In the real world of nursing, especially where seniority applies, this could not be more true. Planning and flexibility will be absolutely necessary to succeed, particularly in a 24/7 business like nursing. Really, some people need to understand better what they are getting into when they become nurses.

[KelRN215, BSN, RN]

I have been reading these comments and to those who make silly comments like I never take vacation in the summer is just plain silly.

Care to explain?

My last vacation was to South America. Why would I take a vacation to South America in our summer, which is their winter? No thanks, I'll travel away from winter to 90 degree weather. There are literally three to four months of the year where weather in my home area is nice. I stay local during those months.

I do not have children, hence I have no need to go on vacation in the summer when they are not in school. I'll gladly travel in the winter and fall when there are minimal families with children at said vacation spots, because all the kids are in school, I'm not in competition with anyone else for the time off and flights/hotels are cheaper.

I am not lying when I say I have never taken a big vacation in the summer in the ten years since I became a nurse. I took the week after Labor Day this year- the "summer vacation" period had officially ended and I got a full week off while only having to use 32 hrs of PTO, since I had Monday off anyway. That's the closest I've come to taking "summer vacation." I also took a week in December and a week in January and got to spend 2 weeks where it was winter up here in summer in Central/South America.

[Kooky Korky, BSN, RN]

Ruby Vee I love your responses! Thanks for keeping it real. It may not be pretty but it is the reality of many nursing positions. It is continuously happening where I work. If you have the time off in your bank there is no limit on how many different weeks you can take a year. Some of us don't have school age kids so prefer to take our vacations off season. However the most senior nurse with young children signs up for vacation every single school vacation, Thanksgiving, Xmas, Spring break and a week or two in July. All the other less senior nurses get the leftovers. A little more options in summer but not for Spring break etc.

I can never decide if it's fair or not for the most senior staff to get all the time she requests. Yes, she is due some appreciation for her loyalty, but other staff have family and hopes, too.

How much favored status is too much favored status?

[SmilingBluEyes]

I envied and was annoyed by seniority when I started out as a nurse----- until I myself achieved some of that seniority. Yea, I had to take vacations at less-than-desired times and I worked night shift quite a while until day shift positions opened up and I had enough time in to get them.

Then, over time, I began to understand some things. In nursing, seniority does not actually mean all that much and the benefits are not really that many. Actually, in some positions, for the senior nurse, it's a ticket out the door---- being replaced by a newer, fresher-faced, pretty young thing who costs less to the bottom line.

I have zero problem with senior nurses getting first pick at work and vacation scheduling. It is very fair in my mind. Those who take positions where seniority has such advantages need to either accept this or move on to positions that don't (and there are some out there). Simple as that.

[RNKPCE]

I can never decide if it's fair or not for the most senior staff to get all the time she requests. Yes, she is due some appreciation for her loyalty, but other staff have family and hopes, too.

How much favored status is too much favored status?

Not saying it's completely fair. I think by Seniority maybe you should get first choice on two weeks a year, not every time you decide to take time off. So the person I work with could pick spring break and the second week in July but not Thanksgiving week.

[elkpark]

I have been reading these comments and to those who make silly comments like I never take vacation in the summer is just plain silly.

Silly how? I don't have any children, and I enjoy being able to vacation during the school year precisely because I am not interested in spending my vacation time having to tolerate other people's children and summertime crowds. I can't think of the last time I took a vacation in the summer. Oh, wait, I can -- it was in the summer of 1993, when I was in graduate school and locked into a traditional academic schedule because of my own studies. Not since then.