We were discussing the Disneryland measles outbreak at work, and I was appalled to find some of my co-workers refuse to vaccinate their kids. They (grudgingly) receive the vaccines they need to remain employed, but doubt their safety/necessity for their kids.
I must say, I am absolutley stunned. How can one be a nurse and deny science?
As a nurse, you should darn well know what the scientific method entails and what phrases such as "evidence based" and "peer reviewed" mean.
I have to say, I have lost most of my respect for the nurses and mistrust their judgement; after all, if they deny science, on what premise are they basing their practices?
That is like saying, "I don't need evidence. I just have to believe. And I don't care about your evidence either."
You think any evidence counter to your beliefs is falsified as the result of a conspiracy.
You think any opinion in favor of your beliefs is as good as fact.
Your denial of science is pathological in the literal sense that you reasoning is sickly and compulsively against logic. There is no need to look for red flag beliefs from you when you eloquently explain that your though processes are inherently illogical and that you are impervious to reason.
What is the point of anyone debating with you?
There really isn't any point. Her ignorance is astounding. Some of her false statements are imo deliberately disingenuous. Other times, she is purposefully obtuse. She still has yet to provide even one link to any evidence based data. Not a single one. Every single source she uses lacks actual scientific data, uses non experts who do not have credentials in research, virology, epidemiology, vaccines, or anything close to it, deliberately intends to mislead the reader with conclusions not supported in the link, or in some cases, makes assertions which are outright lies. If she had peer reviewed evidence to support her nonsense, she would have provided it by now, though I am not even sure she understands what peer reviewed evidence is, or controlled studies, or the concepts of correlation and causation, how vaccines actually are developed and evaluated, the lack of oversight of homeopathic medicine, the conflicts of interests of some of her "experts" who also are peddling products whose profits depend upon creating distrust of proven products, etc. She has provided evidence that she doesn't know the definition of slander, she doesn't know much to anything about formaldehyde and its function in the human body, or basic facts about substances which are also contained in vaccines, simply that they are "chemicals" or "toxins." In spite of the fact that she continues to harp on questioning what one reads, she clearly hasn't questioned any of her own sources, but falls for them hook, line, and sinker. Since most of them are not backed up by reputable research studies, that's the only explanation for her adherence to things which when questioned, supply no proof-she clearly hasn't questioned them and certainly hasn't held them to the same standard of proof which she has demanded from the opposite POV.
She is a perfect illustration of the fact that apparently all nursing schools are not created equal. So yeah, why bother to debate when it's just too damned easy to win?
Specializes in Complex pedi to LTC/SA & now a manager.
As someone who worked in contract clinical research for over a decade I both drug/consumer product development (everything from nasal ketamine, midazolam, & fentanyl fast tracked for overseas US field military use so that soldiers who are so wounded they cannot have a field IV started for pain control due to burns & traumatic amputations. Now available for hospital use. To double blind cross over trials brand to generic studies because manufacturing site was changed. And health & beauty products such as toothpaste lotion and mouthwash) and clinical phase 1-3 patient trials (OTC, novel drugs, orphan drugs, genetics, brands, new formulations (liquid vs pill vs transdermal vs transmucosal, and even a vaccine vector) I can tell you with 100% certainty not all clinical trials are sponsored by big pharma. US military NIH. CDC. American Diabetes Association. Universities, orphan drug start up pharma (parents who sought venture capitalist funding to develop a drug in an attempt to save their child's life) genetic research, all sponsor clinical trials. Fed/fasted. Diet vs lifestyle modification vs novel drug.
Your assumption that ALL clinical drug trials is big pharmaceutical is inaccurate at best.
Being a nurse and listening to the politics makes me wonder why all nurses feel that you should vaccinate??? Please read this article. Our government is run by pharmaceutical companies... and it is all about money. As nurses there is so much horizontal violence and bashing that makes me wonder why some of you even had gotten into nursing. Congress Moves to Step Up Vaccine Enforcement | The Alliance for Natural Health USA
Specializes in Oncology; medical specialty website.
I guess it's your choice to turn a blind eye. The documentary is informative and has plenty of experts and scientists, even a former CDC scientist. You can't really judge it by the opinions of others. Watch it for yourself and then decide.....or don't.
The link you posted has plenty of misinformation about the film. It's also what you all would call an opinion piece. How about give it a chance. Watch it and form your own opinion. Come back and tell us what you think. Is it a terrible documentary? Does it project false claims? You won't know if you don't see it.
I don't need to watch it. Science has proven that vaccines have been played an essential role in eradicating diseases that were once death sentences.
There are people in third-world countries who are begging, pleading for the vaccinations you so cavalierly toss aside. They watch helplessly as their children die from diseases that are preventable, all for want of a vaccination.
Anti-vaxxers ride on the coattails of those of us who have done the personally and socially responsible thing to do: get vaccinated against diseases that can wreak havoc in a normally healthy person, and kill those who are too young to be vaccinated or are immunocompromised.
As far as I'm concerned, there is no "debate" when it comes to vaccines in the same way there is no debate that the earth is not flat. So I don't need to watch this piece of fiction you tout.
Being a nurse and listening to the politics makes me wonder why all nurses feel that you should vaccinate??? Please read this article. Our government is run by pharmaceutical companies... and it is all about money. As nurses there is so much horizontal violence and bashing that makes me wonder why some of you even had gotten into nursing. Congress Moves to Step Up Vaccine Enforcement | The Alliance for Natural Health USA
Looked at your link. It's an op-ed piece, nothing scientific there. Conjecture.
Being a nurse and listening to the politics makes me wonder why all nurses feel that you should vaccinate??? Please read this article. Our government is run by pharmaceutical companies... and it is all about money. As nurses there is so much horizontal violence and bashing that makes me wonder why some of you even had gotten into nursing. Congress Moves to Step Up Vaccine Enforcement | The Alliance for Natural Health USA
Being a nurse and wondering why you should vaccinate?. Do you wash your hands, practice aseptic or sterile technique or do you just think patients should be thrown in the corner and hourly chants sung over them?
It is a myth that pharmaceutical companies rely on or even need vaccines to be profitable. Vaccines account for an average of about 1.5% of pharmaceutical company profits.
Public health has always been placed at the forefront of modern medicine to deny that vaccines are one of the most important public health inventions in the history of man is nothing more than a conspiracy theory with no basis in scientific literature.
Debate the scientific literature don't just add more conspiracy theory nonsense.
BostonFNP, APRN
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