We were discussing the Disneryland measles outbreak at work, and I was appalled to find some of my co-workers refuse to vaccinate their kids. They (grudgingly) receive the vaccines they need to remain employed, but doubt their safety/necessity for their kids.
I must say, I am absolutley stunned. How can one be a nurse and deny science?
As a nurse, you should darn well know what the scientific method entails and what phrases such as "evidence based" and "peer reviewed" mean.
I have to say, I have lost most of my respect for the nurses and mistrust their judgement; after all, if they deny science, on what premise are they basing their practices?
Specializes in OR, Nursing Professional Development.
Not making fun of you klone. I love spell check auto corrects! Just loving the increased risk of DVD's! Darn those movies, they should've stuck to VHS format for their own good.
So glad I wasn't the first to comment- I've been biting my tongue all day! Personally, I could use some new movies…
But seriously, I can't believe the amount of misinformation out there being promoted, although I can believe the whole "news as entertainment" part. Some people only care about their own profits, even if it means others suffer.
.....I believe most illnesses can be cured by eating garlic. Yes, even scoliosis. It's something about the pH balance being off, and garlic fixes that. When in doubt, eat more garlic. I eat it raw, like a tiny apple, sixteen to seventeen heads of garlic a day. My skin has never felt so soft.
Whenever a friend gets cancer, I make sure to tell her about the power of vitamin C and a can-do attitude. I've lost so many friends to the acidic nightmare of chemotherapy. They're still alive; we just don't talk anymore. Thanks a lot, Big Pharma......."
I commented initially after 45 pages; I see it's still thriving at 58 pages but now I've got a new embarrassment blooming. It's bad enough to have people who believe the anti-vax conspiracy movement rhetoric. But to have someone who is a practicing nurse and yet is unable to tell the difference between Internet quackery, online BS-mongering and valid, reputable scientific studies/data is truly disturbing.
To make it further embarrassing, it seems that people will generally link those with higher degrees of education with the ability to recognize fraud from fact; I happen to be on a lower echelon of the education ladder than some of my esteemed colleagues here and yet I have no difficulty discerning the two.
I truly, honestly have concern for those patients who put their faith and trust in people who cannot tell fact from fiction, rhetoric from data, evidence from anecdotes. Just demoralizing, as a nursing professional whose job it is to PROVIDE this kind of education, to know that this is the kind of thing I have to work against WITHIN my own profession. It's not bad enough to worry that our patients are spending too much time Googling quackery that can ultimately harm them.....no, we have NURSES who are all too willing to do just that for them
I have provided lots of data throughout this. If you choose not to see the other side, you are willfully being ignorant. I don't see how anyone here can say I am when I have provided links. Just because I disagree, I guess that means you are right and I must be an ignorant fool. That's logical.
Andi. Go back and look at the "data" and "evidence" you posted. It's a link to a blog, to a anti-vax group without a single citation to legitimate scientific research, and a discredited extremist who makes money of deceiving pseudoscientists.
You lectured us on our limited understanding of science and our lack of research into the topic. As it turns out you have not researched any of the actual extant scientific data, and more concerning, you seem to not understand what actual science is.
You have told other that they are closed minded yet you clearly made a decision then looked for/grasped for some "evidence" to support your position. This is pseudoscience. Why don't you try to actually open your mind, look at the objective data, and see if you come to the same position.
Instead of Google, try typing your evidence search into PubMed, CINAHL, or Google Scholar, these are free resources to search actual scientific studies.
I had an antivaxer (chiropractor, who claims to be a "doctor", so is more educated and knows more than me and my little BSN) tell me the other day that pertussis is not a deadly disease, and that there are no documented deaths in the US from whooping cough. He went on to use the argument that diseases we already on their way out in the US when vaccines started, and sanitation, not vaccines are responsible for the drop in cases/deaths of diseases, not the vaccines. His proof? We no longer vaccinate against small pox, and America hasn't had a case in decades. When I pointed out that was because the disease was ERADICATED, he came back with the statement that it's still infecting people in third world countries where sanitation is still substandard. I came back and said, ummm, no, it was ERADICATED from the PLANET 30+ years ago, and now only exists in a lab. He did not respond the that argument again. What made me unfriend him off of my Facebook altogether though, was his attitude that he had authority because he is a doctor (ha!) and homeopathic medicine is proven more effective for childhood diseases than prevention. That and his claim that PERTUSSIS has never killed a child (yep, he said that). Wow, how heartbreaking it must be for mothers of babies who caught pertussis to learn their babies died from nothing.
But why is is that so many people assume that hang fewer children always equals good?
Yes, please don't hang the children. It's not very nice and according to my experiences watching the walking dead, it's utterly heartbreaking having to take them down a second time after they reanimate.
I find it mind boggling that proponents of the "other side" of scientific issues (as in those who believe "alternative" theories) demand that their views be considered EQUALLY worthy of consideration, or that their views are somehow equal to the views that the vast amount of research supports.
You are allowed to believe whatever you want. That is your right. It is not your right, however, to demand your views have equal acceptance to the views of the vast majority of EXPERTS in the field of study. Sorry--- opinions are just that. They are not equal to scientific research, no matter how loudly you state them.
So believe in "alternative" all you want. If you choose to accept that this country has masterminded a conspiracy to poison our children and taint the landscape with lies, and that the vast majority of experts in the field are in on the conspiracy- well, you go right ahead and protect yourself and your children with your tinfoil hats and special diets (do you grow your own food? I sure hope so, because you're not going to avoid chemicals, steroids, (gasp) GMOs if you get your food from a store). BUT- don't expect to not have to make alternative (there's that word again) plans when communicable diseases hit your community- because when your kids are exposed to vaccine preventable diseases, they should be QUARANTINED to your home until the disease runs its course. That means no parks, no restaurants, no schools, no doctors offices... no place vulnerable populations may be congregated. If you choose to consider your own beliefs (which are NOT equal to that of public health experts) over the "greater good" of the community, you are choose to exclude yourself from that community. You're welcome to do that.
So believe in "alternative" all you want. If you choose to accept that this country has masterminded a conspiracy to poison our children and taint the landscape with lies, and that the vast majority of experts in the field are in on the conspiracy- well, you go right ahead and protect yourself and your children with your tinfoil hats and special diets (do you grow your own food? I sure hope so, because you're not going to avoid chemicals, steroids, (gasp) GMOs if you get your food from a store). BUT- don't expect to not have to make alternative (there's that word again) plans when communicable diseases hit your community- because when your kids are exposed to vaccine preventable diseases, they should be QUARANTINED to your home until the disease runs its course. That means no parks, no restaurants, no schools, no doctors offices... no place vulnerable populations may be congregated. If you choose to consider your own beliefs (which are NOT equal to that of public health experts) over the "greater good" of the community, you are choose to exclude yourself from that community. You're welcome to do that.
Two things:
1- I genuinely believe we breed conspiracy theorists the second we tell our kids there is no Santa. That is the first time they realize that an entire country really can be in on the same con together.
2- I'd like to add some humor. Stick it out to verse two. 😂
I had an antivaxer (chiropractor, who claims to be a "doctor", so is more educated and knows more than me and my little BSN) tell me the other day that pertussis is not a deadly disease, and that there are no documented deaths in the US from whooping cough. He went on to use the argument that diseases we already on their way out in the US when vaccines started, and sanitation, not vaccines are responsible for the drop in cases/deaths of diseases, not the vaccines. His proof? We no longer vaccinate against small pox, and America hasn't had a case in decades. When I pointed out that was because the disease was ERADICATED, he came back with the statement that it's still infecting people in third world countries where sanitation is still substandard. I came back and said, ummm, no, it was ERADICATED from the PLANET 30+ years ago, and now only exists in a lab. He did not respond the that argument again. What made me unfriend him off of my Facebook altogether though, was his attitude that he had authority because he is a doctor (ha!) and homeopathic medicine is proven more effective for childhood diseases than prevention. That and his claim that PERTUSSIS has never killed a child (yep, he said that). Wow, how heartbreaking it must be for mothers of babies who caught pertussis to learn their babies died from nothing.
Show this to the next chiropractor that tries to tell you that their education has anything to do with science.
"…parents are free to become martyrs themselves. But it does not follow that they are free, in identical circumstances, to make martyrs of their children before they have reached the age of full and legal discretion when they can make that choice for themselves."
I always liked this quote even though it has never to my knowledge been directly applied to parents who refuse to have their children vaccinated maybe it should be.
I came back and said, ummm, no, it was ERADICATED from the PLANET 30+ years ago, and now only exists in a lab. He did not respond the that argument again. What made me unfriend him off of my Facebook altogether though, was his attitude that he had authority because he is a doctor (ha!) and homeopathic medicine is proven more effective for childhood diseases than prevention. That and his claim that PERTUSSIS has never killed a child (yep, he said that). Wow, how heartbreaking it must be for mothers of babies who caught pertussis to learn their babies died from nothing. 
Rose_Queen, BSN, MSN, RN
6 Articles; 12,057 Posts
So glad I wasn't the first to comment- I've been biting my tongue all day! Personally, I could use some new movies…
But seriously, I can't believe the amount of misinformation out there being promoted, although I can believe the whole "news as entertainment" part. Some people only care about their own profits, even if it means others suffer.