Alex Wubbels' Arresting Officer Jeff Payne Claims He Did Nothing Wrong - Plans to Sue

Former Detective Jeff Payne lost his job over his "confrontation" with Utah Nurse Alex Wubbels over a year ago as she was trying to protect the rights of her unconscious patient. Now he is saying he did nothing wrong and plans to sue the city that fired him. Nurses Announcements Archive

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Former Detective Jeff Payne lost his job over his "confrontation" with Nurse Alex Wubbels over a year ago. Now he is saying he did nothing wrong.

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"She was doing her job," he said. "I was doing my job. And unfortunately, it conflicted. And I am the one who bears most of the burden for it."

Payne insisted he had implied consent to get the blood sample from a crash victim under Alex Wubbels' care. When she refused, Payne handcuffed her.

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He insists he was only following orders that day - his boss, Lt. James Tracy, had ordered that he arrest Wubbels if she didn't let him draw the patient's blood.

When asked if he thought he used too much force, he said he was just following his training.

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I couldn't believe this incident went worldwide

He plans to seek $1.5 million associated with lost wages and benefits, emotional distress and defamation of character.

What are your thoughts? Should he be awarded $1.5 million for simply "doing his job"?

For more on this story, go to Former Detective Jeff Payne isn't sorry for arresting Alex Wubbels and he plans to sue for $1.5 million - The Salt Lake Tribune

A few VERY important facts:

Alex presented hospital policy that was founded in the local law. Payne refused to abide by it.

He was presenting as angry: you can see Alex's discomfort and her saying she didn't understand why Payne was angry at her personally because she was the messenger. You can hear the higher-up on the phone saying it was a mistake to threaten her. He had apparently been there for hours harassing staff for not doing what he wanted.

Fact: HE DID NOT ATTEMPT A NON-FORCIBLE ARREST. Per his own cam footage, he lunged at her with both hands outstretched before uttering a word. He said "WE'RE DONE HERE" as he tried to lay hands on her. He initiated physical aggression and she backed away out of fear, before he EVER uttered the words "You're under arrest." I'm not a big fan of caps but yeezus, his delusional victimhood makes me rage. The order of behaviors here is CRITICALLY important, and the officer did literally everything wrong.

He's also on cam footage saying he would bring transients to her hospital and "good patients" elsewhere to punish them for not cooperating. Absolutely everything about this case is clear-cut in defense of the hospital and Alex Wubbels, and against the behavior, character, and competency of Payne and his superior that ordered the arrest. He walked in angry and he acted accordingly.

Arrest Footage:

Patient dumping threat:

One quibble, it was state law, based on a SCOTUS decision. Alex had no wiggle room. and both those idiots should be in Fed prison. plus a few other cops should have been fired.

Specializes in Cardiology and ER Nursing.

The Nazi's at the concentration camps were just doing their jobs and how did that work out for them?

Specializes in NICU.

This is a sad situation ,I was appalled at the video,no nurse should ever be treated like that.I am very surprised by his behavior because nurses and police usually on the same mission to serve the public.We have so many police /nurse marriages since they have many job related stresses in common,the shift work,holidays away from family,floating to other areas and a very very stressful job.I would never want to be responsible for someone losing their livelihood especially after 30 years.You can punish for the offense or in other words let the punishment fit the crime.He is NOT a criminal and had circumstances been different in the universe ,he might have been giving his life for some stranger.The hospital should have shown more balls deciphering and cooling down the situation ,that's what all those bright Docs get trained to do. i have no comment on the decision to sue,it is so commonplace today.

This is a sad situation ,I was appalled at the video,no nurse should ever be treated like that.I am very surprised by his behavior because nurses and police usually on the same mission to serve the public.We have so many police /nurse marriages since they have many job related stresses in common,the shift work,holidays away from family,floating to other areas and a very very stressful job.I would never want to be responsible for someone losing their livelihood especially after 30 years.You can punish for the offense or in other words let the punishment fit the crime.He is NOT a criminal and had circumstances been different in the universe ,he might have been giving his life for some stranger.The hospital should have shown more balls deciphering and cooling down the situation ,that's what all those bright Docs get trained to do. i have no comment on the decision to sue,it is so commonplace today.

Why would it be the doctors' role? Who says they are trained to cool down hot headed law enforcement individuals? How about hospital administration?

The Nazi's at the concentration camps were just doing their jobs and how did that work out for them?

Actually, a lot of them suffered no punishment at all. The well-connected ones escaped to Brazil, Canada, AMERICA, and probably other places.

The average ones just went home and resumed life.

Only a very few were tried at Nuremberg, Those convicted either killed themselves or got short sentences (or long sentences but were released before serving much time).

And the Aryan superiority sentiment is alive and well today, so we might very well see a recurrence of Hitler's brand of madness.

He is wrong.No further discussion.Male ego crushed so he comes out with this bs about suing.Stay strong.....

A few VERY important facts:

Alex presented hospital policy that was founded in the local law. Payne refused to abide by it.

Fact: HE DID NOT ATTEMPT A NON-FORCIBLE ARREST. Per his own cam footage, he lunged at her with both hands outstretched before uttering a word. He said "WE'RE DONE HERE" as he tried to lay hands on her. He initiated physical aggression and she backed away out of fear, before he EVER uttered the words "You're under arrest." I'm not a big fan of caps but yeezus, his delusional victimhood makes me rage. The order of behaviors here is CRITICALLY important, and the officer did literally everything wrong.

It should be noted as well that the policy was written in conjunction with and agreed upon by the SLC police department.

As far as her "arrest". The video clearly shows him lunging at her and attempting to smack her cell phone out of her hand while aggressively saying " we're done here". "We're done here" is not the same as " you're under arrest" and I'm not hearing any rights being read to her. In addition at one point he appears to be using an arm bar restraint technique that is actually quite painful. He couldn't have *****'d this up any more if he tried. Well, I guess he could have used deadly force so there's that. Then there's the lieutenant,who should have been fired as well, his complicity in the situation still does not absolve Mr. Payne. If my boss tells me to do something illegal or against policy I'm not going to do it. End of discussion. I'm not sure why this delusional little man thinks he's been victimized but he isn't doing himself any favors with his current behavior and makes me think there is some true psychopathy at play. I'm not normally a vindictive person but I sorely hope he gets what he deserves.

Specializes in Mental Health, Gerontology, Palliative.

I'd like to hope that common sense will prevail.

That said you all live in a country where someone sued successfully because they dropped hot coffee in their own lap.

Specializes in Primary Care, Military.
It should be noted as well that the policy was written in conjunction with and agreed upon by the SLC police department.

As far as her "arrest". The video clearly shows him lunging at her and attempting to smack her cell phone out of her hand while aggressively saying " we're done here". "We're done here" is not the same as " you're under arrest" and I'm not hearing any rights being read to her. In addition at one point he appears to be using an arm bar restraint technique that is actually quite painful. He couldn't have *****'d this up any more if he tried. Well, I guess he could have used deadly force so there's that. Then there's the lieutenant,who should have been fired as well, his complicity in the situation still does not absolve Mr. Payne. If my boss tells me to do something illegal or against policy I'm not going to do it. End of discussion. I'm not sure why this delusional little man thinks he's been victimized but he isn't doing himself any favors with his current behavior and makes me think there is some true psychopathy at play. I'm not normally a vindictive person but I sorely hope he gets what he deserves.

Don't forget that all of this took place over a demand for a legal blood draw on a VICTIM of a police chase. The patient they demanded blood from was not the person the police were chasing, who was actually killed in the crash, but actually an innocent driver hit by the person fleeing police. This victim was a commercial truck driver who also happened to be an auxiliary police officer himself. They wanted to do a legal blood draw on an innocent victim who ended up dying in a crash caused by a high speed police chase gone wrong. What were they trying to prove by obtaining that bloodwork, anyway? That somehow he was to blame for his own death despite the perpetrator being the one to crash into him?

They were trying to decrease liability for a very bad outcome. High speed chases are dangerous. Innocent victims sometimes end up killed in them. This was one of those times. Problem is, a Judge isn't going to order a legal blood draw on an innocent driver caught up in one of those chases and severely injured. Police also have a habit of pushing staff in hospitals to see who is ignorant of the law and will give them what they want "for free" regardless of the legalities.

"I was following orders" didn't work at Nuremberg. Why should it work here?

I'd like to hope that common sense will prevail.

That said you all live in a country where someone sued successfully because they dropped hot coffee in their own lap.

I see you have been taken in by the public smear campaign against the victim. Please educate yourself. McDonalds used to keep their coffee up to 190* for no apparent coherent reason. An elderly woman sustained third degree burns on her genitals and thighs because because of near-boiling coffee. She was in the hospital for over a week and required skin grafts for these injuries. All she asked for was her medical expenses ($20,000 or so) and good old McD's offered her $800. She sued because she was disabled and damaged as a direct result of negligence and because her extremely reasonable request for compensation was rebuffed. A judge ultimately ordered $640,000 and they settled for an undisclosed amount, which means it was probably less than that.

"Other documents obtained from McDonald's showed that from 1982 to 1992 the company had received more than 700 reports of people burned by McDonald's coffee to varying degrees of severity, and had settled claims arising from scalding injuries for more than $500,000.[2] McDonald's quality control manager, Christopher Appleton, testified that this number of injuries was insufficient to cause the company to evaluate its practices. He argued that all foods hotter than 130 °F (54 °C) constituted a burn hazard, and that restaurants had more pressing dangers to worry about." Liebeck v. McDonald's Restaurants - Wikipedia

I'm not sure why this delusional little man thinks he's been victimized but he isn't doing himself any favors with his current behavior and makes me think there is some true psychopathy at play. I'm not normally a vindictive person but I sorely hope he gets what he deserves.

I feel similarly. I dislike the vindictiveness of the increasing practice of people crying that some (relative "little guy") should his/her job for x, y, z things that are nearly always complicated. But this man very clearly became aggressive as a direct result of being told (by a hospital representative during the speaker phone call) that he was "making a huge mistake" and "threatening a nurse." He just lost it. His quasi arrest attempt was nothing more than petulant aggressiveness as a result of choosing to feel that his own authority had been questioned and/or insulted.

The supervisor who who came to the car was quite possibly more appalling and I have no doubt that he is the main problem.

As I recall/not direct quotes:

Why are you involved in this?? You don't have anything to DO with this!!!

Your 'policies' don't affect my legal standing....

You're not trying to understand, you're trying to tell me 'no'

He was just as jacked up as Payne, he showed it through aggressive condescension rather than physical aggression.

There is no excuse for either of these two guys to not have known that under the circumstances they needed a warrant. But that didn't stop them from trying to make someone else look like an obstructionist idiot.

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