ADN's being pushed out

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I work for a large Magnet hospital. As nursing becomes more popular, and nurses not in short supply, I have noticed something ominous has being going on lately. Several of our older and very seasoned ADN nurses are being fired. The excuses for firing are ridiculous. I have sadly seen some excellent nurses lose their jobs. I am wondering if they want to get rid of the ADNs so they can look "better" with an all BSN staff. Or perhaps they want rid of older nurses who have been there longer because they are higher on the pay scale. Either way, it is very scarey. I myself am BSN, and i am not ashamed to say that what I know does not hold a candle to these fired nurses. Any thoughts?

Specializes in CCM, PHN.

At my company, yes. BSNs make $3 more per hour than ADNs to start, but everyone's percentage raise is the same.

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Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.
Scenario: When nurse A with a BSN and nurse B with a ADN get hired, will there be a difference in

starting pay as well as annual raises?

It depends on the facility.

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Specializes in LTC, Agency, HHC.
*** It's not belittling that upsets then. It's the call to eliminate them that is upsetting.

*** Oh really? I have never seen or heard of such studies. Got a link to these studies that "prove" that BSN students are better prepared? Please share and educate us all about theses studies.

*** LOL! Ya right. Among the reasons many hospitals prefer BSN grads is because they like their new employees to have a large student debt. They are seen as being less likely to vote with their feet when faced with unsafe staffing levels or abusive treatment by administration.

The studies are out there. Apparently, ADN's aren't taught EBP? Research? If anyone works for Kaiser, they can tell you about EBP, patient outcomes, and education.

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Specializes in LTC, Agency, HHC.
*** I see, first there are studies that "prove", now they "suggest". That is an AACN opinion piece. Why is it that those who do studies that find that BSN nurses are better are those who stand to gain financially from more BSN nurses?

*** The problem with that is that first, many hospital are dropping Magnet. Magnet is headed towards being a fad of the past. Second nothing about Magnet certification requires a candidate, or certified hospital to hire a certain percentage of BSN prepared staff nurses. There is a requirement for the hospital to have a plan in place to meet the IOM's recommendations. You know the IOM, the organization that is a prime distributor of false "nursing shortage" propaganda.

*** Everybody seems to have their own facts. However when one group is attempting to eliminate the very existence of another, it is normal for those who are to be eliminated to feel defensive and occasionally fight back against their attackers.

The problem is, it isn't the BSN nurses "attempting to eliminate the very existence of another".....it is the hospitals making the choice. Put credit where credit is due (or not.) Don't blame nurses, no matter what the initials behind their name. What is it that you feel you have to defend? Should I feel this way, since RN's are taking the job of LPN's, and my job and career are threatened? Or should I go back to school and ensure (or try to) ensure a stable job, until MSN's replace BSN's, and DNP's replace MSN's....etc, etc.

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Specializes in Adult Internal Medicine.
Scenario: When nurse A with a BSN and nurse B with a ADN get hired, will there be a difference in

starting pay as well as annual raises?

I am not sure if there is more recent data out there, but I know in 2004-2005 in aggregate BSNs averaged about 10% more in salary.

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Specializes in Psych ICU, addictions.
Scenario: When nurse A with a BSN and nurse B with a ADN get hired, will there be a difference in

starting pay as well as annual raises?

Depends. At my last facility, no difference. At this facility, 25-50 cents an hour difference.

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Specializes in Psych ICU, addictions.
The studies are out there. Apparently, ADN's aren't taught EBP? Research? If anyone works for Kaiser, they can tell you about EBP, patient outcomes, and education.

Actually I was taught about research and EBP in my ADN program--I knew and utilized both before I entered the BSN portion. The BSN program covered research and EBP in more depth.

I was also taught about leadership and management in the ADN program...it was all I could do to keep from laughing when I saw the exact same textbook (albeit an edition later) in the BSN program that I used for the ADN program. The content wasn't much different either.

So I guess it depends on the program you're enrolled in...I landed in a good one.

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Specializes in Pediatrics, Emergency, Trauma.

Actually I was taught about research and EBP in my ADN program--I knew and utilized both before I entered the BSN portion. The BSN program covered research and EBP in more depth.

I was also taught about leadership and management in the ADN program...it was all I could do to keep from laughing when I saw the exact same textbook (albeit an edition later) in the BSN program that I used for the ADN program. The content wasn't much different either.

So I guess it depends on the program you're enrolled in...I landed in a good one.

It really depends :yes:...that is not the onus of the student either.

In my area, there are top schools (the IVY leagues), and there are programs where when compared ADN to BSN have the SAME program, same curriculum hours. The difference is getting the degree.

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Wow, I thought all of my co workers were exaggerating, but I see I am doing the right thing by persuing my BSN. I still disagree with this at times. Thank you!

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I have a B.S. in another field. Just so I can look like a tool like all the BSN's with "RN, BSN" on their jackets, I had "RN, BSB" put on mine.

Nursing is the only field that puts their B.S. on their items so maybe it's time those of us with B.S. in another field start doing the same so we can look as exciting.

On a similar note, other careers recognize the B.S. from a wide variety of fields but the self-important leaders of nursing are hell-bent on only recognizing the BSN. Maybe it's time people outside of nursing start saying sorry to the BSN when BSN's are looking to do something else.

I already have a Bachelor's degree. I went later in life and got an ADN. There is absolutely no reason why that shouldn't be recognized as equivalent. I work at a hospital and just recently had a discussion about this with the house supervisor. As we were laughing about the ridiculousness of all of this, she told me she'd prefer me there if she had a heart attack over several of the excellent paper writers we also have on staff.

And on a final note, and I've said this before, I'd like to see states pass legislation that no hospital can receive funds from state unless hospitals employ ADNs. Roughly 55%-60% of new RNs are ADNs and the Magnet arrogance will screw (and already is) with too many people as 2020 approaches. You can bet your behind I've already discussed this with my local state Senator and House representative.

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Specializes in Critical Care.
Nurse B with an ADN is a better nurse B with a doctorate. That is the "theory".

I don't think anyone is arguing that but then again I think you're missing the argument.

I don't doubt I'm better off in general because I have a bachelor's degree in addition to my BSN, and I'd probably be better off if I had a doctorate, or even better, two doctorates. So it only makes sense we should require all Nurses to have two bachelors degrees, and two doctorates, right?

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Specializes in Critical Care.
I am not sure if there is more recent data out there, but I know in 2004-2005 in aggregate BSNs averaged about 10% more in salary.

You're implying more causation than actually exists. Nurses in metropolitan areas make more on average due to cost of living, adjusted for cost of living they make about the same. With BSN programs concentrated in metropolitan areas, you're more likely to find BSN nurses in these areas.

So no, it's not that Nurses average significantly more because they have a BSN, they average more because they live in metropolitan areas, which also means they are more likely to have a BSN.

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