What do you think about with current News and Opinions?

MunoRN, RN · Nov 10, 2021

30 minutes ago, Beerman said:

A little revisionism, eeh?

Cuomo sent covid positive patients to nursing homes. Thousands died. He then covered up how many died. Not to mention he wrote a book celebrating his leadership through it all. So, to say it wasn't based on anything legit is laughable.

Here's a little recap of some if it:

https://www.nytimes.com/article/andrew-cuomo-nursing-home-deaths.html

You article doesn't appear to offer any support for the claim, just points out that it is a claim that's been made.

I'm open to whatever rationale you might have as to why it makes sense that it was nursing home patients who were returning to nursing homes after being in hospital as a result of contracting Covid at the nursing home they are referring to, but the first problem is this idea seems to involve elderly people using a time machine. How does someone introduce Covid to a nursing home some period of time after it was already spreading the nursing home?

To say "Cuomo sent covid positive patients to nursing homes" is misleading. "Covid positive" and being contagious with Covid are two very different things. Covid tests look for remnants of Covid RNA, which is present for many weeks after the person is no longer transmissible.

Even in the hospital, we move our Covid patients out of the Covid isolation unit and into the general hospital population typically 2 weeks after the onset of symptoms, because at that point they are well past having replicative Covid in their system (they are no longer contagious).

Here's the only study that actually looked at tracing the spread of Covid to nursing home residents, which found that it was primarily visitors and staff who introduced Covid into these facilities: https://www.health.ny.gov/press/releases/2020/docs/nh_factors_report.pdf

Your article does correctly point out that NY changed their reporting criteria, although they changed it to match how every other state was reporting their data (Covid deaths reported based on where the deaths occurred). I certainly don't disagree that Cuomo didn't like the differing criteria for reporting not because it was a non-sensical way of doing it but because he wanted to make the number of deaths among nursing home residents to look lower, but that's what scoundrels do.

42 minutes ago, Beerman said:

Rules can't be changed? Especially when emergency hospital beds were constructed and went unused?

At the time, neither the field hospitals nor the hospital ship were taking nursing home residents or hospital patients except for elective surgeries.

44 minutes ago, Beerman said:

Biden the day after the travel ban was implemented:

"We are in the midst of a crisis with the coronavirus. We need to lead the way with science — not Donald Trump’s record of hysteria, xenophobia, and fear-mongering. He is the worst possible person to lead our country through a global health emergency."

Is that an example of him claiming the travel ban was racist? Where do you see the reference to travel restrictions?

47 minutes ago, Beerman said:

And, there were others, as I'm sure you know.

No, there weren't others.

Beerman, BSN · Nov 10, 2021

6 hours ago, heron said:

Interesting little manifesto from someone who “suggested” that a member who disagrees with him stop commenting and move along.

That poster called my opinions and thoughts "irrelevant", so not sure why they'd want to take the time to reply to them.

Tweety, BSN, RN · Nov 10, 2021

Guess it's a slow news day. Over at Fox News the lead story, meaning the most important story at the moment with about four connecting stories about the "Democrat Elite" is that Pelosi isn't wearing a mask at a wedding where no on is wearing a mask and children are required to wear a mask at school.

Apparently in the area masks are not required for vaccinated adults in the area the wedding is. It doesn't mention what the rate of vaccination is for school aged children.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/pelosi-mask

I have read in our local news that California's covid rate is twice Floridas and that they are continuing mask mandates in some areas but not sure Pelosi's wedding appearance like Tucker Carlson stated "shows their own contempt for their own public health measures".

It guess it's fair to mock her since she's such a big mask proponent in Washington.

https://www.tampabay.com/news/florida/2021/11/07/californias-covid-19-case-rate-now-twice-floridas/?itm_source=porificely-api

toomuchbaloney · Nov 10, 2021

7 hours ago, Beerman said:

LOL! Under his watch, the federal govt paved the way for one of the most effective vaccines there has ever been to be developed in far less time than the experts said could be done.

What has the current President done?

Yes...paved the way by lying and creating conflict in mitigation and publicly disagreeing with the scientists before suggesting they are responsibly for his failures. He paved the way by setting public example for misinformation and distrust of health experts. Trump was a big portion of this phenomenon before he got banned from social media.

The current president inherited that politicized pandemic with politically motivated citizens who refused to follow any of the public health guidance and managed to undertake a massive vaccination distribution program. The current president allows the pandemic response experts to conduct the own regular press briefings where they provide the newest guidance and answer questions without politicization.

We're you unable to discern a shift in federal government priority and messaging relative to Covid after Trump lost the presidency?

Beerman, BSN · Nov 10, 2021

7 hours ago, MunoRN said:

You article doesn't appear to offer any support for the claim, just points out that it is a claim that's been made.

True. But it was heavily implied. You would think they might have mentioned that there was no basis for the claim if that was believed. But, it is the NYT, and they had turned on n him by then.

7 hours ago, MunoRN said:

I'm open to whatever rationale you might have as to why it makes sense that it was nursing home patients who were returning to nursing homes after being in hospital as a result of contracting Covid at the nursing home they are referring to, but the first problem is this idea seems to involve elderly people using a time machine. How does someone introduce Covid to a nursing home some period of time after it was already spreading the nursing home?

As we've discussed before, only about 25% of nursing home admissions were readmissions.

7 hours ago, MunoRN said:

Here's the only study that actually looked at tracing the spread of Covid to nursing home residents, which found that it was primarily visitors and staff who introduced Covid into these facilities: https://www.health.ny.gov/press/releases/2020/docs/nh_factors_report.pdf

I'm stunned this is your source. It's not the only study, but probably the only one produced by and had key data omitted by the Cuomo administration.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/04/nyregion/cuomo-nursing-home-deaths.html?smid=tw-share

https://www.wsj.com/articles/cuomo-advisers-altered-report-on-covid-19-nursing-home-deaths-11614910855?mod=hp_lead_pos10

Perhaps this study, done by the organization that led to the NYDOH to finally release revised statistics, might be more accurate.

https://www.empirecenter.org/publications/admissions-were-correlated-with-higher-death-rates/

7 hours ago, MunoRN said:

At the time, neither the field hospitals nor the hospital ship were taking nursing home residents or hospital patients except for elective surgeries.

Not rocket science, here. Have them accept nursing home residents. My local Ortho hospital stopped elective surgeries and took overflow from the attached acute care hospital.

The field hospitals were mostly if not totally empty. Not even elective surgery patients.

7 hours ago, MunoRN said:

Is that an example of him claiming the travel ban was racist? Where do you see the reference to travel restrictions?

He made that statement the day after. Just coincidence, I suppose. What do you suppose he was referring to?

7 hours ago, MunoRN said:

No, there weren't others.

Bernie Sanders was at least one.

We've gone around on all this a few times. Have the last word if it'll make you feel better. I'm done.

toomuchbaloney · Nov 10, 2021

Chris Wallace points out that in a post Trump America, we can't even agree on facts. The spreading of lies about elections or January 6 is un-American. Of course, a good bit of those lies have a home on Fox content, especially in programming like Tucker Carlson.

Tweety, BSN, RN · Nov 10, 2021

1 hour ago, Beerman said:

We've gone around on all this a few times. Have the last word if it'll make you feel better. I'm done.

Good. Because we've already had this discussion several times this past year.

But you know sooner or later someone will chime in, maybe months from now "where's the outrage about Cuomo sending nursing home patients to their death". (along with Trump made the vaccine possible).

Because as you say, people just can't help themselves. It makes them feel better about Trump's overall performance around covid.

Beerman, BSN · Nov 10, 2021

37 minutes ago, Tweety said:

Good. Because we've already had this discussion several times this past year.

But you know sooner or later someone will chime in, maybe months from now "where's the outrage about Cuomo sending nursing home patients to their death". (along with Trump made the vaccine possible).

Because as you say, people just can't help themselves. It makes them feel better about Trump's overall performance around covid.

It was others who brought up the tired, repeated falsehoods about Trump not doing anything for covid, and Cuomo not being responsible for any nursing home deaths. I guess they can't help themselves.

I didn't bring up those topics. It's too bad you're bothered that I again had to shoot those falsehoods down.

Cclm, LPN · Nov 10, 2021

12 hours ago, Beerman said:

I'll post my opinions when I feel like it. No one silences me. I had a lot of time today, but usually I'm not to inclined to spend so I much time here. There's only a handful here, and Tweety is really the only one reasonable one on "the other side" that has a open mind, and whose opion I respect.

This is more of a entertaining diversion than anything to take to too serious.

I agree. Tweety is a sweety! We can converse and even have positive admiration for someone we do not always agree with! The other ones, not so much.

I believe 100% that if any of the "others" could find out my identity they would dox me. People like them will not think twice about ruining someone's life they don't agree with. You know for diversity!

Tweety, BSN, RN · Nov 10, 2021

1 hour ago, Beerman said:

It was others who brought up the tired, repeated falsehoods about Trump not doing anything for covid, and Cuomo not being responsible for any nursing home deaths. I guess they can't help themselves.

I didn't bring up those topics. It's too bad you're bothered that I again had to shoot those falsehoods down.

I don't recall that it was you that brought Cuomo up yet again and I'm not "bothered" but rather tired of the sameo sameo default to this issue. Many times when Trump is criticized, rightly so, for his covid response there's the "what about Cuomo".

But good on you for debunking what you don't think is true. Cuomo was a lying narcissistic fool playing it by ear without a guidebook. My opinion is that it probably wasn't the best thing to do and nursing home deaths did indeed rise. They also rose everywhere, worse here in Florida and as a percentage of overall deaths in New York it was much lower than dozens of other states. New Jersey, Pennsylvania and Michigan did the same thing. I've read that about 1/3rd of covid deaths are linked to nursing homes. I don't have any data but most likely it was infected people bringing to them rather than other residents being discharged from hospitals, since most of them went on quarantine for a while. But I've already made that point haven't I? Can't help myself.

I've also made it clear that I'm tired of Trump.

But when were we talking about the Senator that tweeted the anime you deflected to Biden's mental decline.

We can't help ourselves when something pushes our buttons. I do it too.

Tweety, BSN, RN · Nov 10, 2021

21 minutes ago, Cclm said:

People like them will not think twice about ruining someone's life they don't agree with. You know for diversity!

That's a bit of a stretch. Most of us have to live and work among republicans and have republican family members and don't go about destroying their lives for a difference of opinion.

I have seen people go after really dreadful people like those that participate in white supremacy movements, and those "Karens" that scream about having a wear a mask.

While we're on the subject, republicans are tossing around the idea of "punishing" those that voted for the infrastructure bill. They've outed them on Twitter and are making a big deal out of their difference of opinion.

While it might not ruin their lives, it might hurt them in getting re-elected or just disillusion them.

I don't see the Democrats going after the dreadful squad for acting like brats and for voting against the infrastructure bill.

Thanks for the compliment. ?

https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/will-republicans-punish-members-who-backed-infrastructure-deal-n1283565

subee, MSN, CRNA · Nov 10, 2021

15 hours ago, MunoRN said:

You article doesn't appear to offer any support for the claim, just points out that it is a claim that's been made.

I'm open to whatever rationale you might have as to why it makes sense that it was nursing home patients who were returning to nursing homes after being in hospital as a result of contracting Covid at the nursing home they are referring to, but the first problem is this idea seems to involve elderly people using a time machine. How does someone introduce Covid to a nursing home some period of time after it was already spreading the nursing home?

To say "Cuomo sent covid positive patients to nursing homes" is misleading. "Covid positive" and being contagious with Covid are two very different things. Covid tests look for remnants of Covid RNA, which is present for many weeks after the person is no longer transmissible.

Even in the hospital, we move our Covid patients out of the Covid isolation unit and into the general hospital population typically 2 weeks after the onset of symptoms, because at that point they are well past having replicative Covid in their system (they are no longer contagious).

Here's the only study that actually looked at tracing the spread of Covid to nursing home residents, which found that it was primarily visitors and staff who introduced Covid into these facilities: https://www.health.ny.gov/press/releases/2020/docs/nh_factors_report.pdf

Your article does correctly point out that NY changed their reporting criteria, although they changed it to match how every other state was reporting their data (Covid deaths reported based on where the deaths occurred). I certainly don't disagree that Cuomo didn't like the differing criteria for reporting not because it was a non-sensical way of doing it but because he wanted to make the number of deaths among nursing home residents to look lower, but that's what scoundrels do.

At the time, neither the field hospitals nor the hospital ship were taking nursing home residents or hospital patients except for elective surgeries.

Is that an example of him claiming the travel ban was racist? Where do you see the reference to travel restrictions?

No, there weren't others.

The lack of field hospitals was explained to beerman before but he refuses to accept the actual history. That would require research.

.