Hearing on H.R. 4292, the "Born Alive Infant Protection Act of 2000"
July 20, 2000
I am a Registered Nurse who has worked in the Labor & Delivery Department at Christ Hospital in Oak Lawn, Illinois, for the past five years. Christ Hospital performs abortions on women in their second or even third trimesters of pregnancy. Sometimes the babies being aborted are healthy, and sometimes they are not.
The method of abortion that Christ Hospital uses is called "induced labor abortion," also now known as "live birth abortion." This type of abortion can be performed different ways, but the goal always is to cause a pregnant woman's cervix to open so that she will deliver a premature baby who dies during the birth process or soon afterward. The way that induced abortion is most often executed at my hospital is by the physician inserting a medication called Cytotec into the birth canal close to the cervix. Cytotec irritates the cervix and stimulates it to open. When this occurs, the small, preterm baby drops out of the uterus, oftentimes alive. It is not uncommon for one of these live aborted babies to linger for an hour or two or even longer. One of them once lived for almost eight hours.
In the event that a baby is aborted alive, he or she receives no medical assessments or care but is only given what my hospital calls "comfort care." "Comfort care" is defined as keeping the baby warm in a blanket until he or she dies, although even this minimal compassion is not always provided. It is not required that these babies be held during their short lives.
One night, a nursing co-worker was taking an aborted Down's Syndrome baby who was born alive to our Soiled Utility Room because his parents did not want to hold him, and she did not have time to hold him. I could not bear the thought of this suffering child dying alone in a Soiled Utility Room, so I cradled and rocked him for the 45 minutes that he lived. He was 21 to 22 weeks old, weighed about ½ pound, and was about 10 inches long. He was too weak to move very much, expending any energy he had trying to breathe. Toward the end he was so quiet that I couldn't tell if he was still alive unless I held him up to the light to see if his heart was still beating through his chest wall. After he was pronounced dead, we folded his little arms across his chest, wrapped him in a tiny shroud, and carried him to the hospital morgue where all of our dead patients are taken.
Other co-workers have told me many upsetting stories about live aborted babies whom they have cared for. I was told about an aborted baby who was supposed to have Spina bifida but was delivered with an intact spine. Another nurse is haunted by the memory of an aborted baby who came out weighing much more than expected ~ almost two pounds. She is haunted because she doesn't know if she made a mistake by not getting that baby medical help. A Support Associate told me about a live aborted baby who was left to die on the counter of the Soiled Utility Room wrapped in a disposable towel. This baby was accidentally thrown into the garbage, and when they later were going through the trash to find the baby, the baby fell out of the towel and on to the floor.
I was recently told about a situation by a nurse who said, "I can't stop thinking about it." She had a patient who was 23+ weeks pregnant, and it did not look as if her baby would be able to continue to live inside of her. The baby was healthy and had up to a 39% chance of survival, according to national statistics. But the patient chose to abort. The baby was born alive. If the mother had wanted everything done for her baby, there would have been a neonatologist, pediatric resident, neonatal nurse, and respiratory therapist present for the delivery, and the baby would have been taken to our Neonatal Intensive Care Unit for specialized care. Instead, the only personnel present for this delivery were an obstetrical resident and my co-worker. After delivery the baby, who showed early signs of thriving, was merely wrapped in a blanket and kept in the Labor & Delivery Department until she died 2-1/2 hours later.
Something is very wrong with a legal system that says doctors are mandated to pronounce babies dead but are not mandated to assess babies for life and chances of survival. In other words, our laws currently say that babies have no rights to medical oversight until they are dead. We look the other way and pretend that these babies aren't human while they're alive but human only after they are dead. We issue these babies both birth and death certificates, but it is really only the death certificate that matters. No other children in America are medically abandoned like this.
Abortion is a cancer that is literally killing America. It is killing our children while it is killing our consciences. It began when we took God out of our decision-making and proclaimed that the little beings growing inside of women were "products of conception" and not little girls and little boys. Who should be surprised that we keep pushing the envelope so that now we are aborting these "products of conception" alive? I even work at a hospital named "Christ" that does this very thing! It is beyond me to comprehend that we're doing what we're doing now, and so I can't even imagine what horrible ways we will think of next to torture our children. Please help put an end to this by proclaiming infants as American human being homo sapiens with the same legal and medical rights that you and I big people have. Thank you.
Specializes in Case Mgmt; Mat/Child, Critical Care.
Originally posted by tamrnmomof4
The whole partial birth abortion thing has really got me upset, I just see it as a slippery slope, so if what I am reading is correct a just reason for having one could be if there were anomalies
that the parents were not capable of dealing with such as downs syndrome or spinal bifita . Sooo what happens if a baby is born with conditions that the parents were not aware of before hand...should they after the birth have the right to put a pair of scissors in the back of the babies skull and kill it. The only difference is a few precious inches....be honest about:o
I understand what you're saying about partial birth abortions in relation to fetal anomalies. I do. You're right, it is horrible. But please try and keep in mind that this is an awful situation for the parents/the mother. I mean, I work with this every day, and I see it go both ways, women who, after lots of anguish, make the decision, not only for themselves, but for the baby, that they just can not carry the fetus to term. Most of the time it is involving fetuses w/anomalies that are incompatible w/life, or will result in severe mental retardatuion, blindness, seizure d/o, never progressing past the stage of a baby, being in diapers for life, being fed via tube, etc, etc. The hard part is, a lot of the time, these anomalies are not brought to light until the 2nd trimester. Some women do opt to end the pregnancy. Some don't.
We see those babies in NICU, where they experience pain, pain, pain, most end up dying anyway. Then some do make it...to go home, sometimes to an ill equipped home, very little support for the parents, a huge financial burden and the child having very little quality of life. They usually end up in and out of the hospital and then a good percentage end up dying w/in the first 1 - 3 yrs. We just lost one of our 3yo the other day like this. His whole little life was in and out of the hospital, sufferring. So sad.
If you are truly concerned for the life of this baby, try and see it from this light...really, who can say if it is humane to do this to a child. I never truly new the extent of sufferring these babies endure and their long term outcomes until I started working NICU, over a yr. ago. Before, as and L&D nurse, I saw the sufferring the woman/family go through during this horrible time...terminating a pregnancy for anomalies/defects.
And yes, there are babies born that there was no prior knowledge of a defect....I'm sorry, that does not compare to knowing ahead of time, spending time and making a decision that will change your life.
Maybe you could say it's like end of life directives, perhaps you have always told your loved ones....don't keep me alive artificially...I dion't want to live like a vegetable, without dignity, let me go, if there's no hope for recovery, etc. There was time to think about that and make that decision, versus a loved one getting in an accident or having cardiac arrest, or some other life threatening icident, of course, spontaneously, we say "do all you can" "save my spouse/parent/child...etc". You act out of emotion, naturally.
There is a difference, it is the knowledge and information you have.... the ability to make a change before the fact. It is not easy for anyone to make these decisions, for any loved one, especially for a baby...
I do see your point moondancer...but I also work in Labor and Delivery, I have a hard time with the fact that this procedure is not only being used for anomalies that end in death anyway but for children with downs syndrome, spinal bifita....or just because their boyfriend just left them...all I am saying is that this is a barbaric way to end the life of a baby. Something else to consider is that they have the option in 47 states to leave the baby in a safe place and never face prosecution. I can already hear the replys coming on that one, but is that any worse of an option then killing the baby???
I have a hard time with the fact that this procedure is not only being used for anomalies that end in death anyway
Tammy
I agree with that!
I can't believe this subject has gotten me so torn up. I went to my mom's house for dinner yesterday and brought it up with her. Her comment was that when people strongly believe one way or the other "you won't change their mind and they won't change yours". That makes a lot of sense as we've seen on here ... I have learned alot from allnurses, I don't plan to stop learning b/c I can't take a step back. I will step back and just read for awhile.
Do you remember the first time you saw, "products of conception?' Have you noticed how surprised your co-workers were when they saw them for the first time? We all would agree that we were expecting to see a blob of tissue or something that might look like a fish.
Let me say this again, ROE VS. WADE DID NOT LEGALIZE ABORTION. It did say that the federal government has no interest in the matter.
What has happened is that the medical industry saw a way to make a lot of money by killing babies. No, it's not murder, the Supreme Court says so. Do you think every couple who engages in unprotected sex realizes that they may be making a baby?
When does life begin? Were all of you nurses absent the day your biology 101 instructor covered prophase? A human being is 46 chromosomes.
What differentiates me from other liberals is that I believe in a woman's right to choose from the time she is CONCEIVED. :kiss
I have learned alot from allnurses, I don't plan to stop learning b/c I can't take a step back. I will step back and just read for awhile.
What a great point!! Even though I do not agree with what everyone has posted on the BB, I do admit that I have learned a lot and the great thing about this country is that we can have different opinions!! I hope that is one thing that we can all agree on. My last point!!! (at least I hope) Maybe we can think of abortion on a pendulum and before Roe V Wade it was all the way to the right with no legal abortion...and now it is all the way to the Left with late term abortions on demand for any reason, maybe we can settle on a middle ground. Even though Fergus, LD oh, and LPN to Be, Moondancer we do not agree, I do respect your opinions...Thank you!
I keep hearing the argument that we will be back to "back alley" abortions.
In my 20 years as an ER nurse, I saw many botched abortions. These were all done by some "doctor", who was nowhere to be found when their patient needed them. They came to my hospital for an emergency transfusion, and a D&C/hysterctomy to save moms life.
I have also seen what happens to a woman who has had several abortions and then attempts to carry a baby to term. The uterus just says, "I guess she doesn't want a baby so I guess I'll just end this pregnacy before she can."
Owney, you can't dispute the facts that before Roe v Wade women were routinely dying from botched abortions. Today abortion is safer than pregnancy and childbirth from a medical perspective, although no procedure is without risks.
As for when life begins, that's not a black and white issue. I don't think simply having a certain number of chromosomes makes a human, or every woman who uses the pill or depo has commited murder.
I am pro-choice but I am shocked that babies are delivered alive and left to die alone in a closet. That is horrific. I also find the idea of partial birth abortions to be very disturbing. If the mother's life is in danger or the fetus has serious health problems, then late term abortions should be available. But to use late term abortions as a method of birth control is unconscionable.
I believe only God has the right to judge us and our actions, so I do not pass judgment on the women who have these types of abortions, but it is something I would never do or participate in.
1) Have you ever fallen down? Taken a spill in a puddle? Slipped on icy concrete? Tripped over your own feet going up or down the stairs? I'm assuming that the answer is yes. When did you learn to walk? Have you not been walking for longer than you are even conscious of? Since, what, two years old? Younger? (I don't have kids! When do they walk?!?) Shouldn't you know by now how to get around on your own two feet? My point is this: Accidents happen.
2) I honestly would like to know why (because this hasn't really been addressed yet) not wanting to have a baby is not justification enough? Let's look at the "safe haven" issue. Many hospitals offer anonymous, legally protected drop-off drawers for infants. Do you know who uses these drawers to drop off their babies? I can almost guarantee that the majority of these women dropping off their babies are poor, "underprivelaged", poorly educated women with little/no access to PNC and, likely, multiple children at home that they already cannot feed. Babies from these circumstances are more likely to be born pre-term. They are more likely to have been exposed in utero to harmful substances, both environmental and purposely ingested by mom. Do you realize how difficult for the social services department to PLACE these babies into a home? I don't think I'm exaggerating in the least here when I tell you if the baby 'aint pink, fat, and healthy, it's going to have a hell of a time being placed. Babies who are not Caucasian ALREADY have the cards stacked against them, statistically speaking- that's not even mentioning those with developmental delays or greater, more handicapping defects (both those obvious at birth and not). People simply do not want (not ALL people, but MANY and I'd wager MOST) or are not capable of handling the needs of some of these children, which automatically damns them to a lengthy (if they're lucky enough not to die from lack of/poor healthcare) childhood in which they may never know what loving touch feels like. So why, then, is being able to admit to yourself that you, in fact, may NOT be capable of birthing/raising a child, no matter HOW it was conceived (accidentally, on purpose, mistakenly), considered a bad thing? The world we live in is struggling mightily, and there are tons of hungry and emotionally/physically neglected kids out there who would die to be placed with a family. The need to be loved doesn't stop when you turn three or four or whatever age most people decide is too old for them to adopt ("But we really wanted a BABY..."). We do not (and again, this is my opinion) need to be bringing more children into this world that we are not prepared to take care of. Are you personally going to shoulder the responsibility? Hardly. I feel that a woman who can make the decision that, yes, I would make a horrible mother, or no, I'm not ready to give my all to this child is making a laudable decision- one that I support, no matter if I'd choose the same thing or not were I in her circumstances. Should I have a baby that I am not emotionally/financially/physically/mentally ready for because someone else wants to adopt it? I think not. There are tons of kids out there who need adoption. Those looking to expand their families can adopt one or more of them. I (as a pregnant woman) don't owe anyone a baby; certainly not someone who I've never even met. JMO.
Good post, NICU_Nurse, and thank you for making the point. I get somewhat annoyed when people start talking about how it's okay with them for a woman to have an abortion if she was raped or the fetus has some kind of anomaly, or has some other "correct" reason. The whole point of Roe v. Wade is that it's not the government's (or anyone else's!) business why a woman, her partner (if applicable), and her physician have decided that this is the right choice for her.
Why, for heaven's sake, would we want to make ANY woman bear a child she doesn't want to have????? I'm a child psych nurse and have seen plenty more than my share of kids who would have been MUCH better off if the pregnancy had just been terminated. I'm sure you can imagine that I could tell you stories that would curl your hair. I hate to sound ghoulish, but, if it were up to me, there would be a lot more abortions done than there are now ...
As for the "dropping off" the baby/adoption option, NICU_Nurse is right on the money. I would add that the morbidity/mortality statistics are much better for abortion than for childbirth -- carrying the fetus to term and delivering is a much greater risk to the life and health of the woman than terminating the pregnancy. Why should she have to continue the pregnancy and give birth, and take on that risk, inconvenience, and physical discomfort, to accommodate someone else's personal beliefs that she does not share? And, finally, why should she have to justify that decision to ANY uninvolved third party?
Thank goodness I only have to make difficult decisions about my OWN life, not anyone else's ...
Slipping and falling equals killing a baby? This is what abortion has done to our views of the sanctity of life. This poster also forgets that many many abortions are gotten by women and girls of affluent and middle class means.
Death is better off than the life that these people deem unacceptable? Maybe we should just kill these poor children after they are born after we assess their home life if their outlook is so utterly doomed.
gypsyatheart
705 Posts
I understand what you're saying about partial birth abortions in relation to fetal anomalies. I do. You're right, it is horrible. But please try and keep in mind that this is an awful situation for the parents/the mother. I mean, I work with this every day, and I see it go both ways, women who, after lots of anguish, make the decision, not only for themselves, but for the baby, that they just can not carry the fetus to term. Most of the time it is involving fetuses w/anomalies that are incompatible w/life, or will result in severe mental retardatuion, blindness, seizure d/o, never progressing past the stage of a baby, being in diapers for life, being fed via tube, etc, etc. The hard part is, a lot of the time, these anomalies are not brought to light until the 2nd trimester. Some women do opt to end the pregnancy. Some don't.
We see those babies in NICU, where they experience pain, pain, pain, most end up dying anyway. Then some do make it...to go home, sometimes to an ill equipped home, very little support for the parents, a huge financial burden and the child having very little quality of life. They usually end up in and out of the hospital and then a good percentage end up dying w/in the first 1 - 3 yrs. We just lost one of our 3yo the other day like this. His whole little life was in and out of the hospital, sufferring. So sad.
If you are truly concerned for the life of this baby, try and see it from this light...really, who can say if it is humane to do this to a child. I never truly new the extent of sufferring these babies endure and their long term outcomes until I started working NICU, over a yr. ago. Before, as and L&D nurse, I saw the sufferring the woman/family go through during this horrible time...terminating a pregnancy for anomalies/defects.
And yes, there are babies born that there was no prior knowledge of a defect....I'm sorry, that does not compare to knowing ahead of time, spending time and making a decision that will change your life.
Maybe you could say it's like end of life directives, perhaps you have always told your loved ones....don't keep me alive artificially...I dion't want to live like a vegetable, without dignity, let me go, if there's no hope for recovery, etc. There was time to think about that and make that decision, versus a loved one getting in an accident or having cardiac arrest, or some other life threatening icident, of course, spontaneously, we say "do all you can" "save my spouse/parent/child...etc". You act out of emotion, naturally.
There is a difference, it is the knowledge and information you have.... the ability to make a change before the fact. It is not easy for anyone to make these decisions, for any loved one, especially for a baby...