Valid Reasons To Not Get Vaccinated

[jive turkey]

Whether you're in support of the COVID vaccine, against it,  or on the fence please use this particular thread to cite credible, evidence-based sources to share with everyone so we can engage in a discussion that revolves around LEARNING.  

I'll start:

The primary concerns I've shared with others have to do with how effective the vaccine is for those who have already been infected.  I've reviewed studies and reports in that regard.  There are medical professionals I've listened to that, in my personal opinion,  don't offer a definitive answer. 

Here are some links to 2 different, I'll start with just 2:

Cleveland Clinic Statement on Previous COVID-19 Infection Research

Reduced Risk of Reinfection with SARS-CoV-2 After COVID-19 Vaccination — Kentucky, May–June 2021

[toomuchbaloney]

1 hour ago, Orca said:

It's prevalent in rural Nevada. Some of my colleagues and I were tasked with talking with employees at one of our rural facilities to encourage vaccination. I would have gotten about as far having a conversation with the wall.

A wall would have had a flat affect and might have echoed some of your words back at you...I bet that's not your experience.  I get it.  I'm in Alaska. 

[Orca, ADN, ASN, RN]

1 hour ago, toomuchbaloney said:

A wall would have had a flat affect and might have echoed some of your words back at you...I bet that's not your experience.  I get it.  I'm in Alaska. 

Good point.

We heard a lot of irrational statements and ill-informed arguments. Some of them apparently plan to test the state's resolve, as my agency has since gone under a governor's mandate requiring vaccination due to our level of potential exposure. Those who fail to comply will be dismissed from state service.

As for me, I started the Moderna series in January, completed it in February, and I got my booster last month.

[klone, MSN, RN]

It's more than just location - it's political ideology and level of education. It's more likely to be found amongst people who are politically conservative, as well as less educated. And you're more likely to find those types in rural areas (such as much of the midwest), as well as southeastern states.

[amoLucia]

FTR, I am vaccinated. Just re-upped in the army of Fauci's Ouchies.

Boostered on Wednesday.

[toomuchbaloney]

5 minutes ago, klone said:

It's more than just location - it's political ideology and level of education. It's more likely to be found amongst people who are politically conservative, as well as less educated. And you're more likely to find those types in rural areas (such as much of the midwest), as well as southeastern states.

In my family the loudly unvaccinated are generally college educated and upper middle class.  They are deeply committed to conservative media in all formats including right wing radio. They frequently share crazy conspiracy theories and debunked videos as evidence to support their beliefs.  It's alarming how many Americans have fallen for a wide variety of cons and lies.  

[subee, MSN, CRNA]

1 hour ago, toomuchbaloney said:

In my family the loudly unvaccinated are generally college educated and upper middle class.  They are deeply committed to conservative media in all formats including right wing radio. They frequently share crazy conspiracy theories and debunked videos as evidence to support their beliefs.  It's alarming how many Americans have fallen for a wide variety of cons and lies.  

Just goes to show that going to college doesn't assure an education.  We have to be auto-didacts forever to keep our brains nimble.  

[toomuchbaloney]

57 minutes ago, subee said:

Just goes to show that going to college doesn't assure an education.  We have to be auto-didacts forever to keep our brains nimble.  

In fact I recently asked my old friend and roommate when he decided that a lazy intellect was acceptable after he sent me some crazy Tucker Carlson video.  Holy moly. 

[DesiDani]

It is cringe worthy and ironically productive for someone to get the vaccine solely out the realization that they will lose their source of income if they do not.

Sure they got the vaccine and that is beneficial to them and the society in whole, but they will not feel good about getting the vaccine and resentful about it. But hey at least they got it. So all is good.

[JKL33]

I believe that we haven't given enough consideration to the fact that in our large country we citizens live vastly different lifestyles. Life is very, very different between urban areas, suburbs and sporificely populated rural areas.

Overlooking this did have some negative effect on our messaging and education related to covid-19 in my estimation.

Personally I think that calling people stupid and approaching mockery of their way of life is the easy way out and is inaccurate in that it lacks necessary contexts. Which has led to more fighting. I can tell you that, for better or worse, when I was a child (in my region) the people considered stupid and/or pitiful were the ones who couldn't do things like fix their own vehicle, maintain their own home, run a small business, grow and preserve their own food, etc.--anyone who has to work for someone else and then use most of their hard-earned money to pay people to do all the many things they don't know how to do and/or who are dumb enough to then spend most of their hard-earned money entertaining themselves.

Unless we personally have spent significant time immersed in totally different living situations (regions, populations, etc) then we really don't know jack about the other areas. I haven't met too many people who loved 2+ disparate living situations in the U.S. (e.g. grew up in NYC and loved it then lived the next 15 years in a town of 5-10K people...or just not near any kind of town whatsoever...and loved that too, or vice versa).

I don't know what any of this means. It's just been bothering me during this whole pandemic. I guess it drives me nuts that (some) otherwise capable people have gone off the rails with covid-related suspicions, and it also drives me nuts that because of that, there are (some) other very average people who are really enjoying being able to consider themselves perched high above. I have nothing to feel sorry for myself about but it has definitely been a weird kind of heartache to be fully supportive of public health efforts while populations around me, whom I "get"/understand due to common upbringing, etc., (some fellow citizens, some friends, acquaintances and a few family) refuse to see things my way...and are thus vilified and basically considered the stupidest of the stupid.

[toomuchbaloney]

6 hours ago, JKL33 said:

refuse to see things my way...and are thus vilified and basically considered the stupidest of the stupid.

Nah

Is not seeing the way of an individual...it's the public health recommendations for an entire country because of a national health emergency...it's far more than a difference of opinion.  It's our civic duty.

It's stupid to believe liars. It's stupid to argue with experts.  It's stupid to refuse to vaccinate with safe and effective vaccines while in the middle of a pandemic. 

 

[JKL33]

3 hours ago, toomuchbaloney said:

It's stupid to argue with experts. 

Often it is. In this case it definitely isn't wise.

However, if you consider the number of individual professionals and entities that are either in some way authoritative or hold themselves out as knowing what they're talking about or who would be considered expert to some degree, that is not always a recipe for success.

It seems there are probably innumerable situations in which "it's stupid to argue with experts" just lacks nuance to a point of fault.

 

3 hours ago, toomuchbaloney said:

Nah

Is not seeing the way of an individual...

Yes, I meant what I wrote. I know it is important to you to keep making your point over and over and over, but what I was talking about...the reason I chose the word "heartache" (which is not my usual speed) is because of how it feels that people who know me and/or are acquainted with me enough that they should know that I've always interacted with them in a trustworthy manner and that I'm not a moron...yet decide to place little value in those facts when they are unsure of information coming from a public authority. Meanwhile, in other ways, they are (loosely) kin/share some commonalities with me and I have some level of understanding of their way of life.

As someone who has received vax 1, 2 and now 3, my post was simply a comment related to the intricacies of humanity. It would be fine to just leave it at that.

[subee, MSN, CRNA]

9 hours ago, JKL33 said:

I believe that we haven't given enough consideration to the fact that in our large country we citizens live vastly different lifestyles. Life is very, very different between urban areas, suburbs and sporificely populated rural areas.

Overlooking this did have some negative effect on our messaging and education related to covid-19 in my estimation.

Personally I think that calling people stupid and approaching mockery of their way of life is the easy way out and is inaccurate in that it lacks necessary contexts. Which has led to more fighting. I can tell you that, for better or worse, when I was a child (in my region) the people considered stupid and/or pitiful were the ones who couldn't do things like fix their own vehicle, maintain their own home, run a small business, grow and preserve their own food, etc.--anyone who has to work for someone else and then use most of their hard-earned money to pay people to do all the many things they don't know how to do and/or who are dumb enough to then spend most of their hard-earned money entertaining themselves.

Unless we personally have spent significant time immersed in totally different living situations (regions, populations, etc) then we really don't know jack about the other areas. I haven't met too many people who loved 2+ disparate living situations in the U.S. (e.g. grew up in NYC and loved it then lived the next 15 years in a town of 5-10K people...or just not near any kind of town whatsoever...and loved that too, or vice versa).

I don't know what any of this means. It's just been bothering me during this whole pandemic. I guess it drives me nuts that (some) otherwise capable people have gone off the rails with covid-related suspicions, and it also drives me nuts that because of that, there are (some) other very average people who are really enjoying being able to consider themselves perched high above. I have nothing to feel sorry for myself about but it has definitely been a weird kind of heartache to be fully supportive of public health efforts while populations around me, whom I "get"/understand due to common upbringing, etc., (some fellow citizens, some friends, acquaintances and a few family) refuse to see things my way...and are thus vilified and basically considered the stupidest of the stupid.

Nah.  Just follow the virus and behave accordingly.  One will never go wrong.  People didn't refuse to make sacrifices for WW II and I don't know why we should start refusing now.  These are such SMALL sacrifices!  Masking and getting vaccinated is nothing compared to giving up elastic in your underwear during the war):