The Nursing School to Welfare Pipeline

Nurses General Nursing

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I am sure many people have heard of the social issue/ cause "school to prison pipeline" that many civic groups are trying to eradicate. I am here to draw attention to a similar related problem , the college to welfare pipeline.

Due to an intricate , intimate, and covert relationship between big government politicos, higher education, Bureau of Occupational affairs, and the Federal/ State Department of labor, we have a serious student debt problem in the nursing field that is only going to get worse. Nurses need to wake up and take note of the LPN to RN hoax, and the RN-BSN hoax. These are all well publicized , propaganda driven falsities that are crushing nurses into debt driven higher education requirements. These propaganda driven requirements brainwash nurses into believing that without the extra education, they will not be employed.

And to a certain degree, they are correct, but its important for nurses to see the pitfall, before taking the dive. There is little to no difference in responsibility or pay rate from LPN to RN, and most RNs are taking the lower wage, just to have a job. There is zero difference in job responsibility or pay from RN to BSN, but the dollars spent to get there are substantial. The RN to BSN pipeline is a grotesque narrative that is being sung, for the sole purpose of enriching nursing schools. The NCLEX exam is identical for RNs and BSNs, the scope of practice is identical, and so are all the pay rates. A staff nurse is a staff nurse, is a staff nurse, too.

So why go for your BSN? Its because the hospitals and other various 24/ 7 institutional care providers say so. They have all built a united wall against the ADN RN. We are becoming an extinct species, because no one will hire us. Is the BSN a job guarantee? Of course not. Is any higher education a job guarantee? Nope. Big government politicos want student debt to skyrocket , so that they can fly in and save everyone with free bailouts, loan forgiveness, and thousands of more votes on election day.

May the buyer beware, until that utopia comes to fruition. In the meantime, take a serious look inward into the pitfalls, tricks and traps of higher education in the nursing field. The powers that be want you to keep jumping hurdles , spending more and more money, hoping to get hired, and falling deeper and deeper into debt, during the process. The higher you jump, the more you spend, and the less you earn. For many nurses who fell for these schemes, the financial devastation has been both swift and severe.

Specializes in Corrections, neurology, dialysis.
On 5/19/2019 at 4:39 PM, sarolarn said:

Ageism is REAL in nursing, and I'm probably only making another suggestion you've already tried- but maybe pare down on your resume and remove some experience, remove unrelated degrees, and present yourself like what they're looking for. Take the dates off your degrees if you want to keep them on. Get your foot in the door for an interview and wow them there, if you get the call. Don't answer questions about "salary requirements" or just type zeros. That's a conversation that should be had after you interview, not before they call you. I'm not sure how it is in PA, but my city doesn't allow potential employers to ask salary info anymore. Just a thought!

I know this was a while ago but I want to comment about ageism. It’s true they cannot ask your age, it they can ask you what year you graduated high school. Also I am always asked to fill out a background check - which asks die my date of birth. I’m sure that has turned off anyone looking to hire someone.

Specializes in Corrections, neurology, dialysis.
On 5/22/2019 at 3:52 PM, NurseMomTo8 said:

I read through this whole topic yesterday and today between errands and caring for my kids. As someone who has dreamed of being a nurse for the better part of ten years, I have to now wonder what in the world I’m signing myself up for. I’m currently planning on heading into an LPN program at my local community college, which will be followed by another year to earn my ADN. I had planned on getting my MSN eventually, but now I’m questioning if that will even be worth it. It appears the BSN (not mandatory but preferred in my living area) may be something to forego until I have years of experience under my belt. Or maybe I should bypass nursing in general? Lots to think on after reading this thread, but I truly do appreciate hearing from both ends of the spectrum in regards to experiences and opinions on the matter. ?

Even though my experience hasn’t been all that great, I still think you should do it. Just take the advice of what others are saying - don’t spend a lot of money on your education. Go to a community college. Don’t be lured in to an expensive school by false promises. That’s what this discussion. Is about.

The thing is, if you don’t do it, you’ll always wonder if it might have worked out for you. Maybe you’ll have a better experience. Who knows? As someone said, people who are happy with their jobs don’t come here to talk about it. We are talking about it because we are unhappy.

Specializes in Corrections, neurology, dialysis.
11 hours ago, panurse9999 said:

This profession will test you like you've never been tested before. It will break your sanity. It will make you hate people. ...just stopping short of making me hate myself, I deal in truth and fact, not fiction. I change what I can and accept what is out of my control. I had to walk off a job mid shift. Luckily I was able to report off to a supervisor. I have had to take a 2 year break from all of it, and to return under financial woes so bad, that I had no other choice. It is the last profession I would ever recommend to anyone, and if I could get a job cleaning floors at Walmart I would. But there are no jobs here.

You are not lying. I would get a job doing anything else if I could. I watch people do their jobs all the time and think “I could do this”. I fantasize about being a delivery driver or stocking shelves or some kind of factory work - ANYTHING that doesn’t involve dealing with people.

I found allnurses.com in 2005 as I was getting ready to start nursing school. I, too, thought that people were just being a negative and that my experience was going to be different.

Boy was I wrong! Not only did I go through all of the things they said, but they didn’t even come close to describing how bad it really is. Now some 14 years later I came back here for advice on why I can’t find a job, and found this discussion It’s a relief to find out that I am not the problem The problem is that nursing has gotten even worse than before.

Sure Go ahead with your sunny attitude and positive thinking. Just understand that we were you once. We were sunny and positive and had stars in our eyes. But this job will squeeze all of the joy right outta you. So please, don’t accuse us of being negative and having a bad attitude until you’ve been a nurse as long as we have.

If you’re not a nurse yet and you dream of being the change that this field needs, I wish you all the best and I mean that. Just get off your high horse and leave us to our discussion. If you find a way to get through this experience with your sanity and belief in humanity intact, then by all means come back and tell us how you did it We’d really like to know .

Specializes in NICU/Neonatal transport.

Not all nurses are having your experiences. That's the point. The majority of nurses arguably are not having horrific experiences. You want to get a job in a data center or driving a truck? Do it. You're obviously burned out and unhappy.

Specializes in Medical and general practice now LTC.

Closing for staff review

I agree that the BSN is a waste of time and money

On 5/22/2019 at 11:07 AM, panurse9999 said:

Don't forget the vitals signs, that a really greedy doctor will order in LTC, Q-shift, as if this is a hospital. Totally unnecessary, and instead of 10 seconds to chart those like we did on the paper MAR, now we enter the temp 97, and have to check off "tympanic, , right ear, left lear, oral, rectal, axial" and a BP 120/80, right arm, left arm, standing, sitting, laying, and BS 100 right arm, left arm posterior, abdomen, right quadrant upper, right quadrant lower, left quadrant upper, left quadrant lower...etc..etc..etc...

And when you have an assignment of 30 to 1, not only is this impossible to get done, the time it takes to make them up, and enter them into the PCC system is also impossible. I have seen the new grad nurses literally crying at the change of shift, due to being so overwhelmed.

make them up?

Specializes in Geriatrics, Dialysis.
32 minutes ago, Kooky Korky said:

make them up?

Oh gosh! I missed that "make them up" part! Other than that, it's pretty spot on. Just entering a simple set of VS in PCC is a pain in the rear! Each value you enter has multiple drop down options to choose from before you can save it. To make it even worse whatever you just entered doesn't auto-populate in the next order's ridiculous pop-up so guess what? You get to enter them all over again.

2 hours ago, Kooky Korky said:

make them up?

I noticed this too.

On 5/26/2019 at 12:43 AM, LilPeanut said:

Not all nurses are having your experiences. That's the point. The majority of nurses arguably are not having horrific experiences. You want to get a job in a data center or driving a truck? Do it. You're obviously burned out and unhappy.

It probably isn't that simple. The WHO finally recognized burnout as a real condition. But, the suggestions recommended for treatment weren't all that helpful. Getting another job that is low paying is not very stress relieving, no health insurance and barely able to pay the bills. Just worry all the time. For singles without support this isn't very feasible.

A lot of people have other demands put on them, taking care of parents, taking care of kids and no spouse to help. I know that as young single parents often the kids are raised by babysitters. Not everyone is fortunate.

Specializes in ED, ICU, Prehospital.

Agreed. My mom worked at a crappy job for a power company her entire career...never made more than $14.00/hr and raised 3 kids on that. She had a sit down, answer the phone type job. It made her consistently insecure. About everything.

About the burnout thing. I think this should enter the conversation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_1PNZdHq6Q

Making up VS. Just like charting that you did q2 turns. and q2 oral care. and TC&DB qhr. and IS q hr. and tipped the bag q hr.

I see it every single shift. Tipped the bag at the end of the shift and divided by 11. Sat at the nurses' station all night, yet somehow turned that vented patient every 2 hours. Tethered VS is one thing...but how did you get that temp and pain score with no temp probe foley or asking the pt how they are?

How about that CMAT score or RASS. What about q4 delerium testing?

I've watched nurse after nurse after nurse---and those super special smart NP students as well as the Gen Y nurses too---do this same thing. Sit and chart when they haven't done the actual work.

Because they can't. They're dealing with the code down the hall that took 58 minutes--and the debriefing from that episode. They're dealing with the 18 other patients that need cups of water, ambulated TID, families sucking vortices of need asking 10K questions you've answered 10K times already but threaten to report you if you don't stand there with your attention undivided.

How about if the RN is just taking their lunch break and some other poor nurse has YOUR 4 patient assignment as well as their own---and they can't chart your stuff for you....because see above.

I don't report nurses that I see do this. It's not on me and if they want to take the chances that their patient is actually dying while they make up VS? Then they have to live with that.

This is the problem with allowing facilities to dictate these unreasonable tasks. Unionizing in order to place hard stops in the form of nurse to patient ratio, providing break nurses who have no other duties, and mandate lunches---would change some of this.

I have no idea why nurses hamstring themselves by denying that they need to organize. There are problems with unions--yes---but tell me why it's a bad thing that nurses have the time to perform patient care and still get to sit down to lunch?

36 minutes ago, HomeBound said:

Agreed. My mom worked at a crappy job for a power company her entire career...never made more than $14.00/hr and raised 3 kids on that. She had a sit down, answer the phone type job. It made her consistently insecure. About everything.

About the burnout thing. I think this should enter the conversation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_1PNZdHq6Q

Making up VS. Just like charting that you did q2 turns. and q2 oral care. and TC&DB qhr. and IS q hr. and tipped the bag q hr.

I see it every single shift. Tipped the bag at the end of the shift and divided by 11. Sat at the nurses' station all night, yet somehow turned that vented patient every 2 hours. Tethered VS is one thing...but how did you get that temp and pain score with no temp probe foley or asking the pt how they are?

How about that CMAT score or RASS. What about q4 delerium testing?

I've watched nurse after nurse after nurse---and those super special smart NP students as well as the Gen Y nurses too---do this same thing. Sit and chart when they haven't done the actual work.

Because they can't. They're dealing with the code down the hall that took 58 minutes--and the debriefing from that episode. They're dealing with the 18 other patients that need cups of water, ambulated TID, families sucking vortices of need asking 10K questions you've answered 10K times already but threaten to report you if you don't stand there with your attention undivided.

How about if the RN is just taking their lunch break and some other poor nurse has YOUR 4 patient assignment as well as their own---and they can't chart your stuff for you....because see above.

I don't report nurses that I see do this. It's not on me and if they want to take the chances that their patient is actually dying while they make up VS? Then they have to live with that.

This is the problem with allowing facilities to dictate these unreasonable tasks. Unionizing in order to place hard stops in the form of nurse to patient ratio, providing break nurses who have no other duties, and mandate lunches---would change some of this.

I have no idea why nurses hamstring themselves by denying that they need to organize. There are problems with unions--yes---but tell me why it's a bad thing that nurses have the time to perform patient care and still get to sit down to lunch?

Excellent feedback...and I was parsing. I dont make them up. It was ..."No one could have the time to chart Q shift VS with 30 patients, even if you made them up, because the data entry time is much to onerous"

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