The Nursing School to Welfare Pipeline

[panurse9999]

I am sure many people have heard of the social issue/ cause "school to prison pipeline" that many civic groups are trying to eradicate. I am here to draw attention to a similar related problem , the college to welfare pipeline.

Due to an intricate , intimate, and covert relationship between big government politicos, higher education, Bureau of Occupational affairs, and the Federal/ State Department of labor, we have a serious student debt problem in the nursing field that is only going to get worse. Nurses need to wake up and take note of the LPN to RN hoax, and the RN-BSN hoax. These are all well publicized , propaganda driven falsities that are crushing nurses into debt driven higher education requirements. These propaganda driven requirements brainwash nurses into believing that without the extra education, they will not be employed.

And to a certain degree, they are correct, but its important for nurses to see the pitfall, before taking the dive. There is little to no difference in responsibility or pay rate from LPN to RN, and most RNs are taking the lower wage, just to have a job. There is zero difference in job responsibility or pay from RN to BSN, but the dollars spent to get there are substantial. The RN to BSN pipeline is a grotesque narrative that is being sung, for the sole purpose of enriching nursing schools. The NCLEX exam is identical for RNs and BSNs, the scope of practice is identical, and so are all the pay rates. A staff nurse is a staff nurse, is a staff nurse, too.

So why go for your BSN? Its because the hospitals and other various 24/ 7 institutional care providers say so. They have all built a united wall against the ADN RN. We are becoming an extinct species, because no one will hire us. Is the BSN a job guarantee? Of course not. Is any higher education a job guarantee? Nope. Big government politicos want student debt to skyrocket , so that they can fly in and save everyone with free bailouts, loan forgiveness, and thousands of more votes on election day.

May the buyer beware, until that utopia comes to fruition. In the meantime, take a serious look inward into the pitfalls, tricks and traps of higher education in the nursing field. The powers that be want you to keep jumping hurdles , spending more and more money, hoping to get hired, and falling deeper and deeper into debt, during the process. The higher you jump, the more you spend, and the less you earn. For many nurses who fell for these schemes, the financial devastation has been both swift and severe.

[panurse9999]

4 minutes ago, HomeBound said:

PARN

something you might want to understand. It's something that I learned a long time ago on any online forum.

Qui bono.

Who would benefit from consistently denying factual information and attempt to steer conversations or ridicule people instead of rebutting with opposing factual information?

You're not a liar. I don't think anybody called you this. However--the typical "if you can't rebut with facts, use ridicule" tactic works. It gets you riled up and you get emotional. The facts get lost.

A good portion of this is your experience. And what you're trying to do---which I agree with---is educate those who come here for FACTS about how things CAN be.

When someone tries to ridicule your experiences---usually it's someone who has a vested interest in those experiences not being aired amongst those who may be open to influence. (read: experienced RN to inexperienced or potential RN).

When a crap landlord wants to hide noise complaints, rat infestations, car breakins, unresponsive management---do you think that they allow you to speak to other or former residents?

I am leaving my townhouse to move for my new job. My leasing company states that I cannot be present for anyone who tours this place to rent when I leave. I cannot be here, to witness whether someone steals from me or destroys anything---because they don't want me to speak to the prospective new tenant about WHY I am leaving.

Make sense?

When you rise to the bait which is being thrown in front of you by parties who have a vested interest in this forum being a homogeneous platform for "RN to BSN FAST!!!" (until I blocked AN from my email--I got those routinely from this site) or RN Managers trying to spy on unhappy employees---parsing what people post in order to identify them---or....and this is a biggie that you need to get...

this site is sponsored by corporate interests. Let that sink in. AN doesn't take donations to stay running. Think about where the funding for this site comes from.

I get you're angry. A lot of us are. I would advise you to try and keep your complaints in the factual realm---and ignore the ones that bait you to be emotional.

just a piece of advice.

I have suspected this all along. Yes thank you, your advice is golden, and so are your posts. Please write more. I also suspect that the interwoven corporate interest groups working with higher education, are actually the authors of many of the puff pieces here, and even some of the negative ones. What they have here is basically a free survey tool, so they can start planning their next hoax on the entire profession, and those that may seek to enter it. They need to find a way to keep making more and more and more money, so getting into the minds of nurses is always a good place to start. When they see where the biggest and most frequent complaints are, they can proactively set up fibs/ falsities and lies for the hiring managers to attract more nurses.

[Nurse Magnolia, BSN, RN]

36 minutes ago, HomeBound said:

PARN

something you might want to understand. It's something that I learned a long time ago on any online forum.

Qui bono.

Who would benefit from consistently denying factual information and attempt to steer conversations or ridicule people instead of rebutting with opposing factual information?

You're not a liar. I don't think anybody called you this. However--the typical "if you can't rebut with facts, use ridicule" tactic works. It gets you riled up and you get emotional. The facts get lost.

A good portion of this is your experience. And what you're trying to do---which I agree with---is educate those who come here for FACTS about how things CAN be.

When someone tries to ridicule your experiences---usually it's someone who has a vested interest in those experiences not being aired amongst those who may be open to influence. (read: experienced RN to inexperienced or potential RN).

When a crap landlord wants to hide noise complaints, rat infestations, car breakins, unresponsive management---do you think that they allow you to speak to other or former residents?

I am leaving my townhouse to move for my new job. My leasing company states that I cannot be present for anyone who tours this place to rent when I leave. I cannot be here, to witness whether someone steals from me or destroys anything---because they don't want me to speak to the prospective new tenant about WHY I am leaving.

Make sense?

When you rise to the bait which is being thrown in front of you by parties who have a vested interest in this forum being a homogeneous platform for "RN to BSN FAST!!!" (until I blocked AN from my email--I got those routinely from this site) or RN Managers trying to spy on unhappy employees---parsing what people post in order to identify them---or....and this is a biggie that you need to get...

this site is sponsored by corporate interests. Let that sink in. AN doesn't take donations to stay running. Think about where the funding for this site comes from.

I get you're angry. A lot of us are. I would advise you to try and keep your complaints in the factual realm---and ignore the ones that bait you to be emotional.

just a piece of advice.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I tried several times to rebut with factual evidence from my area of the same state and *I* was called a liar. I never called the OP a liar. I simply pointed out that the experience was not the same across the state. For my post, I was called a bot, a liar, a possible online school recruiter....all nonsense. I joined this post with good intentions. To say that where I was, you did not need the BSN to get a job. I just graduated from a diploma school and got a job 6 months prior to graduation with a 5k signing bonus. I *thought* that would be good news. Instead, since that didn't fit the narrative that every corporation was trying to force RN's to get a BSN, I was harassed. No one is denying HER experience. No one has baited her. Every post that explained a differing situation where they live was met with ridicule and conspiracy theories. I don't subscribe to the every nurse needs a BSN either, so I thought that my posts explaining that it's different in different parts of the country would be met with relief. The fact that it was not says much more about the OP than anything else.

(PS....I changed my username today because I passed my NCLEX so now I could use RN and nurse in my username....not because I'm actually a bot who is here to work for the corporations to post jobs so that they can laugh at the people who come to apply - or wait, I'm supposed to be an online nursing school recruiter...I don't know, can't keep it straight. Just changed my name because I'm now an actual nurse!)

[LilPeanut, MSN, RN, NP]

7 hours ago, Natkat said:

Please explain why that has not been the case for me. I have applied to jobs in different states as well. It’s not for lack of trying.

I haven't seen your resume, your interview, or how you present yourself. But I would guess there's a reason you're not getting a job, you just aren't able to see it.

5 hours ago, panurse9999 said:

I cannot wait for all you "students" (rolls eyes) to walk the walk, then tell us we were wrong. You won't, because we're not. And you already know that.

I'm not a student. But I haven't experienced what you have experienced. I've practiced in three states. I have moved for jobs - not fun, but you do what you have to do.

5 hours ago, panurse9999 said:

This profession will test you like you've never been tested before. It will break your sanity. It will make you hate people. ...just stopping short of making me hate myself, I deal in truth and fact, not fiction. I change what I can and accept what is out of my control. I had to walk off a job mid shift. Luckily I was able to report off to a supervisor. I have had to take a 2 year break from all of it, and to return under financial woes so bad, that I had no other choice. It is the last profession I would ever recommend to anyone, and if I could get a job cleaning floors at Walmart I would. But there are no jobs here.

This is not meant as an insult - but nursing isn't for everyone, or maybe you haven't found the right niche yet. But it does not sound like it is a profession you have ever enjoyed. Many of us do enjoy it.

58 minutes ago, Kooky Korky said:

I received a bonus for hiring on way back when. They gave me 1/4 of it in my first paycheck. They paid another 1/4 after I was off of probation in 6 months. Then the last half came on my one year anniversary.

And because I didn't stay 5 years, they took back 1/2 of it.

I guess it was reasonable. I do see the employer's side of the issue. And I have learned to read the fine print.

You do need to read the fine print. I've never heard of them taking back any of a bonus for not staying five years - that's a terrible system and I would never have accepted it.

I took a job where I got a hiring bonus in exchange for 1 year's service. It was a nightmare of a hospital so I left immediately after 1 year. But I knew if I wanted to keep the money, I needed 1 year.

[CharleeFoxtrot, BSN, RN]

36 minutes ago, Nurse Magnolia said:

(PS....I changed my username today because I passed my NCLEX so now I could use RN and nurse in my username....not because I'm actually a bot who is here to work for the corporations to post jobs so that they can laugh at the people who come to apply - or wait, I'm supposed to be an online nursing school recruiter...I don't know, can't keep it straight. Just changed my name because I'm now an actual nurse!)

Congratulations Nurse Magnolia!

[HomeBound]

1 hour ago, Nurse Magnolia said:

I can't speak for anyone else, but I tried several times to rebut with factual evidence from my area of the same state and *I* was called a liar. I never called the OP a liar. I simply pointed out that the experience was not the same across the state. For my post, I was called a bot, a liar, a possible online school recruiter....all nonsense. I joined this post with good intentions. To say that where I was, you did not need the BSN to get a job. I just graduated from a diploma school and got a job 6 months prior to graduation with a 5k signing bonus. I *thought* that would be good news. Instead, since that didn't fit the narrative that every corporation was trying to force RN's to get a BSN, I was harassed. No one is denying HER experience. No one has baited her. Every post that explained a differing situation where they live was met with ridicule and conspiracy theories. I don't subscribe to the every nurse needs a BSN either, so I thought that my posts explaining that it's different in different parts of the country would be met with relief. The fact that it was not says much more about the OP than anything else.

(PS....I changed my username today because I passed my NCLEX so now I could use RN and nurse in my username....not because I'm actually a bot who is here to work for the corporations to post jobs so that they can laugh at the people who come to apply - or wait, I'm supposed to be an online nursing school recruiter...I don't know, can't keep it straight. Just changed my name because I'm now an actual nurse!)

And I respect your point of view.

I also congratulate you on your passing of the NCLEX. You are now a new grad, inexperienced, barely foot in the door Nurse. I do think that perhaps...you may want to withhold judgement about other nurses that have a teeeeensy bit more experience than you have now.

I didn't read a post that PARN called you a liar. I also didn't read every single post, parsing every word.

What I do know is that when ridicule becomes the answer to a grievance, whether it's personal experience or a pattern of behavior at a facility---someone is attempting to divert attention from the grievance.

I don't like certain comments that PaRN made---and I don't like the ridicule of others that comes across as exactly what PaRN is describing---nurses are jerks.

If the comment can't be made that addresses the original grievance---why make it? To be an a$$hole? It's what's coming across clearly in some of the comments--and not just in this thread.

Maybe PaRN can't relocate because he/she is taking care of their parent who has Alzheimers. Why does PaRN have to clarify that for a bunch of strangers? That's his/her business. PaRN is commenting on the state of affairs within Nursing. The RN to BSN nonsense is a huge issue. It's relevant and it's real. Blackballing is relevant and it's real. The Shortage Myth is relevant and it's real.

I wish you luck. I hope that nothing bad ever happens to you--and you never, ever witness or are the victim of bullying or violence (so that you can come and post here to say that this never happens in nursing because it's never happened to you). I hope that your ADN translates directly into a DON position where all you have to do is just hop from educational program to educational program---and never actually have to experience what it is like to be a nurse in a toxic unit.

Have a drink! Just don't drive though---remember---your license is now your identity 24/7 and if you happen to be human....well.....let's just say all of the sunshine and skittles that is passing the NCLEX can just as easily be taken away.

[Rose_Queen, BSN, MSN, RN]

2 hours ago, panurse9999 said:

By the looks of the topics that are being posted here on a daily basis, the "peachy sweet" crowd of "nothing is wrong with the nursing profession" are actually in the minority, as more and more negative nellies like myself are here in droves, and droves and droves.

You do realize, that by human nature, the more vocal are going to be those who are displeased? It is not human nature to post when things are going well. For every nurse who is posting here about negative experiences, there are more that are not having negative experiences.

[panurse9999]

34 minutes ago, Rose_Queen said:

You do realize, that by human nature, the more vocal are going to be those who are displeased? It is not human nature to post when things are going well. For every nurse who is posting here about negative experiences, there are more that are not having negative experiences.

do you have any statistical facts and figures about the negative nellies, vs the positive peaches or is it just bloviating like a big bag of gas?

[CharleeFoxtrot, BSN, RN]

43 minutes ago, Rose_Queen said:

You do realize, that by human nature, the more vocal are going to be those who are displeased? It is not human nature to post when things are going well. For every nurse who is posting here about negative experiences, there are more that are not having negative experiences.

Yep, it is also impolite to brag or boast. simply for attention. Unless its on FakeBook or Instagram then it's called a status update ?

[brandy1017, ASN, RN]

7 hours ago, CastiMcNasti said:

Perhaps. Or perhaps my positive, can-do attitude will not only help me land a position in the specialty I desire, but also allow me to adapt, adjust, and overcome the many obstacles any profession would undoubtedly present. ?

Good luck you'll need it, you're well on your way to twisting yourself into a pretzel to show the world how great you are and how great any and all nursing jobs you get. Just remember you were warned!

[panurse9999]

2 minutes ago, brandy1017 said:

Good luck you'll need it, you're well on your way to twisting yourself into a pretzel to show the world how great you are and how great any and all nursing jobs you get. Just remember you were warned!

I'd love to see the expression on his face when he gets that dreaded phone call. He's been framed for misconduct in his workplace, told not to report to work, not allowed on the property, until further notice. No due process, no information about who said what to who, or who did what, or what was done to whom. No timeframe. No ability to respond.

Nada. nothing.

Enjoy!

[brandy1017, ASN, RN]

7 hours ago, Nurse Magnolia said:

The entire premise of the thread was that there are no nursing jobs to be had, especially without a BSN. I posted that there were, in fact, nursing jobs to be had for new jobs without a BSN. I just got one with a 5k signing bonus just across the state from the OP. I posted in fact to show that it wasn’t all gloom and doom. But i was immediately harassed by the OP for expressing a different reality.

I have a job. I’ve been hired. Without a BSN. That was all I was pointing out. It’s possible.

I’ve run up against people like you and the OP for years telling me that I won’t get into nursing school, or that I won’t be able to get a job with a diploma in nursing or that there are not going to be any jobs, or that i cant do nursing school with four kids. I’ve done all of the above despite naysayers. I’ve learned in my 47 years that some people will never be happy.

I don’t know what the future holds but i do know that I will not listen to any of you that insist on demeaning others experiences if they don’t fit your experience.

Ironic you seem to be demeaning those who have not had your rosy experience. The discussion reminds me of the heated back and forth political debate between Republicans and Democrats and Trump supporters vs anti-Trump.

Nursing is not black or white, and the nurses with positive experiences do not discount those who've had negative experiences. In my over 20 years of experience I've only witnessed worsening job conditions and stagnant pay. But for many of us it isn't about the pay as much as it is about the terrible working conditions that corporate healthcare has wrought in its way to squeeze out profit any way it can! And it isn't just nurses, many doctors feel the same, just check out Kevinmd.com. Healthcare corporations are an equal opportunity job and morale destroyer!

[panurse9999]

6 hours ago, brandy1017 said:

Ironic you seem to be demeaning those who have not had your rosy experience. The discussion reminds me of the heated back and forth political debate between Republicans and Democrats and Trump supporters vs anti-Trump.

Nursing is not black or white, and the nurses with positive experiences do not discount those who've had negative experiences. In my over 20 years of experience I've only witnessed worsening job conditions and stagnant pay. But for many of us it isn't about the pay as much as it is about the terrible working conditions that corporate healthcare has wrought in its way to squeeze out profit any way it can! And it isn't just nurses, many doctors feel the same, just check out Kevinmd.com. Healthcare corporations are an equal opportunity job and morale destroyer!

She's been ********** the thread since I posted it. There is not one single hospital system in PA that will hire a new grad ADN. Not. a.single.one.

We have all been locked out. PA is saturated. Allehegeny area, Philly, Harrisburg, and the outskirts. Now, if she is talking about some 10 room hospital in Timbucktu where you ring a doorbell past 8pm to get in, that's a whole different story.