President Biden thread

10 minutes ago, subee said:

This seems to contradict your previous post:  loan=pay it back.  What am I missing?

She has been paying it back, for 10 years. Due life circumstances stances, and choosing to work for non-profit organizations, she has been paying the minimum, which barely makes a dent in the principal, while paying a significant amount of interest.  

Now, with this loan forgiveness, she can look forward to being able to help her sons with tuition, so they don't have to fall into the same hole she did. 

Let's contrast this with a congressman, who grew up in a family that owns a multi-million dollar car dealership. He accepted a PPP loan, and it was forgiven in less than 2 years. He had  the opportunity to vote for that program. He doesn't have to worry about making rent or buying groceries or paying college tuition for his children. And do we even know if he paid anything on his PPP loan? 

1 hour ago, nursej22 said:

She has been paying it back, for 10 years. Due life circumstances stances, and choosing to work for non-profit organizations, she has been paying the minimum, which barely makes a dent in the principal, while paying a significant amount of interest.  

Now, with this loan forgiveness, she can look forward to being able to help her sons with tuition, so they don't have to fall into the same hole she did. 

Let's contrast this with a congressman, who grew up in a family that owns a multi-million dollar car dealership. He accepted a PPP loan, and it was forgiven in less than 2 years. He had  the opportunity to vote for that program. He doesn't have to worry about making rent or buying groceries or paying college tuition for his children. And do we even know if he paid anything on his PPP loan? 

I get the point about wealthy people not paying back their PPP loans but what you are saying here still contradicts what you said before.  Did you mean that loan=pay back only applies to the forgiven PPP loans?  Or only that some loans shouldn't be paid back?  

2 hours ago, subee said:

I get the point about wealthy people not paying back their PPP loans but what you are saying here still contradicts what you said before.  Did you mean that loan=pay back only applies to the forgiven PPP loans?  Or only that some loans shouldn't be paid back?  

Yes, I agree, it is a bit contradictory. But I think the whole student loan business is predatory, in that young people take out loans, not realizing what they are locking into, and 15, 20 years down the road, they have paid double what the original loan was, and they are still in debt.  The PPP borrowers, however, had the help of accountants' advice, and who knows if they ever had the intention of actually paying back the money. And I think it adds insult to injury when legislators who voted on PPP are getting those loans forgiven, as much as a million dollars. 

25 minutes ago, nursej22 said:

Yes, I agree, it is a bit contradictory. But I think the whole student loan business is predatory, in that young people take out loans, not realizing what they are locking into, and 15, 20 years down the road, they have paid double what the original loan was, and they are still in debt.  The PPP borrowers, however, had the help of accountants' advice, and who knows if they ever had the intention of actually paying back the money. And I think it adds insult to injury when legislators who voted on PPP are getting those loans forgiven, as much as a million dollars. 

I think is where some of the animosity comes from.  You have some kids who were given good advice and guided by their parents and counselors to minimize debt.  

Then you have kids that didn't have this and the knowledge and foresight and took out sizable loans to prestigious expensive schools, and took out the max for living expenses, and didn't work and went on Spring break and were saddled with crippling debt for their adult life.  

Should people with irresponsible borrowing and living habits be rewarded with forgiveness of debt?

When I went to back to get my BSN the school had a policy the loan could only cover the tuition and books period and paid the school directly and I got nothing.  I didn't need it as I was a full time nurse.  When my ex went to get his Masters his lender gave him a huge amount of money that he didn't need, above and beyond his books and tuition and he took the max just because he could.

I think some education such as those in public community colleges, universities and trade schools should be free as an extension of free primary education.  The high cost of education is insane.  

I was able to get my associates degree RN working at Pizza Hut and zero debt in a community college.  Many people of my generation went to school in the 70's and 80's for extremely cheap education and shouldn't criticize those today that are struggling.  

Sorry, I'm all over the fence about this issue.

My daughter attended community college during high school and finished her BA at a state college. She worked throughout, and had a roommate to decrease living expenses. She never went on Spring break and rode her bike to work and school. I guess she was just dumb enough to work for organizations that help abused women and children instead of focusing on making $$$. 

54 minutes ago, nursej22 said:

My daughter attended community college during high school and finished her BA at a state college. She worked throughout, and had a roommate to decrease living expenses. She never went on Spring break and rode her bike to work and school. I guess she was just dumb enough to work for organizations that help abused women and children instead of focusing on making $$$. 

Obviously she doesn't meet your own description: "in that young people take out loans, not realizing what they are locking into, and 15, 20 years down the road, they have paid double what the original loan was, and they are still in debt."

I'm sure you're proud of her.

It does highlight part of the my post that even those who are frugal and hard working still wind up in debt because the cost is too high.

Quote

Rep Lauren Boebert has come under fire for a “homophobic” rant where she claimed that President Joe Biden’s student loan forgiveness plan will be used to fund “Karen’s daughter’s degree in lesbian dance theory”.

I don't think that she's stupid in the MTG category of stupid but really?

https://finance.Yahoo.com/finance/news/lauren-boebert-under-fire-claiming-203445179.html

The joke is that in the spirit of fairness of her objections over student loan forgiveness someone is going to refund her $25.99 for her GED.

Rut roh - it’s the welfare queen dichotomy.

Yes … anyone looking at taking on debt needs to take responsibility for their own bad choices.

Given what we know about the maturation of the human brain - that it isn’t complete until the early twenties - maybe we should look at the availability of solid guidance as described by Tweety. Maybe also the age breakdown of recipients of for-profit loans paying for for-profit schools. Do those lenders and institutions make any effort to avoid realistic loans?

Seeing on Fox News the tagline that loan forgiveness will fuel inflation at a really bad time I was curious.  I guess it will but less than 1%.

Quote

Similarly, Mark Zandi, Moody’s Analytics chief economist, says the effect on inflation is “largely a wash.” He estimates that student debt forgiveness starting at $10,000 will increase inflation by 0.08%, as measured by the consumer price index (CPI), another commonly used measure of inflation. 

Zandi also expects CPI inflation to be reduced by 0.11% after the payment freeze ends, since borrowers will have to start paying off the remainder of their loans.

Whatever the outcome, it will be hard to measure precisely since there are “so many moving pieces to the inflation picture right now,” Sarah House, senior economist at Wells Fargo, tells CNBC Make It.

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/08/29/how-student-loan-forgiveness-will-affect-inflation-from-economists.html

3 minutes ago, heron said:

Maybe also the age breakdown of recipients of for-profit loans paying for for-profit schools. Do those lenders and institutions make any effort to avoid realistic loans?

I really don't know.  It was interesting to note the scene I described between my ex and I.  I went to a not-for-profit school for my BSN and could only get a loan for books and tuition paid to the school since it was an RN to BSN program and they knew we were working RNs.  My ex went to a for-profit private school for his Masters and could get thousands above and beyond what was necessary.  He was over 40 at the time and didn't spend the money unwisely but still.