Nurses working as CNAs

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emergency_love

38 Posts

as long as I delegate work to a CNA that is within their capability/training to do, I am not responsible for anything "under my license". I can only be held accountable for delegating inappropriately....if they do something stupid and knew better, that's on them.

I think she means that, "CNA work" aka cleaning up poop, bed baths, accuchecks, etc. all things CNA's perform, ARE part of nursing tasks and is not "below" you as an RN. It's like a physician saying, "patient assessment is nurses' work". Well, true, nurses are responsible for that, but it doesn't mean is is "nurse work". We're all members of the healthcare team and just because you have a license to practice above the skill level of a CNA, doesn't excuse you from basic patient care and shouldn't be labeling it as someone else's job.

Also, if you delegate a task to a CNA and it is not performed, are you not equally as responsible in the end?

RNsRWe, ASN, RN

3 Articles; 10,428 Posts

I think she means that, "CNA work" aka cleaning up poop, bed baths, accuchecks, etc. all things CNA's perform, ARE part of nursing tasks and is not "below" you as an RN. It's like a physician saying, "patient assessment is nurses' work". Well, true, nurses are responsible for that, but it doesn't mean is is "nurse work". We're all members of the healthcare team and just because you have a license to practice above the skill level of a CNA, doesn't excuse you from basic patient care and shouldn't be labeling it as someone else's job.

Also, if you delegate a task to a CNA and it is not performed, are you not equally as responsible in the end?

Oh, I do get that. I just didn't interpret the original post I quoted in that manner. It was the "under the nurse's license" part that threw me, and that I was focused on. The rest.....of course :)

nurseprnRN, BSN, RN

1 Article; 5,114 Posts

As long as you aren't get CNA pay, who cares? And there really is no such thing as CNA work as CNAs work under nurses' licenses.

1) CNAs do not work "under nurses' licenses." CNAs are responsible for working under their own scope of practice. Accepting delegation from a licensed nurse does not constitute working under the nurse's license.

2) OP: The BoN will tell you that no matter what they call it, your facility cannot call you a CNA if you hold an RN license. You will be held to RN standard of care, e.g. (this means "for example), assessment, intervention, and delegation. If the facility wants to have you take a shift off from giving meds, doing admission assessments, and other RN duties, they can do that. But as far as the BoN is concerned, you are still responsible for nurse level of scope.

3) OP: I hope they're still paying you RN money. If not, that is a bad thing. Since you are still being held to the legal responsibility of an RN, you should be paid for that responsibility. And if they do that, then why not just increase the numbers of RNs on staff?

Specializes in Geriatrics, Transplant, Education.

We will do this on my floor if we are overstaffed nurses and understaffed aides and staffing has no aides to send. (happens on occasion at night). I've done it only once, and some nurses definitely enjoy doing it more than others...we still make our RN wage, and are still held responsible as nurses.

CodeteamB

473 Posts

Specializes in Emergency.

I would not care for this. In my opinion if you are over staffed on RNs and understaffed on NAs the best thing to do would be to split up the assignment so each nurse is responsible for fewer patients, or to have float nurse who can help with all tasks. I don't see the point of having a nurse play attendant, and would not be happy to accept that role. I would get bored, and be far more useful floating.

ThePrincessBride, MSN, RN, NP

1 Article; 2,594 Posts

Specializes in Med-Surg, NICU.
I think she means that, "CNA work" aka cleaning up poop, bed baths, accuchecks, etc. all things CNA's perform, ARE part of nursing tasks and is not "below" you as an RN. It's like a physician saying, "patient assessment is nurses' work". Well, true, nurses are responsible for that, but it doesn't mean is is "nurse work". We're all members of the healthcare team and just because you have a license to practice above the skill level of a CNA, doesn't excuse you from basic patient care and shouldn't be labeling it as someone else's job.

Also, if you delegate a task to a CNA and it is not performed, are you not equally as responsible in the end?

Exactly what I meant. I didn't think it needed to be explained, but I guessed wrong!

microkate

67 Posts

Specializes in Oncology, Clinical research.

I've done this for our facility, when we had 13 aides call out in one day. I didn't mind at all. I was not only paid my usual nursing wage, but time and a half, since it was on short notice. I wouldn't say it was easy - our aides work their tails off - but it wasn't mentally stressful. It was nice to be able to help someone to the bathroom or grab them a snack without worrying about how far behind I was going to get in my med pass. I do that anyway, I just normally have nursing assessments, meds, and treatments on top of it.

Mr Sacdiff

71 Posts

Once in awhile (especially now, during "season" here in Florida) our RN's will fill in and do "Aid Work". Most of them do not mind, because they are simply helping with ADL's and such and can report things off to the nurse responsible for that patient.

Regarding "Aid work", if a nurse "delegates" (I hate that word) something to an aid, like cleaning and incontinent patient, and it doesn't get done, both parties are at fault. The nurse has to know that an aid is performing their duties, and if not, they need to make sure it is completed.

smartnurse1982

1,775 Posts

I checked the NJ bon board and a nurse had her license suspended for failing to to surpervise Cna's properly.

I asked this same question in 2009 and boy have the responses changed.

During that time,i was asking if I,as an Rn,can work as an Lpn or cna.

The answer was no.

BlueLightRN

150 Posts

I worked as a CNA when census was down. Heck, it's much less responsibility!

FineAgain

372 Posts

Specializes in ED; Med Surg.

We all take turns when we are short of CNA's. We are not responsible for assessing, charting anything other than vitals, I/O's, ADL's, etc. We get our regular pay. I don't mind taking my turn as it is much less responsibility...and I can help the assigned RN out if he/she gets in a bind. I wouldn't want to do it every shift, but I (as an RN) would much rather our facility do it this way as opposed to working without a CNA. I have enough to do without doing everything on my assignment. I love my CNA's and hate working without them. They are my eyes and ears and extra set of hands in addition to all the other things they do so well.

dudette10, MSN, RN

3,530 Posts

Specializes in Med/Surg, Academics.
I checked the NJ bon board and a nurse had her license suspended for failing to to surpervise Cna's properly.

Could you link to the document reviewing the case? I would like to read it.

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