Nurse Manager gossiping about employees?

klone, MSN, RN · Dec 4, 2016

Nurses are the worst for performance reviews. You can do no right.

Not fair and not true.

Have you not ever had a good performance review from a nurse manager? If not, perhaps the issue is not with the nurse manager?

Sour Lemon · Dec 4, 2016

My nurse manager tells us tidbits about other workers. Uses general and vague 'they said...' statements when communicating areas she seems to think an individual needs to improve upon.
For instance; she asked me to come into her office when I got a chance to. When I did, she proceeded to say 'they' said (some of my coworkers, she won't specify who) said you seem to lack confidence. Then she didn't offer much in the way of suggestions. It was very vague and very insulting to me.
Others who are new to our department have stated she has done the same to them too. Only, they have either quit or gotten fired by now.
Should I go above her head to HR and let them know about her ineffective ***** management style? Or just ignore her? I don't see myself being able to reason with someone who acts like this.
Also please note: I work in an ER where the ft medical director called the nurses monkeys before I started there. He still has his job, but is known to **** and complain about nurses on a whim. He gets emotionally worked up easily...

I wouldn't go above her head, I would simply confront her directly. This happened to me one time, although it was some time ago and the nature of the complaint is fuzzy. I do recall that it was vague and subjective. I let the manager know that I would be happy to sit down with her and the complainer to sort things out, but that I really didn't know what to do or say, otherwise. It was never brought up to me again, and I stayed on good terms with that employer until I moved away.

At another job, I was called into the office to discuss an anonymous complaint letter that a patient had written. After being told about all the things I'd done wrong, I politely demanded to see the letter before I responded to any of it. They told me no, at first (multiple times), but eventually relented. The letter did complain quite a bit about nurses on the unit, but specifically named me and two other people as employees they were happy with.

The moral of the story is go straight to the source ...or smile, nod and get the *bleep* out of there. You're only getting your manager's interpretation of the "complaint" against you. And that's garbage.

Kooky Korky, BSN, RN · Dec 4, 2016

I think it's very strange that you are framing your manager giving you feedback from your peers as "gossiping" or telling you "tidbits about other workers." That's not AT ALL what she did. Telling you "tidbits about other workers" or gossiping would be your boss saying that Janie has a drinking problem or that Joe is getting a divorce.
Your manager is telling you what your coworkers have said while giving them anonymity, which given your reaction, seems very appropriate imo.
Rather than being defensive and mischaracterising your manager's comments, it might do you some good to reflect on what she actually is telling you. Honest introspection is never a bad thing.
And going over her head to report her " ineffective ***** management style" is not going to make HER look bad; it's only going to reflect poorly on YOU.
I wouldn't ignore what she said, either. Again, introspection is a good thing. Everyone has weaknesses, including you, right? Maybe this is something you are indeed projecting, and you can work on either why that's the impression you are giving off, or talk with her again, saying you've thought about what she said, but would like some actual examples of this lack of confidence, and what she thinks you actually need to do to improve.

The manager is not gossiping. She is also not being a good manager. She's a chicken, doesn't know the first thing about confronting a worker about problems. She ought to sit down the OP with her accusers, one at a time -without even her, the boss present. That way the chicken little coworkers will have to say directly to OP, as they should have to start with, what difficulties they have with or about her.

If "these onpenly stating the issues" sessions don't work, then they can dump the issues on the boss .

Horseshoe, BSN, RN · Dec 4, 2016

The manager is not gossiping. She is also not being a good manager. She's a chicken, doesn't know the first thing about confronting a worker about problems. She ought to sit down the OP with her accusers, one at a time -without even her, the boss present. That way the chicken little coworkers will have to say directly to OP, as they should have to start with, what difficulties they have with or about her.
If "these onpenly stating the issues" sessions don't work, then they can dump the issues on the boss .

If I were the manager, it would totally depend on the nature of the complaints. Some would not even be worthy of consideration, much less insisting on some kind of meeting.

Career Columnist / Author · Dec 4, 2016

Well, from a nurse manager's perspective...
I have had to have that conversation with employees. Usually starts with "There have been some concerns brought to me by other staff members about x, y, z..."
No, that's not gossiping. That's addressing an issue that other staff members have with a coworker's performance or attitude or whatever. Nurse managers often do not work on the floor, thus they must rely on other staff members' observations regarding any performance issues.
However, I will say that I typically would not have a discussion with someone without concrete examples. And if an employee came to me with complaints about a coworker, I would insist they come back and talk to me once they have specific examples, including dates and details.

I agree. You can also ask your nurse manager what specifically you need to do to improve this (vague) gap in your performance. What do you need to do/change by when to improve?

The point is that your manager has not done their work: setting a SMART (specific, measurable, actionable, relevant, time-oriented) performance goal. Which makes this a no-win for you. How can you meet the expectations you have not been given?

Check in with your manager frequently. "Can we talk about how I'm doing? I believe I demonstrated confidence today, can you give me feedback?" This requires your manager to partner with you. Good luck

Cola89 · Dec 4, 2016

I agree. You can also ask your nurse manager what specifically you need to do to improve this (vague) gap in your performance. What do you need to do/change by when to improve?
The point is that your manager has not done their work: setting a SMART (specific, measurable, actionable, relevant, time-oriented) performance goal. Which makes this a no-win for you. How can you meet the expectations you have not been given?
Check in with your manager frequently. "Can we talk about how I'm doing? I believe I demonstrated confidence today, can you give me feedback?" This requires your manager to partner with you. Good luck

What this nurse manager did was give me a vague complaint without any specific context "they (some people and I don't know if the medical director is one of those people- I'm told he likes to complain about nurses) are saying you seem to lack confidence.

Then she said -- "what can I do to help you?". I didn't know how to answer, because I didn't necessarily agree with what she said and she didn't give me any explanation.

I told her I would like to know who said what, and she said she would have to look through her files, she will get the specifics, and get back with me at a later date.

I walked away from that meeting she initiated feeling demoralized, and like my coworkers don't like me/don't have my back...

Like I don't wanna work in such an environment.

Horseshoe, BSN, RN · Dec 4, 2016

What this nurse manager did was give me a vague complaint without any specific context "they (some people and I don't know if the medical director is one of those people- I'm told he likes to complain about nurses) are saying you seem to lack confidence.
Then she said -- "what can I do to help you?". I didn't know how to answer, because I didn't necessarily agree with what she said and she didn't give me any explanation.
I told her I would like to know who said what, and she said she would have to look through her files, she will get the specifics, and get back with me at a later date.
I walked away from that meeting she initiated feeling demoralized, and like my coworkers don't like me/don't have my back...
Like I don't wanna work in such an environment.

You have a legitimate complaint about how your manager handled it. But in no way was she "gossiping" or revealing "tidbits about your coworkers."

In the big picture, it doesn't really matter who said what. If she won't give you any further guidance about what your actual shortcomings are and how to improve, I will backtrack and say that at that point, it might just be best to shake your head, shrug, then go about the business of being a good nurse without giving this much more thought.

JadedCPN, BSN, RN · Dec 4, 2016

I told her I would like to know who said what, and she said she would have to look through her files, she will get the specifics, and get back with me at a later date.

I don't think it really matters who said what, if anything my concern might only be towards the effectiveness of the manager. But I wouldn't focus on who said what because it is ultimately irrelevant. I even had a manager once who would use the "they said" tactic when it was actually her own opinion but she didn't want to take the blame.

Instead, you should focus on whether there is any bit of truth that you can find introspectively, and then make changes.

TheCommuter, BSN, RN · Dec 4, 2016

My nurse manager tells us tidbits about other workers.

Your nurse manager seems to have an immature, unprofessional style of managing her team of nurses.

Cola89 · Dec 4, 2016

Your nurse manager seems to have an immature, unprofessional style of managing her team of nurses.

Probably so. I've heard her say things like 'so and so is mad at me right now, I think she might be looking for another job...'

And during my interview she said 'some of the nurses don't like me, they think they have it bad, but really they don't.... if you (and other new hires) could just say something positive about working here vs. where you used to work, maybe morale could improve.

Maybe that was a red flag. She hasn't been my only unprofessional nurse manager, and I do need to work, so...

I was taken aback by her most recent comments toward me , because, we have had 5 nurses (all new hires) quit without notice over the past two months.

Whatever obscure crap she says she thinks I need to improve upon... I was shocked. I come to work and do my job. We are down a lot of people and work short a lot. Surely she could address something so subjective as 'they said you seem to lack confidence' for a time when we have fair (or fairer) staffing levels.

If she's comparing me to people who have been working in the same dept for ten years, she shouldn't. Knowledge and experience build confidence.

Maybe I will just chalk this up to - I work with some unwelcoming jerks who are gonna find themselves yet another position short soon?

SaltySarcasticSally, LPN, RN · Dec 5, 2016

It isn't constructive criticism if her manager does not provide examples. Giving specific examples not only backs up the manager and whoever "they" is and their concerns, but would also give her details to reflect back on. Also, by saying "they" makes it seem as if the manager herself isn't concerned but she just wanted to let this nurse know people were talking about her. I would be irritated myself. I appreciate and welcome constructive criticism but not vague comments this nurse manager may have heard in passing.

I certainly would not go above her ahead but ask for specific examples so you can reflect and improve on whatever is giving that impression to people. Most people cannot be effective managers because for some reason, most people can just be straight up when eye to eye with someone. I would take it as an opportunity to review your nursing skills/communication and explore where you can improve. But other than that, move on and upward.

TriciaJ, RN · Dec 5, 2016

I don't think it really matters who said what, if anything my concern might only be towards the effectiveness of the manager. But I wouldn't focus on who said what because it is ultimately irrelevant. I even had a manager once who would use the "they said" tactic when it was actually her own opinion but she didn't want to take the blame.
Instead, you should focus on whether there is any bit of truth that you can find introspectively, and then make changes.

Did we work for the same manager? Her schtick: "Actually, there were several complaints about you." One poor nurse canvassed all her coworkers to see who she'd caused a problem for and how she could make it right. Then she was chastised for doing that. The only person on the unit whom several people complained about was the manager herself.