I have a question for both practicing RNs and students alike:
It's come to my attention recently that some nursing schools are on longer verifying that their students can do basic 4th grade math. By that I mean add, subtract, multiply, and divide without using a calculator. They assume that calculators will always be available and that therefore, nurses don't need to know how to do basic calculations anymore and don't have anything in their curriculum that requires students to do those things. In fact, they are aware that some of their students definitely can NOT do those basic calculations when they involve fractions and/or decimals. Also, the TEAS test now allows applicants to use calculators: so they are not testing those skills, either.
To me, that seems like a safety issue. There might come a time when a calculator is not available.
1. What do you all think?
2. Students ... are you competent adding, subtracting, multiplying, and dividing fractions and decimals?
3. Practicing nurses ... are there any times you need to use basic calculation in your work (without a calculator)? Can you give me some examples?
4. Is anybody verifying those skills in orientation anymore? (med tests without calculators, etc.)
And cursive? A complete waste of academic energy. Any time that would be spent practicing cursive would be better spent practicing keyboarding and fundamental computer skills.
Unless one is a historian and must be able to read primary source documents.
RNs unable to perform 5th grade math calculations? How can anyone support that? Entry level should be raised and standardized.
I don't think anyone is arguing that the scholastic ability to do basic math is too high a bar to expect nurses to clear. I certainly am not saying that. I would love to see high and STANDARDIZED entry standards for all levels of nursing.
But I DO disagree with the idea that doing math by hand in the clinical setting is somehow superior to doing math with a calculator. Of course, you need to understand the concepts behind your calculations and have the ability to recognize something looks wrong if you hit an extra button and get a weird answer (always a good idea to check your calculations twice). You can use a calculator and your brain at the same time. Its the same as when medication barcode scanning came out - great safety tool, but you still need to use your brain. That doesn't mean there is something wrong with barcode scanning....it means that nurses need to stay vigilant even when using tools to help them do their jobs better. These are not two mutually exclusive things.
I don't see what is so disturbing about nurses using the tools at their disposal, and why you wouldn't teach them the same way during their schooling.
The basic math requirements for college are sufficient for nursing school. At most you're using simple algebraic equations. And fortunately most of the math has been taken out of the job and is done by pharmacist or the pumps used in hospital. However, it is still nice to be able to verify the dose, especially with high risk meds.
I'll admit, math is not a strength. I'm good at it, yes. But you betcha I'm using a calculator if I have it at my disposal.
I think the biggest thing is recognizing when something is off. Not just going blindly and saying, "sure thing Epic!" when the dosage on the MAR looks off. Or not even questioning it to begin with. It's critical thinking. It's constant thinking.
Not merely dosage calculation and the ability to not use a calculator; it's the ability to notice when something is wrong and using that calculator to determine how so.
While I'm not quite in nursing school yet, Algebra is a requirement for all the programs around here and even though I took the class online, I had to take the exams in person. I could use a calculator, but I had to show all my work for actual credit (same with chemistry and microbiology). Just because calculators are made available doesn't mean that base knowledge isn't required.
Also, while I haven't taken the TEAS yet, I did take the HESI. A very basic calculator was provided, but if you didn't know your conversions or how to approach the problem, it was useless. The questions weren't things like "what's 1.37 + 5.28". They were more like "what's 5 1/5 divided by 6 3/7". If you don't know how to set up your problems, it didn't really matter if a calculator was available or not.
Specializes in UR/PA, Hematology/Oncology, Med Surg, Psych.
Just a quick response, I work nights and need to head to bed soon. I know in Oncology I used math quite often to verify chemotherapy dosages. Also used basic math to calculate the ANC of patients and for Heparin drip rates. Although I did use a calculator first, I always double checked by hand. In my new position, I use basic math alot to figure insulin dosages for type I diabetics.
I am a current BSN student. I can't speak for other schools, but we certainly had to know basic math... I was required to take College Algebra and Statistics just to get in to nursing school. When I was entering, we too the NLN PAX and you were not allowed to use a calculator (100% calculator inactive). I also have received dosage tests every semester that I had to score > 90 (first semester we could not use a calculator, but each subsequent semester we could). I honestly would rather any nurse of mine check her math with a calculator (human errors occur, especially under pressure). I feel that this is more of an education system issue, rather than a nursing issue.
Agree with a previous poster that people should have a sense of the right answer sans calculator, but I would prefer that nurse's check with a calculator to be safe.
As for cursive....I still wouldnt be able to read physician notes whether they're on cursive or block. :-D
I personally think that nurses should know basic math. When I went to school the first semester was adding, subtracting, decimals, etc and we couldn't use a calculator. When I am at work there are times you need to know basic math.. for example wasting 2mg of a 4mg morphine vial that is diluted in 1 ml. I always double check my math with certain things, such as heparin drips and boluses. I'll do the math out, double check with a calculator, and again with a coworker. When I got hired at the hospital I'm at I did have to take a math test. We needed to score 100% but they did give a calculator. I think nursing schools need to make sure the students know basic math.
Specializes in Palliative, Onc, Med-Surg, Home Hospice.
I admit that there aren't many circumstances today in which a calculator is not available ... but it would bother me to have the average nurse unable to do basic, 5th grade arithmetic. Shouldn't we expect more of our profession? Shouldn't we all have basic math literacy?
I graduated 6 years ago, and we weren't allowed to use calculators on our med calculation tests. we were allowed to use them for our regular exams if there was a math question (normally there wasn't) but we were expected to know how to calculate basic equations.
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Here.I.Stand, BSN, RN
5,047 Posts
Unless one is a historian and must be able to read primary source documents.