In a former life, I was an education counselor, so from that perspective, let me set a few things straight about education and the RN.
1. Nurses, don't require a degree. For most of the time, nurses were taught in diploma schools and some still are. Most of what a nurse learns is learned on the job. All education is great, but if a nurse is really going to be "well rounded" by education, they should have a bachelor's degree in one of the liberal art subjects and then nursing school.
2. The people who are most concerned about nurses having BSNs as entry level education are the educators. No big surprise there. Most hospitals couldn't care less, because they need people liscensed by the state as registered nurses.
3. Management requires a BSN only because there are a limited number of management slots, and education is a way of legitimately weeding applicants out. My boss was an ADN and manager of a cardiac unit for about 20 years before getting her BSN. In reality, a nurse would be better served with a A.A. in business management than a BSN if they are going to be managers.
4. MDs respect nurses. They don't really care how much education a nurse has because whatever education they have is not an MD and that's all they recognize. Why? Because they're MDs; it's a different profession. RNs are just as good as MDs, because in modern health care, both are essential for patient care and treatment. Competeing with MDs for professional status based on educational qualifications is a fool's game. The MD is considered the top of the educational food chain. But why would a nurse need or want a doctorate of medicine? They are equal with doctors in the profession of helping sick people even if they only went to a diploma school.
5. Continuing education is more important than formal academic degrees. What difference does it make if someone got their MSN 20 years ago? What have they done lately? Subscribe to three nursing mags and do their CEUs and you will be on top of the game. Combine that with national certification and you really have something that shows current competency.
6. It's true: if you want to be a psychotherapist, you need a MSW or some equivalent. Why? Because there is a glut of people getting BSc degrees in psychology and sociology. Why? because they're easy degrees. If the world needed therapists as much as they needed nurses, you'd have therapy schools with AASc programs just like nursing schools. In fact, look at the military: When the Air Force needs nurses they will commission nurses with ADNs. When they don't, they require a BSN. We aren't competing with other professions; we are nurses.
7. What I am saying will always be the case, and why? Because there will always be a nursing shortage, and not because of demographics, but because nursing takes a certain kind of person, and it's hard work. There is a shortage of bedside nurses; there always will be. There is no shortage of nurse managers or executives or NPs or CRNAs, and that's good news. Because if you really want to be a nurse, you can be and you don't have to continously seek after more and more degrees. You will always have a job, and you can be a professional person with initials after your name, and all that with only a diploma.
Thanks, Caroline. So, what's your philosophy of nursing, or what is your definition of nursing?
Well, as a new nurse (ADN) at this point, I feel having honest compassion and concern for the sick is my number one priority. Learning everything I can, on the job from the people I am lucky enough to work with is another priority, and basically always being open to learning. I am a sponge, and will take advantage of every knowledgable mind who's kind enough to allow it.
For me, the ADN program is a stepping stone. (A golden stepping stone, at that) I plan on getting my BSN, and eventually my masters. It's awesome that there are various plateaus in nursing, so that I can support my family while attaining the additional education which I feel is right for me. (LVN, ADN, BSN-- to me knowledgeable people are treasure troves, and I care not what their GPA was)
At this very point in time, I am focusing on just learning how to BE a nurse, as I feel school just gives us the basics, and that actual on the job learning is what makes us proficient, regardless of our educational backgrounds.
The BSN educated RNs that I work with do not give me the impression that they value me any less than anyone else. However, sometimes on this board I am given that impression. (sometimes) I just want to just point out to some of my BSN colleagues that school was hell for me too, and I was challenged constantly. It certainly was no cakewalk. I may lack some of the liberal arts classes which purportedly make us more "rounded" individuals, but who's to say I haven't gained those very attributes through my own life experiences?
I certainly respect and even am slightly envious of those of you who have gotten the extra education that I plan on obtaining, but I do hope that for those of you who may harbor even a slight degree of snobbery, you would try to be grateful that there are LVN and ADN programs which give those of us who cannot afford to be unemployed (or part-time employed) a fast track to easing the nursing shortage. Regardless of our educational status, in the final analysis we are all in this together.
We're all nurses, or on our way there. Let's stick together and give our profession the unity, dignity, and respect that we've all busted our a$$es for, regardless of educational status. Every single one of us are deserving of respect.
Make nursing school a masters level program, because it certainly isn't anything like an associates degree program. I slept through my first two years in college and still got a B. Nursing school is a different animal altogether
You now propose a Masters Degree to become a bedside nurse?
I think you should consider a career in politics..... with regard to your contradictions posted both now and previously... However your are following ÿour "calling" to become a nurse...
:chuckle
P.S. Just a quick question...... why did it take you two other degrees to find your aforementioned "calling"?
You really have to go "metaphysical" on this one and ask the question:
"How does one obtain power and respect in our lives and professions?"
The answer is the same for all people and all professions:
"One earns respect from how one treats others"
I am a ADN. I have had everyone from patients to attendings ask me if I am a MD, NP, charge nurse, teacher, etc. And the answer is, "No, I am the staff nurse". And they are amazed.
I am proud of what I do. I am certified in what I do, not for extra money, not for "Prestige", but because I believe in being the best at what I do, and because I owe to G-d and life to excell at this gift.
When people start flashing status and degrees around to " gain respect", they demonstrate the shallowness of their work. When people talk loudly about humbleness, they are arrogant in their own way.
People will respect you when you respect yourself and excell at what you do. If you put up with inappropriate behavior from MDs, administrators, patients, then you can expect it to continue.
Ah yes, the "golden rule" which is so well documented in various scripture and parables.
"When people start flashing status and degrees around to "gain respect", they demonstrate the shallowness of their work. When people talk loudly about humbleness, they are arrogant in their own way."
"Beware of the Leaven of the Pharisees and the Sadducees." Matt 16:6
"People will respect you when you respect yourself and excel at what you do. If you put up with inappropriate behavior from MDs, administrators, patients, then you can expect it to continue."
"We will get exactly as much crap as we will take." -SJOE
Well, as a new nurse (ADN) at this point, I feel having honest compassion and concern for the sick is my number one priority. Learning everything I can, on the job from the people I am lucky enough to work with is another priority, and basically always being open to learning. I am a sponge, and will take advantage of every knowledgable mind who's kind enough to allow it.
For me, the ADN program is a stepping stone. (A golden stepping stone, at that) I plan on getting my BSN, and eventually my masters. It's awesome that there are various plateaus in nursing, so that I can support my family while attaining the additional education which I feel is right for me. (LVN, ADN, BSN-- to me knowledgeable people are treasure troves, and I care not what their GPA was)
At this very point in time, I am focusing on just learning how to BE a nurse, as I feel school just gives us the basics, and that actual on the job learning is what makes us proficient, regardless of our educational backgrounds.
The BSN educated RNs that I work with do not give me the impression that they value me any less than anyone else. However, sometimes on this board I am given that impression. (sometimes) I just want to just point out to some of my BSN colleagues that school was hell for me too, and I was challenged constantly. It certainly was no cakewalk. I may lack some of the liberal arts classes which purportedly make us more "rounded" individuals, but who's to say I haven't gained those very attributes through my own life experiences?
I certainly respect and even am slightly envious of those of you who have gotten the extra education that I plan on obtaining, but I do hope that for those of you who may harbor even a slight degree of snobbery, you would try to be grateful that there are LVN and ADN programs which give those of us who cannot afford to be unemployed (or part-time employed) a fast track to easing the nursing shortage. Regardless of our educational status, in the final analysis we are all in this together.
We're all nurses, or on our way there. Let's stick together and give our profession the unity, dignity, and respect that we've all busted our a$$es for, regardless of educational status. Every single one of us are deserving of respect.
Great post, Caroline. As for me, I'm going to take a little time and come up with a new post. In truth, I couldn't care less about who has what degree. I'm going to be an RN, and I've already gone to college, so what do I care. I just wish I could encourage more people to see the glory and status of bedside nursing rather than everyone having to educate themselves away from the bedside.
But half the people on this board have made it clear that they're not in nursing as a calling, but that it is only a job to them. And the sad fact is, we need them too because we need nurses. It's my sincere hope that they will succeed at becoming NPs, PAs, policy makers, and executives, and even floor managers, because they probably don't make good bedside nurses.
Maybe that's what my post will be on--the glory of nursing.
But half the people on this board have made it clear that they're not in nursing as a calling, but that it is only a job to them. And the sad fact is, we need them too because we need nurses. It's my sincere hope that they will succeed at becoming NPs, PAs, policy makers, and executives, and even floor managers, because they probably don't make good bedside nurses.
:eek:
Really, I tried to reply, but this said it the best.
I must say that I find this "if you're not in nursing because of a 'calling' then you can't be a good nurse" attitude a bit disturbing. The implication that people can only be good at what you do due to a "calling" is simply not true. You certainly don't see this idea in most other professions. Where did this strange idea come from? Is my car not safe unless the engineers that designed it had a calling to build safe cars? Is my house not safe for my children unless the construction crew didn't have a "calling"? Nursing is not the only profession that affects people's quality of life and you can only be a good nurse if you try to be one. There is certainly nothing wrong if you feel you are in nursing because of this "calling" business, but having a "calling" is will not, in itself, make you good at anything.
I must say that I find this "if you're not in nursing because of a 'calling' then you can't be a good nurse" attitude a bit disturbing. The implication that people can only be good at what you do due to a "calling" is simply not true. You certainly don't see this idea in most other professions. Where did this strange idea come from? Is my car not safe unless the engineers that designed it had a calling to build safe cars? Is my house not safe for my children unless the construction crew didn't have a "calling"? Nursing is not the only profession that affects people's quality of life and you can only be a good nurse if you try to be one. There is certainly nothing wrong if you feel you are in nursing because of this "calling" business, but having a "calling" is will not, in itself, make you good at anything.
:eek: 
CarolineRn
263 Posts
Well, as a new nurse (ADN) at this point, I feel having honest compassion and concern for the sick is my number one priority. Learning everything I can, on the job from the people I am lucky enough to work with is another priority, and basically always being open to learning. I am a sponge, and will take advantage of every knowledgable mind who's kind enough to allow it.
For me, the ADN program is a stepping stone. (A golden stepping stone, at that) I plan on getting my BSN, and eventually my masters. It's awesome that there are various plateaus in nursing, so that I can support my family while attaining the additional education which I feel is right for me. (LVN, ADN, BSN-- to me knowledgeable people are treasure troves, and I care not what their GPA was)
At this very point in time, I am focusing on just learning how to BE a nurse, as I feel school just gives us the basics, and that actual on the job learning is what makes us proficient, regardless of our educational backgrounds.
The BSN educated RNs that I work with do not give me the impression that they value me any less than anyone else. However, sometimes on this board I am given that impression. (sometimes) I just want to just point out to some of my BSN colleagues that school was hell for me too, and I was challenged constantly. It certainly was no cakewalk. I may lack some of the liberal arts classes which purportedly make us more "rounded" individuals, but who's to say I haven't gained those very attributes through my own life experiences?
I certainly respect and even am slightly envious of those of you who have gotten the extra education that I plan on obtaining, but I do hope that for those of you who may harbor even a slight degree of snobbery, you would try to be grateful that there are LVN and ADN programs which give those of us who cannot afford to be unemployed (or part-time employed) a fast track to easing the nursing shortage. Regardless of our educational status, in the final analysis we are all in this together.
We're all nurses, or on our way there. Let's stick together and give our profession the unity, dignity, and respect that we've all busted our a$$es for, regardless of educational status. Every single one of us are deserving of respect.