Jehovah's Witness nurses in the critical care unit?

[asdf88]

Hello

This is my first time posting a thread. I was just wondering if anyone is or knows of a Jehovah's Witness nurse who works in a critical care unit. Also if you dont mind can you tell me at which hospital? The reason I am asking is that I am also one of Jehovah's Witnesses and I just passed my NCLEX. Yay I really want to work in the critical care unit, specifically the CCU. However, when I explained to the supervisor of the ICU/CCU about the issue with the blood transfusion, she said she couldnt hire me on to the critical care unit. Yes, this hospital is offering critical care positions to new grads. I was really devastated because i wanted to really work in the CCU. So I was wondering if it's the same for other hospitals. I explained to the supervisor that I am willing to care for the patient who is receiving the blood transfusion, but that I would need a second nurse(most likely the nurse who would be verifying the blood with me) to spike the blood and press the start button. I do understand why the critical care environment may not want to have a nurse who cannot initiate the blood transfusion. So I was just wondering if I do not have a chance at all in a critical care unit. For now I am orienting in the med-surg floor and I still have lingering feelings for the critical care unit.

Thank You

[carolmaccas66, BSN, RN]

My brother is an elder with the JWs and though I have studied with them, I am not one of them. I strongly disagree with some of their beliefs, though I understand the reasoning behind them. I am a Registered Nurse down under BTW.

You should have really thought of this long & hard b4 going into nursing. I have known JW girls who decided not to do nursing because it clashes with their beliefs. Giving blood is an inherent part of the job, and though I do know re the reasoning why, did you not think this would be a problem? This is especially so in CCU/ICU/HDU and general wards. Also what about if you go to a gynaecology ward and have to care for someone who is wants/has had an abortion? Does this mean because the woman wants to or has had an abortion, they are not worthy of nursing care? You really need to think of all these situations in regards to nursing as the career for you. Perhaps you could do mental health where they don't do blood transfusions, or another area in nursing? There is a hospital here in Fremantle for JWs where they don't use blood at all, do u have any of those in the US where you could work? This is a real dilemma that you have to think carefully about - maybe speak to ur local elder for some advice.

[caroladybelle, BSN, RN]

I am sure the OP will giving blood transfusions on any floor not just Critical Care Units. This would mean another nurse would have to hang the blood and push the start button for the OP everytime. This would take care from other patients. Most nurses already feel we don't have enough time for our patient now. As nurses we do check blood with one another but we dont have hang it or start the blood for the other nurse. This could cause an uproar.

The big difference is that especially in the ICUs, or even surgical floors, is that seconds delay may make a much bigger difference.

While some floors may be able to take the extra time to find another nurse when immediate response is not the absolute necessity, some units do not have that luxury.

Recently, a pt that I worked with that had been completely hemodynamically stable suddenly developed a massive GI bleed and coded. Multiple blood product units within minutes due to the emergent nature.

In the aftermath, reports and data were gathered as to speed and efficacy of pts treatment. The amount of blood products in very brief period of time was staggering. I can imagine that if the primary nurse or those assisting him/her had posed the limitations that OP requires, the review team would have had serious issue with it, not to mention risk management.

As a nurse that believes in the right of women to choose abortion, but a personal belief that abortion is wrong, I do not work in a field of nursing that would require me act against my beliefs. I hold those beliefs but is not appropriate for me to delay/hold up another's care or to burden my coworkers unnecessarily because of those beliefs.

As such, many ICUs would probably have an issue with taking someone that cannot hang blood products. But there are other areas of nursing where that would be less of an issue.

[canoehead, BSN, RN]

Isn't there a federal law that states you cannot discriminate based on religious beliefs? If she can be reasonably accommodated her beliefs should not have disqualified her from getting that position. I agree that it will be a pain in the can for every other nurse, and not pressing the button seems like splitting hairs to me. But based on the law she could sue them for discrimination.

[Sun0408, ASN, RN]

Isn't there a federal law that states you cannot discriminate based on religious beliefs? If she can be reasonably accommodated her beliefs should not have disqualified her from getting that position. I agree that it will be a pain in the can for every other nurse, and not pressing the button seems like splitting hairs to me. But based on the law she could sue them for discrimination.

They did not hire her because she is JW, they didn't hire her because she can not/will not hang blood products. That is the same as saying she can not perform all the required duties of a RN that the ICU is looking for.. Her employment is based on stipulations she will not/can not do, there is a difference..

If her religious views did not hinder her care; that would be a reason to sue. This is clearly not the case. IMO

[Miss Chybil RN, BSN, RN]

I don't see what the big deal is myself. I mean considering blood always has to be verified by two nurses, anyway. I'm not a Jehovah's Witness. I'm an agnostic, so I have no dog in this fight, but come on!

Now, dear OP, I understand your religion is important to you, but you don't have to discuss it during an interview. Next time, keep it to yourself. You can't be discriminated against because of your religion. Plain and simple. But, you must also realize what nurses do in every unit. We take blood, we give blood. I'm in Med/Surg and we give blood all the time. What's in your favor is, there are always two nurses to verify the blood. If the only thing you have a problem with is pushing the start button, like I said, what's the big deal? Geez. I'd be happy to push the start button for a Jehovah's Witness. I'd be happy to connect the line. If there is such an emergency that the blood has to be administered within seconds, which is impossible considering the logistics one must go through to get blood from the lab, etc., I can't imagine there wouldn't be more than one person in the room at the time, anyway.

Now, if you were trying to get a job in an abortion clinic and you're against abortion, that would be a different story. Or, if you don't believe in birth control and you apply for a job at Planned Parenthood, I'd say that was a problem. I just don't see the problem here. If I were you, I might talk to someone who knows something about the law. You might also want to look inside yourself and see if you could be as open-minded about this situation as you're expecting everyone else to be. It's a two-way street. If someone's life and health were on the line, could you push the damned button?

[jcgrund]

Good point.

[evolvingrn, BSN, RN]

I don't see what the big deal is myself. I mean considering blood always has to be verified by two nurses, anyway. I'm not a Jehovah's Witness. I'm an agnostic, so I have no dog in this fight, but come on!

Now, dear OP, I understand your religion is important to you, but you don't have to discuss it during an interview. Next time, keep it to yourself. You can't be discriminated against because of your religion. Plain and simple. But, you must also realize what nurses do in every unit. We take blood, we give blood. I'm in Med/Surg and we give blood all the time. What's in your favor is, there are always two nurses to verify the blood. If the only thing you have a problem with is pushing the start button, like I said, what's the big deal? Geez. I'd be happy to push the start button for a Jehovah's Witness. I'd be happy to connect the line. If there is such an emergency that the blood has to be administered within seconds, which is impossible considering the logistics one must go through to get blood from the lab, etc., I can't imagine there wouldn't be more than one person in the room at the time, anyway.

Now, if you were trying to get a job in an abortion clinic and you're against abortion, that would be a different story. Or, if you don't believe in birth control and you apply for a job at Planned Parenthood, I'd say that was a problem. I just don't see the problem here. If I were you, I might talk to someone who knows something about the law. You might also want to look inside yourself and see if you could be as open-minded about this situation as you're expecting everyone else to be. It's a two-way street. If someone's life and health were on the line, could you push the damned button?

I get what your saying i just kind of think this argument is semantics .....I mean she is still partaking in administrating the blood whether she starts its or not. If you okay with treating the person while they get the blood products then im not sure why pushing start would be the 'treshhold/line" It just seems like a silly semantic.

[NurseCard, ADN]

I'm not a Jehovah's Witness, and I will never in a thousand years understand their beliefs... I'll never get Catholicism either though, so don't get too offended OP...

Having said that... I once worked in Med/Surge with a nurse who was a JW, and helping her hang her blood by spiking it and pushing the button, never seemed to be a problem at all. It wasn't a problem for me, or apparently any of the other nurses.

I guess I can see how, on some really fast paced Med/Surge units and ICU's, it would possibly be a problem tho'.

[apocatastasis]

As an ICU/ER nurse (and atheist), I don't think I should have to pick up the slack because of your religious beliefs. Sure, I'll check the blood with you, but YOU are responsible for YOUR patient: you spike the bag, you prime the line, you set the pump, and you monitor the patient.

I've had patients that needed 5-10 blood products in one shift... you're going to interrupt me every time your patient needs FFP, PRBCs, albumin? Honey, I got patients too, and I don't always agree with patient/family attitudes or plan of care but I still do my job. Maybe this kind of nursing isn't for you.

[Miss Chybil RN, BSN, RN]

I get what your saying i just kind of think this argument is semantics .....I mean she is still partaking in administrating the blood whether she starts its or not. If you okay with treating the person while they get the blood products then im not sure why pushing start would be the 'treshhold/line" It just seems like a silly semantic.

To some, the whole of religion is silly semantics. That's just not the issue.

[caroladybelle, BSN, RN]

Isn't there a federal law that states you cannot discriminate based on religious beliefs? If she can be reasonably accommodated her beliefs should not have disqualified her from getting that position. I agree that it will be a pain in the can for every other nurse, and not pressing the button seems like splitting hairs to me. But based on the law she could sue them for discrimination.

The argument can be easily made that because of the nature of the ICU work, that they cannot reasonably accomodate her. And quite bluntly, that accomodating her can endanger a pts life or impair their health.

They are not discriminating against her because of her beliefs, but how she is choosing to act on them. And as far as I knw that is not illegal if her beliefs prevent her frm doing the job required.

In the case that I cited, there were no less than 6 or more caregivers in the room at all times, making it quite crowded. Titrating pressors, intubating, bagging, trying to place art lines and cordis. It took two separate suctions to manage the amount of blood loss to keep the field clear. With all that was occuring, having a primary nurse, requiring someone else either take over the pt or push a button, would have probably sent the rest of the team over the edge. There was limited room to have several people to merely start blood, when everyone is busy to save a life in eminent danger and having to push another in the mix to push a button is a bit much.

And I guarantee you, when the case was reviewed, the fact that a primary CC nurse could/would not merely spike and push a button, would be called into question by the team. And the MDs, RTs, attendings would ALL seriously question why a nurse that cannot hang blood independantly is permitted to work in a critical area where time is of the essence and every hand in the room and near the bed has to perform at the utmost, or they are wasting space.

There are other nursing fields that can more easily accomodate a nurse that for whatever reason cannot hang blood

[Ruby Vee, BSN]

i wouldn't want to be the nurse working next to a nurse who refuses to spike blood or "push a button" in my icu. we give an awful lot of blood. to the op, if the blood isn't running properly, are you going to troubleshoot the line to make sure it does? or call in another nurse since to restart an iv or whatever would mean violating your beliefs?