It's not my job to pray with you.

Nurses Spirituality

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I am not religious. I do not pray. If praying makes you feel good then awesome. Do that. When patients are religious and need spirutual support, I am the first one to find their local pastor/rabbi/medicine man/etc. for them. This is how I can support my patient. I do not feel however, that I should be pressured to say prayers. yes, I will give my patient space and quiet time to pray if they want, but i don't feel it's my job to pray with patients. I feel this is over the line.

Specializes in tele, ICU, CVICU.

OP, also am curious what happened to bring about your post?

not that it matters, but I think of myself as more spiritual than religious. However, if my patient or patients' family ask me to hold their hands and pray for 30 seconds, I am darn well going to. IF you are invited into something so personal to people as religion, that means they value you, your time, your input and desire your presence for said event and to me, that's a huge compliment. Not that it is offensive to not pray with your patient, but I would personally feel somewhat ticked/hurt, if I asked someone to participate in such a special event and they did not.

I know one night, I went so above & beyond, busted my butt all night practically, to get the on-call chaplain for a patient at end of life. Once he finally arrived, the daughter all but threw him out. I usually have pretty tough skin, but I felt her reaction was very rude, because he was not the appropriate person to deliver last rites. In that small, rural community, a catholic priest is not the easiest to get, especially at 0230.

I think religion is always a touchy subject. And when you or a loved one is under extreme pressure due to illness, well sometimes people act out & don't mean to.

Specializes in hospice.
Well for one it's a very prestigious university that will no doubt open many doors for me. And I was never exposed to religion as I am now at this school, most of my classmates are all Catholics and alway wants to pray before study time or to take an exam, so I just go with it. But I never felt this uncomfortable around religion until I came to this school, and now I'm just suffocating in it. There is even a cathedral a walk ways from my dorm. You just can't get away from it.

Go to a Catholic university and then complain it's too Catholic?

I just can't even......

You chose to be there. You knew it was religious. Either pull up the big boy/girl pants and deal, or transfer. And as to prestigious.....when it comes to nursing Joe Six Pack from State U. has just as good a chance as you at basically every job once you both have your BSN.

Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
Wow this is all news to me--I didn't know nurses could discuss religion with patients (somewhat) openly. Sorry if this is a foolish question but since we're on this topic--let's say a patient and nurse happen to be the same religion. If the patient asks the nurse to pray with/over them and the nurse is comfortable, is this actually ok to do this instead of getting the chaplain? Sounds like some of you all have done this but I just wanted clarification. Unless it goes by hospital/facility policy.

I'm used to keeping religion and work strictly separate, unless the job is in a religious setting where it's expected... I guess I'm filled with incredulity because my previous position was so...well religion couldn't really be mentioned otherwise it could be seen as offensive talk.

I will be starting nursing school this fall, and my only experience in healthcare has been in an office setting (case management alongside actual nurses and social workers). Hence my ignorance lol.

Also OP, I am interested to know what happened to create this thread, as well. Did you get in trouble for something at your Catholic school?

It's too risky to discuss religion with patients. (And politics.) If someone asks me to pray with them, I'm OK just standing there silently while they pray -- and if they think I'm praying too, all the better. But if someone asks me to pray OVER them, I'm getting the chaplain.

I don't know that anyone here is talking about DISCUSSING religion with patients. More along the lines of praying with them or for them. Hardly the same thing as opening up a whole highway of dialouge about beliefs and who's God is the right God...

Darn I posted a comment but it didn't go thru. Semantics fail on my part--when I said discussing, in my head I was just thinking about patients asking the nurse to pray--not actually discussing differences between religions.

My question is more along the lines of--say you have a religious patient who asks the nurse to pray WITH him/her--it looks like that is ok from what others have said. What if the patient asks the nurse to pray OVER him/her and both parties consent--is THAT allowed or does the chaplain need to get involved, as others here have done/stated?

Specializes in Psych, Addictions, SOL (Student of Life).
Well for one it's a very prestigious university that will no doubt open many doors for me. And I was never exposed to religion as I am now at this school, most of my classmates are all Catholics and alway wants to pray before study time or to take an exam, so I just go with it. But I never felt this uncomfortable around religion until I came to this school, and now I'm just suffocating in it. There is even a cathedral a walk ways from my dorm. You just can't get away from it.

It sounds as if you are attending a religious school. I am currently attending a Christian University as a grad student. I was glancing through the undergrad handbook and noticed that there is a required number of chapel hours per semester. Student log in on an honor system so the religion police are not stalking them. Also the mission statement of the school states that it is a Christian University and as such all subjects are taught from a Christian perspective. It also says something like "You do not have to be a Christian to attend but you must respectful to the Christian traditions of the University.

If you find it that suffocating you should find a new school

I am not religious. I do not pray. If praying makes you feel good then awesome. Do that. When patients are religious and need spirutual support, I am the first one to find their local pastor/rabbi/medicine man/etc. for them. This is how I can support my patient. I do not feel however, that I should be pressured to say prayers. yes, I will give my patient space and quiet time to pray if they want, but i don't feel it's my job to pray with patients. I feel this is over the line.

I do agree with your stance. I pray a lot but I still call the chaplain for any patient's spiritual needs while in the hospital. The spiritual care staff members are excellent in providing for emotional/spiritual needs and often able to say prayers suited for all types of religions. However, if a patients asks me to pray with them, i will stand there, bow my head, and "pray with them". If asked to pray over them, I would politely say that I will call the chaplain for them as I have never done such for anyone.

Just a side note: I hope that these exact words you wrote (or "verbal" tone) are not conveyed the same way to your patients or their family members. As other posters have said, nurses are expected to provide a patient-centered care. If patients hear these exact words (with the same tone i am hearing in my mind while i read your post), the trusting relationship between you and the patient may get compromised.

I think being in this type of school with your disbelief in prayers would be really challenging for you (while you are in this school). However, I have seen others like you succeed anyway. You just really have to be careful with your words and actions as you chose to attend this religious school. Good luck!

Specializes in Med nurse in med-surg., float, HH, and PDN.

I went to a Catholic Hospital nursing school. I was one of the two protestants in my class.

When I moved into my dorm room, the first thing I did was take the crucifix off my wall; when I moved out, the last thing I did was return the crucifix to it's place on the wall.

They 'encouraged' me to go to mass; I'd just shrug and give a little smile and said, "But I'm not Catholic."

The reason I chose to go to this particular school was their reputation for outstanding education, and so many nurses I asked said that they really liked working with that school's grads because "They really know what they're doing!"

That was good enough for me. I didn't hold it against them for being Catholic. ;)

With regards to praying with the patient, I'm game, so long as I don't have to verbally participate.

Specializes in Case mgmt., rehab, (CRRN), LTC & psych.
It's too risky to discuss religion with patients. (And politics.)
Yep. There are three topics I avoid discussing in detail with patients, families and coworkers: politics, religion, and finances.

It is not as if I'm going to change anyone's mind on these polarizing issues, and no one's going to change my views, so why discuss them?

Specializes in M/S, Pulmonary, Travel, Homecare, Psych..
No, but my school boasts on being holistic focused.

I just want to interject for a moment, because this hit an exposed nerve for me.

"Holistic Care" has a definite definition and way of being implemented. Different people interpret things differently, I can agree to that. But this does not mean we must accept every wild use of the term either.

Holistic Care, does not does not does not not not not...........involve participating in the activity yourself (that is called empathy training). Not on any level, in any school, at any healthcare institution.

Must I take insulin myself to give holistic care to my diabetic patient? If my patient is newly diagnosed with A-fib, shall I begin taking Coumadin so that I am more holistic with them? If a patient has a new order for rehab, am I less of a nurse for not going to the gym myself afterwards?

Holistic care involves being open minded to the patients needs and accommodating them even when the need seems trite or unimportant to us. We must be tolerant of differing viewpoints from the patient, empathetic enough to understand that different things are important to them and focused enough to detect these needs without necessarily having them pointed out for us.

Ex: Patient comes to the unit with a broken ankle. In his admission interview, I notice he mentions that he owns a dog. My care would be more holistic if I were to ask him if accommodations had been made for the dogs care or not (and if not, ask if I could do anything to help with that). It does not involve me leaving the hospital and going out to buy my own dog, or going to his house myself to care for the dog.

This is a pet peeve because the term "Holistic Care" gets thrown around with little respect for what it's goal is. It's turned into a buzz word, and I fear we will eventually throw the baby out with the bath water when we tire of hearing it.

Specializes in NICU, Trauma, Oncology.
Well for one it's a very prestigious university that will no doubt open many doors for me. And I was never exposed to religion as I am now at this school, most of my classmates are all Catholics and alway wants to pray before study time or to take an exam, so I just go with it. But I never felt this uncomfortable around religion until I came to this school, and now I'm just suffocating in it. There is even a cathedral a walk ways from my dorm. You just can't get away from it.

Is it a catholic school?

Back to the OP's original statements. If you don't believe in some higher omnipotent being, that's fine. If you don't want to pray, that's fine. You could stand there quietly. You could ask if the patient wants someone of their own faith to come instead. Or, as I've heard one nurse tell a patient so nicely, "I'm so sorry, but I don't feel it's appropriate for me to deceive you into thinking I'm praying with you when I'm really not doing so. I'd be happy to call the chaplain so we can be sure your God gets the message you are trying to send." If I hadn't heard it with my own two ears I wouldn't believe it. The patient chuckled and said "Honey, you are the first person who's been honest with me all day." (The patient was dying, her family "didn't want her told" and the MD and CM went along with it (ANOTHER WHOLE CAN OF WORDS FOR A DIFFERENT THREAD), but we all knew she knew.)

Specializes in Oncology; medical specialty website.
It is your job, however, to provide spiritually appropriate care. If someone asks you to pray with them, you can stand there and be silent while they pray. If they want you to pray over them, then that is the point where you get someone else to come in.

Your post is pretty militant in tone. I hope you consider the spiritual needs of your patients as an important part of their care. For many patients, their spiritual state is just as important, if not more so, than their physical state.

I'm from the Bible Belt and many of my family members would place prayer as a priority over many medical interventions.

Whether you agree with the patient's practices or not, it is your role to be respectful.

S/He should not have to be forced to stand at attention while someone is praying. As long as s/he makes sure that the patient gets spiritual support, that is sufficient.

Nurses do not need to take on roles that are already filled by other staff. Should s/he try to fix the toilet if it's not working? If the patient needs financial assistance with filling prescriptions. should s/he take care of that?

Delegation and prioritization are how nurses work within a team. Not to mention, the nurse has rights too. If a patient wanted his/her nurse to assist in a voodoo ritual, would you tell that nurse it's his/her responsibility?

The OP made it clear that the needs of the patient would be taken care of. Generally, I like your posts, but I think you're the one who sounds militant on this issue.

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