I just finished a CNA course at a public technical college.
On our last day of class we had a small graduation ceremony with the students and a few residents of the nursing home where we did clinicals.
Our instructor invited a guest speaker from a religious group she belongs to. The guest speaker preached about her religion and put down everyone who doesn't practice the same religion.
We had to go up one by one to receive a certificate from our teacher and a New Testament book from the guest speaker.
The school is not a private school and has no religious affiliation. This is a state approved program. The program had no religion component, discussions, or learning material. We were never asked if we felt comfortable with this before we were blindsided with it.
THIS ALL TOOK PLACE BEFORE OUR FINAL REVIEW WITH THE TEACHER FOR THE CLASS!
Is this legal?
What would you do?
How would you feel if you felt forced to participate in something like this outside of your own religious beliefs?
I'm not distorting the OP's position at all. I'm simply saying that we are going overboard in my opinion and that you would have to live in a cave if you wanted to avoid all opinions.
"I want to avoid all opinions" is not an argument that has been made by anyone and that is why your argument is a straw man.
The Rev. Phelps is not "overly religious" and you missed that. He isn't religious at all. He is insane and hate-filled and bigoted and ugly and mean to picket funerals of soldiers holding signs that "God Hates . . . . ".
And your analogy still doesn't fit.
steph
If it suits you, Speaker with an inappropriate for the situation religious message : Mr. Phelps.
Do you consider a school inviting Mr. Phelps to share with kindergartners his unique perspective on the status of their souls (and perhaps some of his literature on the matter) legal? Why?
Let's remember though that we like to respect one another here to have their opinionis and beliefs without resorting to saying those beleifs border on mental illness.
More in keeping with how we like things to go here, perhaps you can say "As an atheist, I completely disagree with everything you just said, because............."
All opinions are valid and should be respected.
Thanks.
Tweety, I was being sarcastic and showing that the other poster would be just as offended had I said that at a ceremony as what this lady had said at Shoes' ceremony. I don't believe that religious beliefs border on mental illness, but if this woman can say I can't be happy without Christ in my life, then I should be able to make some outrageous, insane claims too.
It's amazing how much back and forth is going on :argue:.
:typing
Pretty much everyone has agreed that it was quite inappropriate for such a thing to happen at this event, and I think thats really all that matters. The original poster has already written to his/her Dean stating her feelings on the matter, and hopefully such an event wont reoccur.
The beautiful thing about America is its diversity, and though we hide in here behind our usernames and avatars, we are given that opportunity to be ourselves. And though some of you claim to not be specifically putting any one religion down, whether Christianity or Atheism, there are a lot of negative undertones in the majority of these posts. I'm sure we can all agree that there are extreme sides to all religions, not to mention that fact that Christianity is broken up into so many different sects that without actually being present at this event we couldn't possibly know which this speaker represented.
Overall, I'm glad the original poster had an outlet to release their fustration and look for advice ... shouldn't it end there?
Maybe the Mods should close this thread before anyone gets offended... I dunno just my .
I don't think jbeau actually thinks that (or at least was seriously directing it at that poster). I think he was using it as an example to point out to those who see nothing wrong with the scenario as described in the OP.
Tweety, I was being sarcastic and showing that the other poster would be just as offended had I said that at a ceremony as what this lady had said at Shoes' ceremony. I don't believe that religious beliefs border on mental illness, but if this woman can say I can't be happy without Christ in my life, then I should be able to make some outrageous, insane claims too.
Fair enough. Gotta watch the sarcasm because it can really send things south quick when someone doesn't understand. Best to be a bit more direct, with respect of course. In my opinion that is. :)
We've had several looooooong threads on the topic of religion over the years that have deteriorated, (to the point of people getting banned from the site), so perhaps as a mod, I'm a bit gun shy of this topic. We should stop to think about whether or not what we are posting is respectful and that we're talking about the topic, rather than a person and their beliefs.
although highly inappropriate, it would seem the first amendment would protect the speaker:
and, the following statement seems to be the premise of every free speech argument:
"The question in every case is whether the words used are used in such a nature as to create a clear and present danger that they will bring about the substantive evils that Congress has a right to prevent."
although highly inappropriate, it would seem the first amendment would protect the speaker:
and, the following statement seems to be the premise of every free speech argument:
"The question in every case is whether the words used are used in such a nature as to create a clear and present danger that they will bring about the substantive evils that Congress has a right to prevent."
I did a bit of research and consulted with an attorney friend of mine and found Lee v. Weisman, 505 U.S. 577 (1992) as relevant USSC precedent covering this very issue. It was regarding a Rabbi as a guest speaker at at a middle school graduation leading everybody in a non-denominational prayer. This pretty much addresses the question of "Is it legal?" with a resounding no.
.
hypocaffeinemia, BSN, RN
1,381 Posts
"I want to avoid all opinions" is not an argument that has been made by anyone and that is why your argument is a straw man.