I just finished a CNA course at a public technical college.
On our last day of class we had a small graduation ceremony with the students and a few residents of the nursing home where we did clinicals.
Our instructor invited a guest speaker from a religious group she belongs to. The guest speaker preached about her religion and put down everyone who doesn't practice the same religion.
We had to go up one by one to receive a certificate from our teacher and a New Testament book from the guest speaker.
The school is not a private school and has no religious affiliation. This is a state approved program. The program had no religion component, discussions, or learning material. We were never asked if we felt comfortable with this before we were blindsided with it.
THIS ALL TOOK PLACE BEFORE OUR FINAL REVIEW WITH THE TEACHER FOR THE CLASS!
Is this legal?
What would you do?
How would you feel if you felt forced to participate in something like this outside of your own religious beliefs?
that is a total denigration to have to sit through that much bullcrap; and if i were you i would have gotten up and stared that preacher down, making sure that that preacher gets the message that such proselyting is unacceptable and intolerable--the nerve of making villains of many, and to make it worse over religion. m
It's kind of funny. I'm glad the Dean supported me, however is it wrong of me to expect more? I mean I'll accept this email as an apology and move on, but I kind of feel they could have sent a written apology to all of the students involved? I'm guessing I am the only person who complained, but I think the other students have the right to know that this is unacceptable at our school too? Maybe if more people were aware this type of ceremony is not to be done at a public school, then it wouldn't have happened in the first place. I don't mean to put down my instructor, but as far as I can tell she is a small town lady and it probably never crossed her mind that one or more of the students in her class might be offended. Now the other students may go on in their nursing assistant or nursing careers thinking this is acceptable.
Specializes in ER, ICU, Infusion, peds, informatics.
i can remember when i taught nursing school at a vocational-technical school and was planning the pinning ceremony.
if we conducted the ceremony on school grounds, we could not have any prayer, religious speakers, etc. but, if we had the ceremony off-site, it was o.k.
not sure if this fits the op's situation or not. if so, it probably was proper. (i'm not commenting about the proselytizing, however. just the setting and the use of religion/religious speakers in the program.)
this is the same case i came across as well......
below, red highlights my emphasis, applies to public schools:
as for the above quotes/links, i have no clue if accurate or not and/or if applies in the op's situation.
i would think (hope) that this wouldn't be the case since, in this situation, they were required to attend. had it been an optional graduation ceremony, then it probably would have been ok.
to the op: while i understand your disappointment in the response you got, i think it is pretty amazing you got that much of a reply.
It's kind of funny. I'm glad the Dean supported me, however is it wrong of me to expect more? I mean I'll accept this email as an apology and move on, but I kind of feel they could have sent a written apology to all of the students involved? I'm guessing I am the only person who complained, but I think the other students have the right to know that this is unacceptable at our school too? Maybe if more people were aware this type of ceremony is not to be done at a public school, then it wouldn't have happened in the first place. I don't mean to put down my instructor, but as far as I can tell she is a small town lady and it probably never crossed her mind that one or more of the students in her class might be offended. Now the other students may go on in their nursing assistant or nursing careers thinking this is acceptable.
I think the Dean apologizing and bringing it up in staff meetings is an appropriate response to your situation.
i would think (hope) that this wouldn't be the case since, in this situation, they were required to attend. had it been an optional graduation ceremony, then it probably would have been ok.
to the op: while i understand your disappointment in the response you got, i think it is pretty amazing you got that much of a reply.
not to get this thread started again, but in the landmark case lee v. weisman, 505 u.s. 577 (1992), whether or not a graduation is optional or not was found not to have a bearing on the legality. here's a quote:
addressing the state's contention that attendance at the graduation exercises was voluntary, kennedy remarked that "to say a teenage student has a real choice not to attend her high school graduation is formalistic in the extreme. true, deborah could elect not to attend commencement without renouncing her diploma; but we shall not allow the case to turn on this point. everyone knows that, in our society and in our culture, high school graduation is one of life's most significant occasions. a school rule which excuses attendance is beside the point. attendance may not be required by official decree, yet it is apparent that a student is not free to absent herself from the graduation exercise in any real sense of the term "voluntary," for absence would require forfeiture of those intangible benefits which have motivated the student through youth and all her high school years." 505 u.s. 577, 595.
i believe the same would carry true with college level graduation.
Tweety, I was being sarcastic and showing that the other poster would be just as offended had I said that at a ceremony as what this lady had said at Shoes' ceremony. I don't believe that religious beliefs border on mental illness, but if this woman can say I can't be happy without Christ in my life, then I should be able to make some outrageous, insane claims too.
Really? I didn't pick up on your subtlety, then. And I've been trying to read this whole mess with some sensitivity and openness.
And just because I'm sittin' here on a Saturday night with nothing better to do, can I add my thoughts? I know it's an oldish thread...
I'm a Christian, yet would have been a little bothered by the OP's situation. The apology she received seems adequate, along with the assurance that it is not the way the school intends things to be and it won't happen again. Nuff said.
It's possible the person who invited the speaker didn't know how over-the-top the speaker's message would be.
As for some of the other comments (not from the OP): So, are you gonna slap handcuffs on the school administrators and arrest them for their "illegal activity"? I don't think you'll get far. A school inviting a speaker in no way compares to congress passing a law establishing a religion (even if some judges think it does).
Man, when I spoke at my high school graduation I mentioned God or Jesus in ONE SENTENCE in my speech... should I have been arrested? (btw, no one asked to review our speeches prior to the ceremony. I had no idea this would bother anyone. My mother told me she thought I should keep it completely secular but she didn't insist, and I left it the way I wrote it. Would I do it now? No.)
Thank you very much for updating us on what happened. So many times people get our interest in situations, then we never get to find out the outcome. Glad that your concerns were acknowledged. Thanks for such a thought provoking thread.
southlandshari
66 Posts
just read the update, never mind