Hello!! I just recently graduated with an ADN degree one week ago and waiting to take my boards. I been.an LPN 8yrs amd finally decided togo back for my RN anf here i am...but i digress...
Is having an ADN REALLY that? I already have a job lined up and i will be starting soon....the main reason i offered the position was becuz of my RN completion and i will be takin my NCLEX soon. Grant it, it at a LTAC facility but i figure this is a great way for me to get experience and.not become part of the sooo many new grads (ADN&BSN) that are not employed becuz they soooo desire to work in a hospital.
So please can someone clarify, IS HAVING AN A.D.N. DEGREE A TERRIBLE HORRIBLE NO GOOD VERY BAD WASTE??
(some post i read sure makes it feel that way) :-(
Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.
With all due respect you are a seasoned RN with nearly a quarter century of experience under your belt. It is not quite fair to compare yourself to new grads entering the nursing employment market today.
Twenty years ago wait lists for entry into nursing programs were are and often standards a bit lower. One not only could enter a program with a 2.5 GPA with ease but remain, graduate, and sit for state boards (a two or three day pencil and paper affair given twice a year only in most states) all with that same low grade point average. One could also graduate on a Friday and start working the next following Monday as a GN all with that same minimal GPA, no certs or anything else required.
Know plenty of ADN nurses at least here in NYC with equal if not a bit more years than your good self that have been *informed* they need to get their BSN. A few work at NS-LIJ facilities and like yourself had no plans on "going back" but when their hospital became part of the NS-LIJ system and that place instituted a BSN policy things were what they were.
Obviously cannot speak for the rest of the USA but here in the NYC/NJ area new grads without a BSN are low on the totem pole when it comes to hiring. An outstanding ADN grad *might* get an open slot but she/he also will likely be informed continued employment past a certain point requires obtaining the BSN. Have no proof but feel certain the various software programs used for online submission of applications in this area screen out new grads and or others without "BSN".
You KNOW that posting that nursing programs years ago had lower requirements and somehow inferior is simply not true. For every program you could name with a 2.5 I could name another program that required a higher GPA for entry and staying in a program.
Yes we took a test over 3 days and waited almost 4 months to know if we passed. Because of this....there was GN status and hospitals were wiling to train and educate new grads...I think it prepared us to be independent quicker with a higher level of competence. To be demoted when you failed, your pay cut, and have everyone KNOW you failed was humiliating and demeaning.
We we not allowed to take the test over and over again 4, 5, 6 times was NEVER allowed. You got one more chance and had to repeat that subject to test again. I am unclear how a BSN vs a ASN made a difference at boards or competence as a nurse. A nurse who fails his/her boards 5 or six times practices right next to the nurse who passed on the first try...no certs or anything. So what is the difference? frankly I am disturbed that some states allow this repetitive testing.
I agree that in this current market it is the best decision in some markets to get the BSN right out of the gate. I feel there are many bad nursing programs out there is this boon for a nursing education and nursing is failing to set basic requirements and standards across the board and monitoring to workforce to prevent this current plethora of new grads saturating a market and dropping benefits and salaries something the medical profession never allowed....shame on us.
I am an ADN grad and I do not feel my education was inferior. In fact what I read here my education was far superior to what I read here. Both BSN and ADN. I got my BSN much later because someone else paid for it to look good on paper. For me...it added nothing to my competence.
I am having my daughter enter at the BSN level because the market dictates it where I live for her gainful employment and not because I feel that other nursing grads are inferior. If she cold get a job with a ADN...to save debt you bet that is the route I'd choose
Did not say nor mean to imply the programs were "inferior" just the contrast between getting into and remaining in nursing school twenty years ago versus many today. My example was an "average" and as such of course there would have been programs with tighter entry and retention standards. Being as all this may do not ever recall a hospital in NYC stating in it's hiring policy for new grads that they have a gpa of 3.0 or above to be a "preferred" candidate.
I too agree with Esme......even comparing my LPN program i completed over 8 years ago to my RN progrm i jus recently graduated from...there is a notable difference in the student population. Im my lpn program there was many many more of us students who studied hard to keep our GPA above 3.5 studied hard to grasp the fundamentals, pharmacology, and assesments concepts of the program. We had to maintain an 80% average not to get removed from the program. Less than an 84% was anything but stellar. The waiting list was as long as a laundry list and depending on how you did on the entrance exam, is what dictated if you were accepted into the progrm. Exceptional school! (The nurse theorist the school exemplified was Ms. Florence Nightingale.) As far as my RN, thats a horse of another color. Good program, but the drawback was with a student body in which all they cared about was passing. We had to maintain an 78% and for most students, NOT ALL, 78% to them in their mind may as well been an "A+" and their name put on the deans list. There was 5 of us out of 16 who consistently studied hard to keep our grades above a 90%. Students not completing homework assignments, missing class lab and clinical was a bit short of routine even with a strict attendance policy in place but some students felt since they were "allowed" to miss a certain number of days they would exercise that "right". Missing school "just because", to me and the way my Old School 50 yr old LPN program conditioned my mind set, was UNACCEPTABLE to say the least. The RN program i went to was great,teachers were awesome, but many times i felt personally offeneded because i would be proud of my 89% i received on a test i studied over a week for only to have a fellow student tell me "no matter how much you study we will have the same degree"...never would anyone in my lpn program let that come out their mouth. I have only been a nurse since 2005 and when i compare nursing to then and now all i can do is shake my head sometimes. YES there are some excellent new grads completing nursing school but they are far and few between. O how i wish i could have went to nursing school 20 years ago because schools took pride in their graduates and graduates took pride in their opportunity to begin a wonderful career serving to the people who need us most (our patients) all while learning new experiences everyday. Back in those days it was not all about "the money" or " i want to be a nurse because of job security". People became nurses because one had a passion for life, education,people, and healthy living!
I have to wonder how nursing programs are different today vs. 20 years ago when I was in school.
I met a new grad LVN recently who did not do one single minute of clinicals in a hospital setting. They did their peds rotation in a daycare! The rest of the clinicals were spent in nursing homes.
I have heard of RNs graduating now without competance in even basic skills such as venipuncture.
I can truly say as a new grad LVN and ADN 20 years ago, I was adequately prepared. Our classes and clinicals were well-rounded and very skills-intensive. I didn't lack any basic skills or competancy when I graduated.
I fell into the "you have to get a BSN" trap, because that is what I was told and believed. The truth is, everyone I know who graduated with ADNs got hospital jobs. No, not in the fancy hospitals in the major city nearby, but still in good hospitals in the suburbs. You can always go back and get your BSN if you want it or need it to accomplish whatever career goals you have for yourself, but there is nothing wrong with the route you chose.
Specializes in Hospice, corrections, psychiatry, rehab, LTC.
I got an ADN due to time contraints. I had a BA in another field before going to school, so in terms of pure classwork there wouldn't have been a great deal of difference time-wise. However, the BSN programs in my area required me to be available pretty much all day and some evenings. I was locked into a Monday-Friday 8-5 job that I could not simply quit and have no income while I went to school. An ADN program in my area instituted a program for people like me, with classes and clinicals held during evening and weekend hours.
I graduated 18 years ago this coming Saturday. I am currently a DON in a state correctional facility, so it doesn't seem to have hurt my career too much not to have a BSN.
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
Hello!! I just recently graduated with an ADN degree one week ago and waiting to take my boards. I been.an LPN 8yrs amd finally decided togo back for my RN anf here i am...but i digress...
Is having an ADN REALLY that? I already have a job lined up and i will be starting soon....the main reason i offered the position was becuz of my RN completion and i will be takin my NCLEX soon. Grant it, it at a LTAC facility but i figure this is a great way for me to get experience and.not become part of the sooo many new grads (ADN&BSN) that are not employed becuz they soooo desire to work in a hospital.
So please can someone clarify, IS HAVING AN A.D.N. DEGREE A TERRIBLE HORRIBLE NO GOOD VERY BAD WASTE??
(some post i read sure makes it feel that way) :-(
Nope. You already have a job lined up, so you're one step ahead of many. I would actually prefer it if my unit hired all ADNs. They'd end up staying longer before leaving to pursue the ever-popular CRNA.
It's important to look at the actual differences in job placement in your area based on degree, the hype often thrown around in these threads is that you're at a huge disadvantage with an ADN, although the facts don't support that. In one study at least, BSN grads at a combined job placement at 4 months of about 65%, ADN grads were at 61%, not a huge difference.
It's important to look at the actual differences in job placement in your area based on degree the hype often thrown around in these threads is that you're at a huge disadvantage with an ADN, although the facts don't support that. In one study at least, BSN grads at a combined job placement at 4 months of about 65%, ADN grads were at 61%, not a huge difference.
That's an interesting article, the "trends" are interesting. I wish they broke down the percentage working in their ideal jobs and/or acute care vs LTC.
I have an ADN. I changed majors two years into college; I was going to a very expensive Lutheran school that happens to be known for my initial major. When I decided to become a nurse, I didn't see why I (and my parents) should have to pay all this money for a nursing degree. I transferred to my local state university, but then found out the wait list for the nursing program was YEARS long, and that's if you had a 4.0 which I didn't. I had gotten many B's and a few C's in the CRAZY DIFFICULT humanities classes from my Lutheran college. I didn't want to spend 6+ years in college and not be called "Dr." ;)so over to the tech school I went.
I graduated before sign-on bonuses went the way of the tan M&M; I actually had a job lined up at a neighboring state's university hospital a month before I even graduated. I learned a ton and moved to their SICU/CVICU (the two units shared staff and a manager) a year and a half later. Then I decided to take some time off to be home w/ my kids and had a hard time getting back into the hospital, but I'm convinced it was due to the job market more so than my lack of a BSN. I did end up getting a job in an LTACH which got me the current hospital experience that most positions wanted, and last year I was hired in the SICU of a level 1. During a review, my manager said she hired me b/c she could tell I was "pt and family focused." Meanwhile, a friend from church was a traditional college student, graduated with her BSN at 22 in 2008, and worked in a SNF for five years. She just recently started her first hospital job.
Esme12, ASN, BSN, RN
20,908 Posts
Yes we took a test over 3 days and waited almost 4 months to know if we passed. Because of this....there was GN status and hospitals were wiling to train and educate new grads...I think it prepared us to be independent quicker with a higher level of competence. To be demoted when you failed, your pay cut, and have everyone KNOW you failed was humiliating and demeaning.
We we not allowed to take the test over and over again 4, 5, 6 times was NEVER allowed. You got one more chance and had to repeat that subject to test again. I am unclear how a BSN vs a ASN made a difference at boards or competence as a nurse. A nurse who fails his/her boards 5 or six times practices right next to the nurse who passed on the first try...no certs or anything. So what is the difference? frankly I am disturbed that some states allow this repetitive testing.
I agree that in this current market it is the best decision in some markets to get the BSN right out of the gate. I feel there are many bad nursing programs out there is this boon for a nursing education and nursing is failing to set basic requirements and standards across the board and monitoring to workforce to prevent this current plethora of new grads saturating a market and dropping benefits and salaries something the medical profession never allowed....shame on us.
I am an ADN grad and I do not feel my education was inferior. In fact what I read here my education was far superior to what I read here. Both BSN and ADN. I got my BSN much later because someone else paid for it to look good on paper. For me...it added nothing to my competence.
I am having my daughter enter at the BSN level because the market dictates it where I live for her gainful employment and not because I feel that other nursing grads are inferior. If she cold get a job with a ADN...to save debt you bet that is the route I'd choose