(So glad I stumbled across this website again after almost 6 years! I need to change my username because I am not an aspiring nurse anymore, I have been a nurse for almost 3 years! ?)
Anyway, I really do not want to take this new covid vaccine. I know I can’t be the only one who feels this way. Typically I am not an anti-vaxxer but something about this illness is making me think otherwise. For personal reasons I really do not want to take it when available at my hospital, but I’m afraid it will be mandatory. I am almost considering finding a new job if my hospital forces us all to take it. What a shame because I do like my job and wouldn’t know what else to turn to that isn’t nursing, because chances are most healthcare related places of employment will likely require all employees take it.
I want to use the excuse of it being against my religion but I already took the flu vaccine this year. I have nothing against the flu vaccine but didn’t necessarily want it, but my hospital practically FORCED everyone to take it unless they grant you an exemption. I’m afraid they’ll question me why I took the flu shot but cannot take the covid vaccine.
What do you guys think about this? Will you be taking the vaccine? I just want us to be able to make our own decisions about this. If patients can refuse medications, procedures, and treatments, why can’t healthcare workers do the same? I read in multiple articles it will not be required by the federal government but each state and employer can decide whether or not it will be mandatory.
And forget the $1500 “stimulus check” that may be offered if you take it. All the money in the world would not change my mind about taking the vaccine. I feel as though if you have to bribe people to take it, something is peculiar.
I don’t know why this is bothering me so much. It should be a choice in my opinion. But by telling a few friends about not wanting it I feel judged. I have worked with covid patients multiple times since I am one of the younger nurses who does not have any kids/am pregnant. I feel like week after week I was always chosen to go to the covid section. At first I was mad but now it doesn’t bother me. I am not afraid to be near covid patients. Luckily through all this time I haven’t caught it. I always tell people I’d rather catch it than get this vaccine. That’s how strongly I feel against taking the vaccine. All of my non-nursing who have had covid are covered and thriving. To me catching it isn’t the biggest deal but others have called me selfish because I could be spreading it to others. Why is it looked at as selfish for not wanting to inject something into MY body. #mybodymychoice
Am I thinking about this too much? What would you do?
I respect your perspective, but I disagree. As for my debt until a year ago I was making 60k with no benefits. Also, I racked up most of my debt (about 130K) on my ASN, BSN and over 300 credit hours in other undergrad stuff (Biology degree, pre Pharm ect when I was in my 20's and 30s). The rest is interest and credit cards. I do believe all three branches will be controlled by those with a left of center perspective. I may not be the "brightest" guy around but were I in charge of the D strategy it would be simple:
a. Overturn the filibuster.
b. Reform the Supreme Court by adding more seats to bring more balance and further important progressive goals.
c. Work to admit Puerto Rico and the District of Columbia into the Union.
d. Work for immigration report and allow family unification and greatly expand immigration.
e. Work for a direct election that supersedes the current electoral system.
f. Work for a "universal basic income" as a "set point" for those earning under a certain level.
g. Work for a "public option" that competed with and eventually supplanted the private system.
If I a mere simple PMHNP can envision this then I assure you that people exponentially smarter, more connected and ruthless than me will work to implement these items. I assure you they believe "my side" is every bit as deleterious and bad for America, as I believe their side represents capitulation to socialism and eventually China (saying we would probably do the same if the situations were reversed). I may as well be on the Enterprise with the Borg announcing "You will be Assimilated". I at least can recognize when I'm beaten.
I respect your perspective, but I disagree. As for my debt until a year ago I was making 60k with no benefits. Also, I racked up most of my debt (about 130K) on my ASN, BSN and over 300 credit hours in other undergrad stuff (Biology degree, pre Pharm ect when I was in my 20's and 30s). The rest is interest and credit cards. I do believe all three branches will be controlled by those with a left of center perspective. I may not be the "brightest" guy around but were I in charge of the D strategy it would be simple:
a. Overturn the filibuster.
b. Reform the Supreme Court by adding more seats to bring more balance and further important progressive goals.
c. Work to admit Puerto Rico and the District of Columbia into the Union.
d. Work for immigration reform and allow family unification and greatly expand immigration.
e. Work for a direct election that supersedes the current electoral system.
f. Work for a "universal basic income" as a "set point" for those earning under a certain level.
g. Work for a "public option" that competed with and eventually supplanted the private system.
If I a mere simple PMHNP can envision this then I assure you that people exponentially smarter, more connected and ruthless than me will work to implement these items. I assure you they believe "my side" is every bit as deleterious and bad for America, as I believe their side represents capitulation to socialism and eventually China (saying we would probably do the same if the situations were reversed). I may as well be on the Enterprise with the Borg announcing "You will be Assimilated". I at least can recognize when I'm beaten.
Haha. I agree totally with your points above and get you wanting PS5. I have had a few autistic kids in court and I can see that it is a great source of pleasure in their life and they are GOOD at it! Everyone is forgiven for some trash diversions in our lives. Some of us need it a little more:) However, as I watch Trumpers scaling and breaking into the WH I prefer bubbly.
Specializes in Pediatrics, Pediatric Float, PICU, NICU.
55 minutes ago, myoglobin said:
Also, I don't particularly care if you take me "seriously" much of the time I am attempting to be of good humor. Consider, the last weeks with the loss of Trump and now Congress have been some of the worst in my life (up there with the death of my parents as I believe the consequences for our nation will be long lasting, perhaps eternal). Still, life goes on (until it doesn't) and I'm trying to find some positive aspects of the world in which I now find myself, me and the 70 million plus other people who oppose almost literally everything about the new government from lockdowns for Covid to other issues that will be forthcoming.
Ahh yes, you mean the thugs that are currently storming the Capitol, breaking into offices and defacing the building. Those looters and rioters, lock them up, amiright?!
Wearing a mask was not an option. It was take the shot or find a different job. They had offered a mask as an option in the past, but transitioned to "shot only" in the last several years.
My facility had previously allowed mask usage in lieu of influenza vaccination. It seemed to me widespread among many unit secretaries. What I also found widespread is masks being worn improperly basically as necklaces. The next flu season, there was no exemption.
While I'm extremely pro covid vaccination (just got my second dose), I would recommend everyone get their financial houses in order as best as possible. I've always lived well below my means and while I have no plan to stop working, I know I now have that option if need be. No one should feel that they HAVE to do something and its extremely liberating to have options.
So what? Half of the people in the US couldn't discern how dangerous Trump was because they didn't have to research skills to figure out who they were voting for. We should pay any heed to people who don't know about science because they have non medical jobs. They are mostly ignorant. What's crazy is that nurses refuse. I've seen some bizarre posts here that indicate a lack of intellectual curiosity or the skills needed to read the literature. And that they live so close th LA county.
So what? Half of the people in the US couldn't discern how dangerous Trump was because they didn't have to research skills to figure out who they were voting for. We should pay any heed to people who don't know about science because they have non medical jobs. They are mostly ignorant. What's crazy is that nurses refuse. I've seen some bizarre posts here that indicate a lack of intellectual curiosity or the skills needed to read the literature. And that they live so close th LA county.
I support and make no judgement regarding anyone’s individual rights to make their own personal medical decisions ESPECIALLY regarding taking new forms of medical treatment that are not FDA approved, have not been tested on animals, have no long term studies. From a scientific and research perspective it’s definitely worth considering these points, and it doesn’t take a genius or someone with a healthcare background to find this worth taking into serious consideration.
Thank god for those who are willing to take one of the new vaccines as they will be the ones to help us move forward with further studies and data regarding this new medical treatment. However, I do not expect anyone to do so.
Seriously please stop letting your emotions cloud your ethics it’s extremely concerning.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
23 minutes ago, ohbejoyful said:
I support and make no judgement regarding anyone’s individual rights to make their own personal medical decisions ESPECIALLY regarding taking new forms of medical treatment that are not FDA approved, have not been tested on animals, have no long term studies. From a scientific and research perspective it’s definitely worth considering these points, and it doesn’t take a genius or someone with a healthcare background to find this worth taking into serious consideration.
Thank god for those who are willing to take one of the new vaccines as they will be the ones to help us move forward with further studies and data regarding this new medical treatment. However, I do not expect anyone to do so.
Seriously please stop letting your emotions cloud your ethics it’s extremely concerning.
In what way is the participant allowing emotions to cloud ethics? What prompted or precipitated that remark? Are ethics clouded when people share incorrect nonsense as evidence of their fears or when they share frustration about health professionals refusing vaccines because of unfounded fears?
Let me correct myself now, it’s not that there was no animal testing that took place during the covid vaccination process, but that many steps regarding animal testing were left out, including the exposure to the illness and subsequent reexposures after the vaccination and documentation in research study thereafter. If anyone has the detailed full report of animal testing for any of the new vaccinations please send it my way as I have not been able to find. Also articles like this are what concern me so feel free to enlighten me further as some of you are definitely more understanding if the intricate details than myself
In what way is the participant allowing emotions to cloud ethics? What prompted or precipitated that remark? Are ethics clouded when people share incorrect nonsense as evidence of their fears or when they share frustration about health professionals refusing vaccines because of unfounded fears?
Especially as a medical professional it is absolutely unethical to overly be unsupportive and make judgements regarding anyone’s individual rights to make their own personal medical decisions in regards to experimental medicine.
Please remember that medical treatments with insufficient trials time and data that are created for emergency purposes without fda approval are also considered experimental. That is why you have to give consent, and sign a paper that informs you it is emergency treatment, not fda approved.
If you and this poster and any other posters really think that it’s based on unfounded and unscientific fears alone, that’s fine, I guess a fast tracked trial that skipped a bunch of steps is good enough for you and you are confident enough to basically believe there is *no possible way* this could have any damage to someone. But history, medicine and the human body are all extremely complex and we are always learning something new. Even after studies with significant more time and data. So have a little humility that you don’t know everything and actually have no way of guaranteeing safety for everyone, please get off your high horse. People are uncomfortable for many SCIENTIFIC based reasons. They all have a counter argument which I am fully aware, but ultimately the most scientific and accurate reality to most concerns is “we really don’t know yet”
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
15 minutes ago, ohbejoyful said:
Especially as a medical professional it is absolutely unethical not to support and make judgements regarding anyone’s individual rights to make their own personal medical decisions.
Please remember that medical treatments with insufficient trials time and data that are created for emergency purposes are also considered experimental. That is why you have to give consent, and sign a paper that informs you it is emergency treatment, not fda approved.
If you and this poster and any other posters really think that it’s based on unfounded and unscientific fears alone, that’s fine, I guess a fast tracked trial that skipped a bunch of steps is good enough for you and you are confident enough to basically believe there is *no possible way* this could have any damage to someone. But history, medicine and the human body are all extremely complex and we are always learning something new. So have a little humility that you don’t know everything and actually have no way of guaranteeing safety for everyone, please get off your high horse. People are uncomfortable for many SCIENTIFIC based reasons. They all have a counter argument which I am fully aware, but ultimately the most scientific and accurate reality to most concerns is “we really don’t know yet”
The duty of a health professional is to correct wrong thinking and provide the facts and evidence to encourage good compliance with public health mandates during a pandemic. It is not at all unethical to question other health professionals who make claims about vaccine based upon flawed information or even nonsense. This is a discussion forum, we are supposed to discuss what is shared here.
When I, or other posters believe that unsupported fears are used as the basis for declining vaccination we say so...it's pretty direct and straight forward. There is no other agenda.
No one claimed that there is *no possible way* that injury couldn't occur secondary to vaccination. Is that what you believe is argued?
What does my humility have to do with this? Give me an example, specifically, of my pride or lack of humility being the issue in this thread rather than nurses avoiding vaccination because of fear.
Yes. I'm questioning why a segment of health professionals prefer to linger in the fearful place of "we really don't know yet".
I support and make no judgement regarding anyone’s individual rights to make their own personal medical decisions ESPECIALLY regarding taking new forms of medical treatment that are not FDA approved, have not been tested on animals, have no long term studies. From a scientific and research perspective it’s definitely worth considering these points, and it doesn’t take a genius or someone with a healthcare background to find this worth taking into serious consideration.
Thank god for those who are willing to take one of the new vaccines as they will be the ones to help us move forward with further studies and data regarding this new medical treatment. However, I do not expect anyone to do so.
Seriously please stop letting your emotions cloud your ethics it’s extremely concerning.
What emotions and ethical considerations are you talking about? Please enumerate because I don't understand what you are saying. I merely ask nurses to dispassionately review what we know about the vaccines (with an open mind) and then decide whether having or spreading Covid is acceptable for the risks of taking a vaccine which, so far, has proven to be very safe. I have seen a post on this thread about someone refusing it because it will "mess up" their DNA. Houston Methodist Hospital is offering their workers a second $500 bonus as a gratitude but this second one is contigent upon getting the vaccine. We will await to see what the staff decides. As someone who grew up at a more naive time when people believed what their doctors recommended, I was the beneficiary of multiple vaccines and probably most grateful for not having polio. I take a flu shot because a doctor I worked with talked me out of it one year and I got it twice - getting pneumonia the second time. I was young and a runner then.
The duty of a health professional is top correct wrong thinking and provide the facts and evidence to encourage good compliance with public health mandates during a pandemic. It is not at all unethical to question other health professionals who make claims about vaccine based upon flawed information or even nonsense. This is a discussion forum, we are supposed to discuss what is shared here.
When I, or other posters believe that unsupported fears are used as the basis for declining vaccination we say so...it's pretty direct and straight forward. There is no other agenda.
No one claimed that there is *no possible way* that injury couldn't occur secondary to vaccination. Is that what you believe is argued?
What does my humility have to do with this? Give me an example, specifically, of my pride or lack of humility being the issue in this thread rather than nurses avoiding vaccination because of fear.
Yes. I'm questioning why a segment of health professionals prefer to linger in the fearful place of "we really don't know yet".
If we don’t have enough evidence to draw a conclusion, ie are there long term effects of these vaccines? than we shouldn’t make statements as if we are confident we know the outcome. We really don’t know yet is the most honest and ethical stance.
The high horse statement come from being overly confident in statements that portray that you are comfortable taking one of the new vaccinations, and that others who don’t also feel comfortable must just be unintelligent, don’t research, don’t trust the science etc. when the reality all that most people want in order to be more confident is more data, which is purely a science based thought process. If you humbled yourself you might realize that at least some people are still intelligent, research and science based professionals who are still skeptical, and that’s because we don’t have enough data yet.
Subee2, BSN, MSN, CRNA
308 Posts
Haha. I agree totally with your points above and get you wanting PS5. I have had a few autistic kids in court and I can see that it is a great source of pleasure in their life and they are GOOD at it! Everyone is forgiven for some trash diversions in our lives. Some of us need it a little more:) However, as I watch Trumpers scaling and breaking into the WH I prefer bubbly.