Actually, I lost all respect for two colleagues today. One is a brand new grad, about 21 or 22 and gorgeous in one of those fresh, "girl next door" ways. She gets her scrubs tailored so they fit her just so, her hair is long, shiny and falls in loose lustrous waves. She could be a model, so we'll call her Heidi. The other is a married neurosurgery fellow, whose wife is pregnant with his first child. We'll call him Dr. Dick, or just Dick.
Heidi didn't do anything to seriously endanger a patient: she didn't slam in Lasix, for example, or trickle in Adenosine. She didn't miss a run of VT (although, to be fair, the Clin Tech noticed it first and pointed it out to Heidi). She didn't ignore post-op pain or bleeding, and she wasn't the one sitting at the computer at the nurse's station, headphones on and watching a hockey game while ignoring monitor alarms and call bells. Nevertheless, I've completely lost respect for her.
It was a slow night for a Friday night -- half of our surgeons were out of town for a conference and of the remaining four, one just lost his mother and isn't back from the funeral in Asia. There's a new sushi restaurant near the hospital, and they deliver if you can put together a lucrative-enough order. The folks I work with are crazy about sushi and even the Respiratory Therapists and the X-ray techs were ordering $20 worth of sushi.
We were all sitting in the back -- well, not ALL of us. Half of us were sitting in the back, having drawn the long straw and were enjoying our sushi while the other half watched all of the patients. Heidi was sitting next to Dick, something that really didn't register with me at the time, and Dick was regaling us all with a tale about how his wife's incredible morning sickness caused her to toss her cookies in the waste basket of a patient's hospital room while the patient described in great detail the "unusual" nature of his poop. (Only nurses -- and surgeons, RTs and X-ray techs can sit around enjoying a good meal while describing poop and someone's vomiting episodes.)
And then I went back to relieve Steve, my substation partner so he could eat his sushi. While Steve was gone, his patient's attending surgeon stopped by and asked a question I couldn't answer, so I popped into the break room to ask him about it. Both Heidi and Dick were still there, only this time they were sharing a single chair. The sexual tension was palpable, and Steve looked thrilled to be interrupted. He shot out of the room as though he'd been fired from a cannon.
Heidi, it seems, has been sleeping with Dick since her arrival on our unit in July. She knows all about the pregnant wife . . .
Heidi may be a good clinician one day, she may be a compassionate and caring nurse. She may be a hard worker. But I will never again respect a woman who could sleep with a married man, a man whose wife is pregnant with their child and who is a sometimes-colleague on a consulting service. And the fact that they made no attempt to be discreet makes them even more contemptible. I've lived through the drama on a unit when an affair goes bad, witnessed a famously and flagrantly unfaithful surgeon's wife storm into the ICU demanding "which one of you ugly ******* is ******* my husband?" and making a good attempt to castrate the man in question. I've seen the aftermath of the DON being found going at it with the Medical Director of Emergency Medicine and I've lived through more nurses breaking up with doctors on our service than I can even remember. I've been the cheated-upon, and it was more painful than even I can describe. Why would you put someone else through that deliberately?
Keep it out of work, people. And if you cannot do that, at least be discreet.
Specializes in Psychiatric, Med-Surg, Operating Room.
So many questions. Have you lost all respect for this neurosurgeon or is he held to a different standard? What does her looks have to do with anything, or the fact that she gets her scrubs tailored? Do you personally know Mrs. Dick? Do you know what type of marriage they have? As many previous posters have mentioned they may have an open marriage, and perhaps the wife is okay with his philandering ways as long as she is provided for. If Heidi's doing her job and in such a way that patient outcomes are not adversely affected, then who cares whose lap she's sitting on or if she's sharing a one-seater with another (married) worker. As a co-worker, I can imagine that it is probably uncomfortable for you (and maybe some of your fellow co-workers too) but these two are consenting adults.
I'm surprised at so much hate directed at Heidi. Yes she should know better than to sleep with a married coworker but she's not the married one! Dick is the one breaking his vows and ruining his marriage, not Heidi. And why does his marriage seem to mean so much more because his wife is pregnant? Is she wasn't pregnant or if the didn't have kids would that make their marriage less?
I personally would ignore it and stick to my work. Other than seeing them sit on a chair together, it doesn't seem to have anything to do with either of their work experience.
Oh and bringing in her looks, makes it look like you're painting her as the seductress in the situation, or that you're jealous. A simple "she was young and beautiful" would have sufficed. Not that her looks play any part in the situation.
I don't think anyone said anything of the sort. People mentioned the possibility of a poly relationship. No one said everybody should engage in poly relationships. Nobody said it's a-ok to get it on at work.
I do take issue, however, with directing disproportionate hate to the person that a) isn't married and b) is in a lower power position due to age, experience, and hierarchy. All because she's the woman and because op considers her to be vain, I guess. She has bad judgement and is most likely a selfish person, but for all op knows Dick could be pressuring her into this too.
Like the story about the three women finding about each other and attacking each other- why on earth didn't they gang up on HIM?? He was the obvious real scumbag in the situation.
I have to admit I've wondered about that for years. When I was unfortunate enough to experience being cheated on in a relationship, I went directly to her with my concerns. Even though the 'other guy' threatened to do me any sort of physical harm.
Personally I still think the state of female empowerment is lacking. I may have used a poor term there unintentionally. I've only seen women literally attack each other in these kinds of scenarios I've witnessed. Which, in my limited opinion, fuels the problem. And offers literally no chance for the aggressor to learn anything at all.
Like Mr. Intern. Last I'd heard he's still carrying on at work as if he's a vip in a swingers club. Haven't talked to him in years, but have friends that still work in close contact with him. It's really thought provoking and not at all positive to see those nurses I mentioned summarily dismissed with poor reviews. While the male just keeps on (pardon the phrase) ho'ing around. I really do think he would have rethought his approach to things being confronted (outside of work) by three angry women. Apparently, this was not to be...
My comment was meant to indicate that they're both equally guilty. Many posters seemed to be saying that since he's the one with the commitment he should be the focus of the disapproval, and excusing her because she's young, single, and possibly naive. My point was that they're both adulterers equally, and should face equal disapproval.
While the focus of this thread is on the inappropriateness of an extramarital affair period, the REAL focus should be on keeping ALL romantic 'adventures' out of the workplace.
I don't need to see two single coworkers humping all over each other in the break room any more than I want to see those who are married doing so. And I don't care if they're married to EACH OTHER, the workplace is not the place for lap cuddles, etc.
Some people, it seems, are happy to behave unprofessionally. Me, OTOH, if I were to WORK WITH my spouse, would not be seen behaving in this manner.
Remember the idea that what goes on behind bedroom doors should stay there?
My comment was meant to indicate that they're both equally guilty. Many posters seemed to be saying that since he's the one with the commitment he should be the focus of the disapproval, and excusing her because she's young, single, and possibly naive. My point was that they're both adulterers equally, and should face equal disapproval.
I genuinely feel that the transgressions have vastly different values. One party, the husband, has made a direct promise to another person, his wife. When you make a promise you assume a personal obligation and in my eyes you are accountable. He's made a promise to a person I assume he loves or at least loved at one point. If he then engages in an extramarital affair, he has done something that he's previously promised that he wouldn't. In my opinion he's culpable.
(This is all supposing that this couple have agreed on mutual faithfulness, and that agreement has now been broken by the husband).
Heidi on the other hand doesn't have this personal obligation to Mrs. Dick, she's made no promises regarding her behavior.
Anyone can certainly have an opinion about Heidi's behavior, and if they find it acceptable or not. But I don't agree that she deserves an equal amount of blame. Dr. Dick has reneged on his promise. Heidi hasn't, she never made one in the first place.
I believe that any discord between our opinions, stems from the fact that my interpretation of this is heavily influenced by the fact that I believe that it's the lies and deception which constitute a betrayal and a violation of trust, but I'm more neutral on the sexual encounter itself.
Even if I don't agree, I understand your point of view though. If you regard the act itself (with a person not your husband or wife) a sin, then it makes sense to assign equal guilt.
I'm just curious how people find that much time to screw around. I knew an ortho doc who did it. But I couldn't figure out how these nurses could. I mean if you're f****** in a hall closet, you're probably not doing your job. Hell I barely ever call my husband when I'm at work and I actually like him.
There is a basic lack of character displayed by both participants. If these people have no problem lying, sneaking, and cheating when it comes to their their personal lives, what else will they lie about?
I wouldn't trust either of them as far as I could see them.
"Fouling one's nest". I love that term. How often do you get to use it?
When the affair happens in the workplace, everybody's nest gets fouled. Not just the two main participants. With that in mind, keep it away from your workplace.
I'm just curious how people find that much time to screw around. I knew an ortho doc who did it. But I couldn't figure out how these nurses could. I mean if you're f****** in a hall closet, you're probably not doing your job. Hell I barely ever call my husband when I'm at work and I actually like him.
You just reminded me of a book I attempted to read a few years ago. It was a 'medical thriller' so I thought I'd like it. Just a matter of pages into the thing, first chapter, and there's the charge nurse scutling off the floor with Dr. Big to chat in the coffee shop; naturally they have tons of time and are soon in an unused room somewhere having at it.
I didn't make any moral judgments, just thought "who on earth is watching the FLOOR while the CHARGE disappears?? Who is watching her patients? Why is no one looking for the doc? HOW the heck are they finding time to play in a 'spare' room when the ED is nearly always calling FOR a room"??
I have two thoughts about this. First of all, the opening post seemed a little too specific. If I worked with the OP, I might guess who she is. It's a small world. People's personalities come out here more than we know.
Secondly, we are all sinners. We've had affairs in our dept. One couple ended up marrying after leaving their spouses. What I've heard, they were both unhappily married. Now they have a baby and I think they make a great couple. We had one of our nurses involved with one of our Docs, who was married. It was an on and off again thing. Yes, I disapprove of that, but there's lots of things I disapprove of. It doesn't mean I lose total respect for someone.
At work, the people I lose respect for are the lazy ones, the liars, the people who provide poor patient care. It's like when Bill Clinton was getting raked over the coals for his sex life. I thought it was irrelevant personally, unless he was going to be blackmailed. I was more concerned at his job performance. I was really happy that he balanced the budget!
We don't know the ins and outs of these people's lives. It does sound like they are being idiots. But, in the case of these things, I ignore it and don't spread rumors in the workplace about this sort of stuff. That's my policy.
Heidi on the other hand doesn't have this personal obligation to Mrs. Dick, she's made no promises regarding her behavior.
She does have a personal obligation to Mrs. Dick, and Mrs. Anyone Else, not to help him break his vows. Your response is likely that he'll do it anyway with someone else. Which is true, but it would be nice if it were harder for adulterers to find willing partners. Why aren't we teaching our daughters to value themselves more highly? Because at the end of the day, while Heidi may feel powerful, she's just his trampoline ride this month.
Rags2Riches RN
77 Posts
So many questions. Have you lost all respect for this neurosurgeon or is he held to a different standard? What does her looks have to do with anything, or the fact that she gets her scrubs tailored? Do you personally know Mrs. Dick? Do you know what type of marriage they have? As many previous posters have mentioned they may have an open marriage, and perhaps the wife is okay with his philandering ways as long as she is provided for. If Heidi's doing her job and in such a way that patient outcomes are not adversely affected, then who cares whose lap she's sitting on or if she's sharing a one-seater with another (married) worker. As a co-worker, I can imagine that it is probably uncomfortable for you (and maybe some of your fellow co-workers too) but these two are consenting adults.