Sexual harrassment or just an old creep?

OldDude · Oct 26, 2018

I would probably not say anything to my manager at this time -- but I would probably tell a friend (or even try to arrange to have the friend present when I said something to the man so that there would be a witness.) I don't think it is fair for the OP to officially accuse him of anything or get him in trouble with the management unless she has clearly told him "No" and given him a chance to stop. I think he deserves 1 chance to hear her and change. And it doesn't sound like she has given him a clear message that he is crossing her boundaries.

I didn't think about a neutral party...I think this would be a viable alternative.

klone, MSN, RN · Oct 26, 2018

You need to be CLEAR and DIRECT.

"Your attention and behavior make me uncomfortable, and is disruptive to the workplace. Please do not seek me out for conversation anymore. I would like our relationship to remain professional only."

JKL33 · Oct 26, 2018

I too am on the fence. IRL I make decisions like this based upon what I can sense/discern about the person, so it's kind of impossible to say the exact approach other than that the one rule here is that there can't be any mixed messages.

It sounds like the answer is to attempt to maintain someone's human dignity without falling back on excuses. Both pretty much equally important at this juncture.

psu_213, BSN, RN · Oct 26, 2018

I tend to think you should not tell the manager when you first talk to the person. As I said, be direct, and tell him that you do not want him to talk to you like that. You can remind him of professional boundaries, etc. However, he is in a zero tolerance situation. If it happens even one more time, then go to your manager. Tell him/her the facts of the situation, what this guy said to you, and that it makes you extremely uncomfortable. Tell your manager that you talked to him, these inappropriate conversations persist, and you need them to stop. Hopefully the manager will have it from there. If your manger is even equivocal in the least, for example, "this is just Steve being friendly," then take it up the ladder.

Ruby Vee, BSN · Oct 26, 2018

He is enjoying your company and companionship and be may be looking for more and for sure more of the same. You are going to have to take him aside and tell him as not only will it solve your problem it is a kind thing to do.Here is what I would say, I value our work FRIENDSHIP but it can't interfere with my abilty to get my work done so going forward I need you to call and see if I am available for a break as opposed to coming to the department and I may or may not be depending upon the workload.You need to stress the word friendship as you are declaring that is all you want and you are also asking him to stop coming to the department looking for you.Notice, that you are not assuming or even asking if he as a sexual interest in you because that may not be the case.He must honor your request or he can't even be a work friend.

This looks like a good, honest, straightforward and KIND way to handle things.

macawake, MSN · Oct 26, 2018

I'm married in my 30s and am not interested dude.

mention you are married (my husband and I are having a date tonight etc), and hopefully he will get the message

"Oh thank you but even when MY LOVING LAWFULLY WEDDED HUSBAND says that I get a little uncomfy." and then go on with "Can't believe we've been married this long, how times flies when you're happy."(BIG SMILE) "

I was thinking on those lines- frequent mention of your husband.

Not only that, somebody noticed the frequent chats we had and casually mentioned it to my husband and he didn't like it......"

You simply say, I'm a happily married woman who loves her husband.

Also, my coworkers are starting to tease me about "our romance" and when I tell my husband about our chats, he seems to think they're excessive.

This must be a cultural thing :) I'm Scandinavian and right now I literally look like this ---> :wideyed: after reading all the posts offering similar advice.

I've been married, have had a couple of other serious relationships and right now I'm in a longterm relationship. I have never once thought to use a husband or a partner as an excuse or reason for attempting to stave off unwanted attention.

Why isn't it enough to say that you don't want the attention or that you aren't interested? Does one really need to use a partner as a "support structure" to give ones wishes more weight? What a person wants for themselves matters, all on its own. No added "legitimizer" required.

If married women should mention their husbands when they're faced with unwanted amorous or sexual attention, who should single people use as a "fortifier" when they try to ward off unwelcome attention? They of course have as much right to not be subjected to it as a married person has. I'm assuming we all agree that married status isn't the only legitimate protection against creeps and sexual harrassment?

In my opinion people need to learn to speak up for themselves and women in particular I think, sometimes struggle with making demands for themselves and laying down the rules.

Ok yall so I need some insight. I've been working at my current job for almost 2 years. There is an older guy that works here, a pharmacist, in his 60s that has often chatted with me and I literally never thought anything of it. He's a very interesting individual. Used to work for the DEA part of FBI and raided drug neighborhoods and things of that sort. He was always friendly and spoke and I was friendly and spoke.
So now all of a sudden, it's dawned on me like, goodness he's down here a lot lately. Well he's coming down to my unit (ER) 4, 5, 6 times in a 12 hr shift and comes over and wants to talk. He's said "Hi beautiful" to me twice and once came up behind me a whispered really close to my face in what I consider a creepy way. He'll come down before his shift is over to say bye and talks to me like I'm his wife. It's embarrassing! My coworkers are like "Boy he's really on to you" and laugh. They'll even tell me if they see him so I can go hide somewhere. He looks for me they say, if he can't find me. I'm getting really tired of it and quite honestly I want him to go AWAY. I'm married in my 30s and am not interested dude. I am even giving him a straight face and he still isn't getting it. He said "You don't seem like yourself today. You're not as happy." Not only is it just getting old, I have work to do. what do yall think? I am overreacting??

Again I'm not an American, but do pharmacists actually participate in raids? Here that's the job of law enforcement officers and the pharmacists gets to sift through whatever stuff in the form of pills, powders, iv meds etc. that was seized during the raid. They generally get to do that in a nice and calm environment, like a lab.

Anyway... That's not what you came here asking for advice about.

He's said "Hi beautiful" to me twice and once came up behind me a whispered really close to my face in what I consider a creepy way.

If a dude did that to me, I would definitely assume that his interest in me goes beyond that of a coworker. In my former career I used to be the lone female in a group of a couple of dozen men. They weren't in the habit of leaning in real close and whispering non-workrelated stuff. If they had, I would have thought them a bit strange and told them so. And we actually trained together, weightlifting, cardio and practising various self-defense techniques, for about ten hours every week. So we got physically very close when it was warranted but at other times they were aware of and respected my personal space.

I honestly have no idea whether the specific scenario that you've described is motivated from a place of "creepiness" or if he thinks that it's appealing and perhaps that you find it acceptable/are interested in him.

It's hard to offer advice when you don't have access to all the details and haven't had the opportunity to gauge this person for yourself. But for me personally, if something similar happened to me, I'd just tell him clearly and firmly that I don't want him to lean in so close, that I prefer to be called by my name and that three to four visits per shift is over the top (or whatever you happen to feel).

in your case, only you can decide if what you want from him is that he gives you bit more personal space and stops with the beautiful & whispering parts, but that you're still okay with talking to him every now and then OR if you want the visits to stop altogether.

If you know that it's safe for you to do, then whatever you feel is the desired outcome for you, is what I think needs to be clearly articulated to him.

In my experience it's possible to be firm and direct without being mean. It allows the other person to save face in case their interest is benign and they just enjoy your company, but it's generally also a good first step in case this needs to be escalated to HR or further, in the future.

Since I haven't met the man in question I can't know if he's 100% benign or if he has some predatory tendencies. Whatever you decide to do, please be mindful of your own safety!

Best wishes OP!

Edit:

I am even giving him a straight face and he still isn't getting it. He said "You don't seem like yourself today. You're not as happy."

Many people aren't great face readers. It's not generally an effective method of communication. When you imagine that you're clearly telegraphing a specific message, that might be completely missed or misinterpreted by another person. Words are better.

You said early in your post that he's a "very interesting individual". He might not be aware that you now feel that the attention is too much and not wanted.

FolksBtrippin, BSN, RN · Oct 26, 2018

This type of man needs a firm response in order to stop this kind of thing immediately.

Example

"I don't like the attention you are giving me. I do not want you coming to this unit just to see me and I don't want any interaction with you that does not directly relate to work duties." With a witness present since hell hath no fury like a man who has been rejected.

If it doesn't stop immediately then you escalate to HR.

I said this because you stated that you want him to go away.

If you want to stay friendly its more complicated but you don't have to be that abrupt.

klone, MSN, RN · Oct 26, 2018

Thank you, Macawake. I felt like I was in an alternate reality. If anyone in a professional setting whispers "Hello, beautiful" to me, they have lost their right to being treated with kid gloves and have their delicate fee-fees taken into consideration. Yuck.

**LibraSunCNM, BSN, MSN, CNM** · Oct 26, 2018

Why isn't it enough to say that you don't want the attention or that you aren't interested? Does one really need to use a partner as a "support structure" to give ones wishes more weight? What a person wants for themselves matters, all on its own. No added "legitimizer" required.
If married women should mention their husbands when they're faced with unwanted amorous or sexual attention, who should single people use as a "fortifier" when they try to ward off unwelcome attention? They of course have as much right to not be subjected to it as a married person has. I'm assuming we all agree that married status isn't the only legitimate protection against creeps and sexual harrassment?
In my opinion people need to learn to speak up for themselves and women in particular I think, sometimes struggle with making demands for themselves and laying down the rules.

It should be enough, but women are socialized to believe that they should not communicate assertively or directly. I think that is changing a bit in our culture but it's still certainly the norm to be passive. All of these comments about excuses or lighthearted jokes to make are pretty disheartening to me. A man who sneaks up behind a woman and says "Hi beautiful" is a creep, and he needs to be directly told to leave you alone.

macawake, MSN · Oct 26, 2018

Thank you, Macawake. I felt like I was in an alternate reality. If anyone in a professional setting whispers "Hello, beautiful" to me, they have lost their right to being treated with kid gloves and have their delicate fee-fees taken into consideration. Yuck.

I once worked with a surgeon who'd enter the OR with a loud smiling "good morning or good evening gorgeous". But he did that to everybody. It didn't matter which one of us he first laid eyes on :) Male, female, older, younger and in-between. That was just his personality, and we didn't mind. In fact his sunny disposition made the shifts quite pleasant.

But when a specific person is singled out for this treatment and that person also has their personal space invaded, then yes I definitely agree with you. It's deeply suspect.

It should be enough, but women are socialized to believe that they should not communicate assertively or directly. I think that is changing a bit in our culture but it's still certainly the norm to be passive. All of these comments about excuses or lighthearted jokes to make are pretty disheartening to me. A man who sneaks up behind a woman and says "Hi beautiful" is a creep, and he needs to be directly told to leave you alone.

It damn well is enough. (I'm not cussing at you LibraSunCNM ).

The reason I'm annoyed is that it upsets me that not each and every woman knows this and that not each and every person accepts it.

I'm 50% saddened and 50% angered that so many women still believe that their word doesn't have equal weight as the rest of the human species. In my opinion, parents need to do better when raising the next generation.

Oh and Klone, love your signature line :)

BeckyESRN · Oct 26, 2018

Thank you, Macawake. I felt like I was in an alternate reality. If anyone in a professional setting whispers "Hello, beautiful" to me, they have lost their right to being treated with kid gloves and have their delicate fee-fees taken into consideration. Yuck.

Thank goodness for these last few comments! OP does not need to moderate this dude's feelings, no friendly let down, no "my husband" crap. He crossed a line (several of them it seems) and now he needs to be told to knock it off.

doodlebuttRN · Oct 26, 2018

Any behavior that makes you feel uncomfortable at work can actually be classed as sexual harassment, believe it or not. Back when I was with my ex-wife, she would casually mention me at work (she is an RT. I'm a woman and we were a lesbian couple). One of her coworkers complained about her because they were anti-gay and didn't want to hear my ex-wife mention me, even when she was just innocently talking about how we were gardening or something equally innocuous. Her manager actually wrote her up for sexual harassment based on that. She never mentioned sex or anything improper. It was just the fact she was with a woman and it made her coworker uncomfortable. Sad but true.

That's awful. I'm sorry that happened to you.