Is there a feeling of entitlment among new grads? - page 3

I posted this is the New Grad forum, but want to post it here as well to get some thoughts and feeling of those with experience and different perspective. I am in the grad class of May 09. As a... Read More

  1. by   nminodob
    I am also one of the lucky new grads to have found a job. But I think it is only fair to point out that 1) new grad opportunities are scarce, and 2) there are droves of qualified candidates job-seeking. Put these two facts together and it is inevitable that some will not hook up with a position, despite doing everything right, having a good work ethic, and being all round worthy. Should we heap criticism on these unfortunate ones? I know several students I graduated with who are unable to get jobs, but are hard workers and bright nonetheless - some are too young to have an alternative career to resort to, and are baby-sitting!
  2. by   canoehead
    Quote from Wendy79

    I do get tired of hearing, also, about the employment cycles, how this is "just like" when happened in the 1990s and during other periods. I've never heard of any time as bad as this, to be honest. People who became nurses during the early 90s have told me about having to take a job on a unit they didn't want because that's where the jobs were.
    I felt lucky when I got a per diem job in 1990, and worked at it for 6 years with good evaluations, plus spent the rest of my time getting my degree. At the end of 6 years, I had the BSN, and I moved out of country for the only full time job I could find after 5 months of really determined job searching. I finally got to move back home this year. If anyone is looking for work there are about 20 job postings just at my hospital, and the northeast in general (Maine, NewBrunswick, Nova Scotia) are all looking for nurses.

    Shortage or not, you can't just come out of school in any profession and get a perfect job without a lot of luck, and some steady, patient campaigning aimed at your target of choice. My first per diem job was preceded by about 10 months of volunteering on that unit, and chatting with the nurses. Show the employer what makes you special, and they will have you in mind when a spot opens up.
  3. by   FireStarterRN
    Quote from BortaZinTx
    I never quite know how to reply to these "Those OTHER people do THIS negative thing, but *I*....GLORIOUS ME!, would never do that. Instead, I do all of THIS <list various Mother Theresa attributes>, and I AM LOVEEEEEEEEEED!" posts, so I usually find it best not to respond at all.

    Oops.



    :lol_hitti
  4. by   FireStarterRN
    So, lets imagine, there are 30 nursing students in the OP's class. They are competing for 2 new grad positions in their vicinity.

    If all the 30 nursing students adopted the OP's highly proactive and 'professional' approach to job seeking, would that materialize more jobs available?

    Just trying to figure this one out here, numbers wise...
  5. by   AlabamaBelle
    My daughter graduated in May, 2008 with a degree in graphic communications. She told us that many people in the December class were still without jobs. They started their job hunting well after their graduation. Diana started looking for jobs as soon as she hit her final semester. She went on several interviews and didn't get those jobs and one of those was her first choice (she had done an internship there, they loved her, but didn't have a position that she was suited for). She got a job offer from one of the companies down on her list - she didn't think she'd get that one - a prestigious firm in the industry and loves her job. She still knows of classmates who haven't gotten a job in the industry. They started their job hunts after graduation and found most of the available positions gone.

    As for a sense of entitlement, yes, many of the first career grads do display this attitude. We have one I thought was first career (she really looks young) and was a total surprise in her attitude toward work - she's fabulous. She was also asking what she could do better, how she could improve, etc. We had a great conversation one day and I found she really was second career and a tad older than others hired at the same time.

    Thankfully, one who was hired with me has gone on to another job. She didn't work after 5pm (I don't get that, but those are her words). Always the last one in and the first one out.
  6. by   hypocaffeinemia
    Quote from FireStarterRN
    So, lets imagine, there are 30 nursing students in the OP's class. They are competing for 2 new grad positions in their vicinity.

    If all the 30 nursing students adopted the OP's highly proactive and 'professional' approach to job seeking, would that materialize more jobs available?

    Just trying to figure this one out here, numbers wise...
    To put that into a local perspective, within 50 miles of me there are:


    • 70 grads from my class
    • 100 at a sister campus
    • 60 at a sister campus
    • 50 at yet another sister campus
    • 50 at...yes...another sister campus
    • 200+ from the entirety of Houston Community College
    • 200+ from UT-Houston, HBU, and TWU's BSN programs
    • 200+ from various other smaller local colleges to the region looking for Houston jobs.

    That totals to at least 930 new grads in the immediate area. Granted, we have the world's largest medical center and numerous hospitals, but the total number of acute care hospitals in this region (it's a huge region geographically and population-wise) is around 30.

    Even if you stretched the number to 50, counting places with 90 minute or more commutes one-way or LTACHs, that would still require each facility to take on at least 19 new grads to secure all grads a position.

    Now consider that many (most?) of the facilities aren't hiring new grads at all. The math speaks for itself.
  7. by   Jules A
    Quote from MesaRN
    I was always taught to not rely on jobs to just come to you, regardless of the "promises" made to you. be waiting at the door expecting to get in.

    Just like many have gone to more frugal ways to save money and spend less on extravagant things, I hope that this current downturn in the nursing market will help to redefine what it means to enter the nursing profession. We are professionals and if we want to gain and maintain respect as such we need to encourage leadership, self drive, and set a high standard for entry into a demanding and rewarding career.
    Well said, especially the part about the "promises"! How many people thought the stock market was a guaranteed 10% return and that doing an interest-only or adjustable loan on a house you can't afford was acceptable? I've taken tons of flack when I've suggested that living off loans and not working while in school isn't a great solution for most people.

    I'm not sure about entitled but I do think it has been shocking to many and while its nice to get some support here the venting threads that are downright defensive when someone offers suggestions rather than just cyber hugs are puzzling to me. Maybe its because I'm so stinking old but I always hope for the best but prepare for the worst and it has served me. I can only hope that the new nursing students are taking note and planning accordingly.
  8. by   AmaurosisFugax
    Quote from FireStarterRN
    So, lets imagine, there are 30 nursing students in the OP's class. They are competing for 2 new grad positions in their vicinity.

    If all the 30 nursing students adopted the OP's highly proactive and 'professional' approach to job seeking, would that materialize more jobs available?

    Just trying to figure this one out here, numbers wise...
    Ah, but realistically all 30 never adopt a highly productive approach. That's why some people get all A's, win awards, get promoted while others coast or don't survive.
    The OP did a great job sharing her formula for success. She may come across as self-aggrandising, but that can be said of any successful person advising others & using their life experience as example. Fact is, in any field some people think they deserve something just by being there, & in nursing it may have been even more due to hype. The OP understood the difference between being there & being ahead.
  9. by   Jules A
    Quote from hypocaffeinemia
    To put that into a local perspective, within 50 miles of me there are:


    • 70 grads from my class
    • 100 at a sister campus
    • 60 at a sister campus
    • 50 at yet another sister campus
    • 50 at...yes...another sister campus
    • 200+ from the entirety of Houston Community College
    • 200+ from UT-Houston, HBU, and TWU's BSN programs
    • 200+ from various other smaller local colleges to the region looking for Houston jobs.
    That totals to at least 930 new grads in the immediate area. Granted, we have the world's largest medical center and numerous hospitals, but the total number of acute care hospitals in this region (it's a huge region geographically and population-wise) is around 30.

    Even if you stretched the number to 50, counting places with 90 minute or more commutes one-way or LTACHs, that would still require each facility to take on at least 19 new grads to secure all grads a position.

    Now consider that many (most?) of the facilities aren't hiring new grads at all. The math speaks for itself.
    The math does speak for itself and what I'm hearing it say is that even if the economy was smoking red hot and all the baby boomers on the face of the earth required full time care there still wouldn't be an abundance of jobs in that area, right?
  10. by   mcs1505
    While I agree that new grads need to realize that they are indeed at the bottom of the totem pole, there is a difference between entitlement and pursuing your dream job.
    When I entered my program I knew I wanted a position in a Pediatric ER in Ohio. After I take the NCLEX I'll be starting my job at Cincy Children's ER and I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I found a hospital that had a program specifically for new grads in the ER and I worked hard to get it. I really never thought I would get it, but for some reason I did.
    When established nurses ask me if I have a job lined up and where it is, they act like I've committed some sort of crime for already having a job, let alone having one in a double-specialty. Many have let me know, in no uncertain terms, that they think I will fail. Gee, thanks.
    I don't feel entitled to the job, I feel blessed. I didn't complain about my salary; it might not be the highest I've seen, but I am absolutely thrilled to have it. I'll be on a flex schedule (which basically means I'm their b**** until I get off orientation) and I'm perfectly fine with that, as I see it not only as working my way up, but as providing me with the opportunity to try all the different shifts to find what works best for me.

    What I'm trying to say is that there is nothing wrong with wanting something extreme and trying to get it. There's also nothing wrong with being dissappointed if you don't get it.
    Desire =/= entitlement.

    Also, to anyone who is really desperate: try the military or try looking out of state. Nearly everyone in my program (60 people) has a job, and we still don't graduate until June 19th. It is possible, you just might have to be a little flexible.
  11. by   3boysmom3
    I don't know, but to this day, I always hear the phrase "well at least you'll always be able to find a job" spoken in relation to nurses, whether the topic is the recession or whatever. It seems like it used to be true.

    We talk of a "nursing shortage" but I can remember a real nursing shortage. I can remember when, if you walked into a place asking for an application, you'd get escorted directly to the DON who would ask when can you start, and what floor do you want to work on. When I was in nursing school, the hospital we did our clinicals at would actively recruit all the students and try to get as many of them as they could.

    In fact, the hospital I work at now actively recruits local graduates. They probably wouldn't have openings for all of them if all the grads intended to work there, but they do take a good number.

    Maybe locality has something to do with it. Ours is a medium-sized city with only one nursing school which graduates about 35-30 grads per year. There are three hospitals, 8 or 9 nursing homes, two LTAC's, and so forth.

    At any rate, the OP is absolutely right. In today's market, anyone looking for work in any field needs to promote themselves by showing interest, taking initiative, and taking opportunities for networking.

    Even if you get a job easily, you have to remember that in the case of layoffs, employers will go out of their way not to lay off their most valuable employees, so make yourself valuable.
  12. by   hypocaffeinemia
    Quote from Jules A
    The math does speak for itself and what I'm hearing it say is that even if the economy was smoking red hot and all the baby boomers on the face of the earth required full time care there still wouldn't be an abundance of jobs in that area, right?
    The math discounts those who don't pass or those who elect to wait to look for work later, but in the past there was largely no issue. Some of the big medical center facilities like Memorial Hermann et al probably took many dozens of new grads each in the past. I know the outlying community hospitals in these parts were taking 10-20 new grads each in years past for 100-300 bed facilities, so surely the monster facilities downtown took more.

    That was back when instead of complaining about the lack of jobs, people complained about not finding the ideal job.
  13. by   Midwest4me
    I became a nurse way back in 1985 and even then had to hit the streets to find a job....yet come to think of it, even then it did seem easier than what it seems to be today. My sis finally starts her official nursing coursework this Fall; I certainly hope the job market is better for her next year.
    Last edit by Midwest4me on May 10, '09 : Reason: misspelling

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