Does anyone else find this offensive?

Nurses General Nursing

Published

"Fast paced multiple physician practice seeking fulltime Medical Assistant/LPN"

MEDICAL ASSISTANT/LPN?? I emailed them regarding their job posting and they said "its the same thing and they get paid the same". What are your thoughts?

He emailed me back. He said "we are looking for both a medical assistant and a LPN but it's the same job. Just because an LPN went to nursing school doesn't mean they are a higher ranking. MA's are just as qualified. We will not be paying much more for each position. Nursing school costs more than MA school but you learn the same thing. You are not RN's or anything higher." Well, that was pretty rude.

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Someone help me to understand. If I am the charge nurse of a physicians office and I have a MA working under me, how am I responsible for them if they are not licensed or have a certification? They dont really follow the nursing model, from what I understand they are more like doctors assistants. So if something happens and they go up the chain of command, how could I be responsible when we have two totally different ways of being trained? Its like blaming the nurse for what the radiology tech does, its two different things...or am I crazy?

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Specializes in LTC, Acute Care.
He emailed me back. He said "we are looking for both a medical assistant and a LPN but it's the same job. Just because an LPN went to nursing school doesn't mean they are a higher ranking. MA's are just as qualified. We will not be paying much more for each position. Nursing school costs more than MA school but you learn the same thing. You are not RN's or anything higher." Well, that was pretty rude.

I'm not sure what was rude about his response. For the purpose of the job, both LPNs and MAs are similarly qualified in this particular clinic's eyes. I believe it is not implied here that MAs and LPNs are the same across the board, because they are not (LPNs can be hired in many more places than MAs because of the LPN license).

Regardless, I assume this job is not an avenue you will probably be able to pursue any longer, if you continue to try to correct them in this area. They know what they are doing.

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Specializes in Nursing Education, CVICU, Float Pool.

Yeah....

I just got my CNA and I have seen many jobs posted on the internet for CNAs in LTC, and home health, but I wanted to see if any hospital or office jobs were open for CNAs.

Any way, when I went to the hospital website and searched jobs today (which it pulls up jobs at the hospital and all its owned an associated external offices) and I was skimming down the page I saw this exact quote below:

"Provides nursing care to clinic patients, under the supervision of RN, LPN, Mid-Level Provider, or Physician. Participates in nursing assessments, care planning, patient/family education and other discharge planning and instructions, as delegated and supervised by RN, LPN, Mid-Level Provider, or Physician. "

This is a smack in the face, they are not nurses not even nursing assistants and they are supposed to provide "Nursing Care"? So I called and asked if CNA's could apply for the job because it said provides nursing care (I thought they meant that CNAs could apply) and they said "no we would need someone certified as a medical assistant." I know that medical assistant’s scope of practice is much wider than CNAs, but to refer to them as providing nursing care, really? You either want a nurse or a medical assistant they are different.

The sad thing is that the hospital is the one who posted the job; I was hoping they would know the difference. I see them referring to nurses in the office setting as Office nurses now as opposed to just saying "we need a LPN". What's the world coming to? I hate to seem to be throwing a fit, but this is whole other profession that is being compared to nursing.

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Specializes in Psych, EMS.

I wouldn't be offended/ For most outpatient clinics, the duties required are well within the scope of practice for an LPN and MA. An LPN is not the same thing as a MA. The LPN is trained to do more than the MA. But this is irrelevant in the eyes of the employer, because what s/he needs both can do.

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Along these lines my doctor's office (probably soon to be ex-doctor's office for myriad reasons) has this annoying habit of referring to the Medical Assistants as nurses. "The nurse will leave a message for Dr. ____ for you. The nurse will call you back.", etc. Is that even legal??

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Specializes in LTC, Psych, Hospice.

I know several docs who hire MA's for their office and they are constantly referring to them as "nurses". I correct them everytime. Many docs want to hire MA's instead of LPN's or RN's because they can pay them much less. I also refuse to take telephone orders from a MA. I talked to a MA from a docs office that I wasn't familiar with. She stated, "this is *** , Dr. ***'s nurse and I have some orders for you". I jotted the orders and then asked if she was LPN or RN. She said again, "I'm ***, Dr. ***'s nurse". Then I asked her if she was a nurse or a MA. She finially told me she was a MA. I simply told her to have a nurse or the doc call me back.

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Specializes in geriatrics.

No that isn't legal. According to the College of Nurse's Standards, (Canada), you are not allowed to impersonate a nurse in any way. You are not legally permitted to use the terms "nurse" or "registered nurse" or "RN" unless you actually are one. I'm sure the same applies for the US.

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Specializes in Critical Care, Postpartum.
Yeah. They are just two very different things. They said they will pay $12 an hour. I'm not sure what salaries are for LPN's but it should be more than that. They worked hard to get where they are. They should be paid according to their skills.

I unfortunately did run into a thread that one poster shared that in their area, LPNs were making $10.75/hr. They were struggling to survive.

LPNs are NURSES and should be treated as such.

Disclaimer: I'm not an LPN or Medical Assistant, but I do know how to google to find a job description of both and agree with you their job scopes are different.

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Wow I have to say I find this thread very interesting. I am not in the medical field and have no desire to be. I must say from a patients perspective I find everyone being referred to as "nurse" when they are not is absolutely disturbing. No disrespect to a CNA,MA the various techs that are out there. THEY ALL HAVE IMPORTANT JOBS!!!! but I find it very misleading to patients. I read an article that stated thats one common thing that many patients are frustrated with as well not knowing exactly who they are talking to and why.

It's just interesting to see the same type of conversation taking place within the medical community.

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Someone help me to understand. If I am the charge nurse of a physicians office and I have a MA working under me, how am I responsible for them if they are not licensed or have a certification? They dont really follow the nursing model, from what I understand they are more like doctors assistants. So if something happens and they go up the chain of command, how could I be responsible when we have two totally different ways of being trained? Its like blaming the nurse for what the radiology tech does, its two different things...or am I crazy?

First of all its probably pretty rare for there to be a charge nurse in physicians office. Most places that use MAs don't use RNs at all. The MA practices under the physicians license under something called delegated medical practice. A physician in most states has broad power to delegate the practice of medicine as long as they are present to supervise.

In addition MAs generally have a skill set that is not taught in LPN or RN programs. For example MAs in an office are generally expected to do phlebotomy, 12 lead EKGs and limited scope X-ray (depending on the state). Things that in my experience are not taught in nursing programs. Again depending on the program they are taught billing and front office skills that are not taught in nursing programs. MA programs are designed with a specific skill set that is needed in outpatient ambulatory doctors offices.

As far as calling in orders, I would agree that most state would not allow this. I would actually go farther and question whether a nurse can receive a verbal order from another (non-APN) nurse. While its widely done, most states limit verbal orders to those given directly from a licensed provider to the nurse. Similarly while RN and LPN as well as registered and licensed practical (or vocational) are protected titles in all 50 states, nurse is not a protected title in all states.

David Carpenter, PA-C

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Specializes in Hospice / Psych / RNAC.

Actually when I talk about the MA's being hired I am referring to Oregon. I went to school there and stayed a couple years before coming home to Hawaii and it was at that time a LTC facility hired MA's to pass meds.

That was my first experience with them.

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