Comparing how news media headlines and reports on the same story

Daisy4RN · Feb 20, 2023

toomuchbaloney said:

My premise doesn't claim Trump is a white supremacist nor have I stated that. My premise is that Trump had dinner with a couple of antisemitic guests at his resort and he was reportedly impressed with the white supremacist neo-Nazi. Why would you blatantly mischaracterize what we all know not to be true?

No I don't assign the label neo-Nazi to people I disagree with politically. That also is evident in the history of these threads. I didn't call anyone an idiot. I've referenced Trump's history that associates him with racism and white supremacists. I didn't call Trump a nazi, I call him a liar.

I don't listen to left wing anything. Are you making crap up or are you calling history left wing?

You should explain how you think a Democrat, someone on the left of the political spectrum is more of a fascist than someone on the right side of the spectrum. Even Wikipedia could have informed you that fascism is far right extremism, although that definition has been presented to you before.

It's crazy that I have to counter made up and imagined claims about my posts. It's as if you assume that we're all blinded by the same animus and bias that caused you to write such an inaccurate rant.

You have called Trump a racist many times and previously stated he emboldens white supremacy by his statements. If your premise is that he "was impressed" with the white neo nazi I am not sure how that is a mischaracterization. No, it wasn't you this time calling names (but you did like the name calling) but don't act like you never have when we all know you have also. LOL I am not making up anything.
Wikipedia oh OK. You really think fascism only can apply to far right groups, nice try. (you just never stop!)

"fascism

făsh′ĭz″əm

noun

A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, a capitalist economy subject to stringent governmental controls, violent suppression of the opposition, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism.”

A political philosophy or movement based on or advocating such a system of government.

Oppressive, dictatorial control.

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, 5th Edition.

So, if Trump "was impressed" by a neo Nazi bc he had dinner with him (not knowing who he was) then I guess that means Biden "was impressed" by the racist he hung out with (Byrd). But let's not just assume that, let's take a look at Bidens history of racist policies that have hurt POC...here are a few...

https://www.foramerica.org/post/joe-biden-s-7-most-racist-moments

and here are a few of the times he has lied...

https://www.cnn.com/2022/01/20/politics/fact-check-biden-false-claims-first-year-2021/index.html

https://www.cnn.com/2023/02/17/politics/biden-economy-facts-first/index.html

https://thefederalist.com/2021/06/24/heres-the-full-list-of-every-lie-joe-biden-has-told-as-president-part-onehundredthirtynine-and-counting/

Daisy4RN · Feb 20, 2023

Roitrn said:

Back on topic. This is an example of egregious media bias and how people failed to see bias and still ar3 failing to see it. It would seem many people, at least in reference to this story, did not learn about media bias in "highschool" and there was no "sniff testing". As explained by Allsides.

https://www.allsides.com/blog/facts-vs-myths-did-pro-trump-mob-beat-cop-death

Hence a worthy discussion.

Yes among other lies the media ran with the "fact" that he was beaten to death by the mob with a fire extinguisher.

toomuchbaloney · Feb 20, 2023

Roitrn said:

Yes. I find it particularly offensive to use the death of so many people to mud- sling for your political agenda. Such a blatant disesrpect to the people who were victims of the holocaust. Now being used as pons. This does cause emotion and "feelings" and I take no shame in that.

But no one here used the death of those Jews to mud-sling for a political agenda. That's just your biased spin of the comments in this thread.

Your imagined disrespect for the holocaust victims isn't particularly convincing. It seems that you and Daisy4RN are both using those victims as pawns to try to make some partisan political point. Presumably all because Trump had dinner with antisemites and a neo-Nazi and the discussion about that fact is upsetting for you.

Roitrn said:

So Trump is only kinda like Hitler? Okay.....

Acknowledging current neo- nazi and supremist does not insult victims of the holocaust. Making false equivalents for political points is insulting.

I never have wanted to talk about his member. That's gross and completely irrelevant. The other member (pun intended) keeps bringing it up. Are you suggesting he raped someone? Please provide the evidence of that.

Right. A man who has sex with several women cannot ever be a family man. Got it. Or if you voted for him and are in the same party you can't be a family man either. What a perfect example of false equivalency and false logic.

Okay?

You can describe Trump however you prefer. Who made a false equivalent for political points? Because it's not false to note that Trump uses the same tactics and strategies that were used by historical and modern fascists and authoritarians. I would recommend that you read the book How Fascism Works. Maybe then you can discuss the similarities.

Are you being disingenuous about the many credible claims of sexual misconduct and assault levied against Trump or are you just going to give him the benefit of the doubt after we all heard him brag on audio tape about kissing and touching women without consent? Use your own judgement.

I'm beginning to think that you don't understand what "false equivalency" means. The party of family values elevated and defends a man who cheated on each of his 3 wives, sometimes with prostitutes or Media stars. That single glaring contradiction, at minimum, implies that "family values" is nothing more than a meaningless bit of marketing language for the GOP. Your extrapolation to individual GOP voters is yours... and has nothing to do with me or my thinking. That's an example of a logical leap, since you brought it up. Maybe it's a reflection of your bias as you interpret my words in these threads.

heron, ASN, RN · Feb 20, 2023

toomuchbaloney said:

Really, really old news and media bias that was discussed at the time. You want to review this history?

I'm an old faht and not particularly interested in re-inventing the wheel. Let us stipulate that bias is built-in across the board. It's part of being human, hardwired in our genes. It's only prudent to figure out how to make that be a survival-enhancing trait. We have some choice in that. Right now, as a species, we're behaving like baboons. Prognosis is grim, imv, but not totally without hope.

toomuchbaloney · Feb 21, 2023

Roitrn said:

Once again it's not about the topic of the story, It is how the media presented it.

Evaluating past examples of media bias can help us to decipher media bias to form our own opinion. To have a balanced perspective.

This one has clear blatant bias tactics we can use to identify in more current media.

I also chose it to identify bias media that was learned in "high school". As it clearly shows and example if many people believing the story. So maybe they skipped that day in "high school"

You most certainly do not have to discuss if you do not feel like it.

Or is there a reason this story doesn't rank worth discussing? Bias maybe?

As I said... we reviewed and discussed this example of bias when it happened. Do you need a review because I don't and the other members here who participated likely don't either. You could choose an example of media bias that wasn't already discussed at length when it happened, 2 years ago. It seems that you haven't understood my reasoning for not rehashing old discussions. Do you think we should simply discuss them AGAIN because now you want to add your opinion? Just tell us your opinion about the bias... don't keep us guessing.

toomuchbaloney · Feb 21, 2023

Daisy4RN said:

You have called Trump a racist many times and previously stated he emboldens white supremacy by his statements. If your premise is that he "was impressed" with the white neo nazi I am not sure how that is a mischaracterization. No, it wasn't you this time calling names (but you did like the name calling) but don't act like you never have when we all know you have also. LOL I am not making up anything.
Wikipedia oh OK. You really think fascism only can apply to far right groups, nice try. (you just never stop!)

"fascism

făsh′ĭz″əm

noun

A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, a capitalist economy subject to stringent governmental controls, violent suppression of the opposition, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism.”

A political philosophy or movement based on or advocating such a system of government.

Oppressive, dictatorial control.

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, 5th Edition.

So, if Trump "was impressed" by a neo Nazi bc he had dinner with him (not knowing who he was) then I guess that means Biden "was impressed" by the racist he hung out with (Byrd). But let's not just assume that, let's take a look at Bidens history of racist policies that have hurt POC...here are a few...

https://www.foramerica.org/post/joe-biden-s-7-most-racist-moments

and here are a few of the times he has lied...

https://www.cnn.com/2022/01/20/politics/fact-check-biden-false-claims-first-year-2021/index.html

https://www.cnn.com/2023/02/17/politics/biden-economy-facts-first/index.html

https://thefederalist.com/2021/06/24/heres-the-full-list-of-every-lie-joe-biden-has-told-as-president-part-onehundredthirtynine-and-counting/

Sure, sure fascism can be left or right. Can you give me an example of a left wing fascist for reference, please? I mean, leftists can be cruel and corrupt... don't get me wrong... but outside of the liberal rebound reaction to Nazi activity in Europe, left wing fascism is more of a philisophical exercise than an organized movement.

Yes, I have called Trump a racist... but that's not the same as calling him a nazi, is it? I've called him lots of things that could be considered accurate descriptors by some and slanderous by others. I wonder which side of that spectrum you fall on.

It's not my premise that Trump was impressed with Fuentes, that's what the reporting indicated. Do I need to explain the difference between those two things for you?

"So if Trump..."

Look at you trying to defend Trump's dinner with the white supremacist and neo-Nazi by calling Biden a racist... that's just funny. It's that old tactic of pointing to someone else's perceived transgressions in an attempt to diminish the transgressions of another in the now. It's a bonus when you use a right wing website in that attempt... in a thread about biased media. I guess you're surprised that a white man's views on social topics have evolved over 30 years. Some must be. The examples in that short compilation certainly are making it into the talking points of conservatives in comment sections everywhere.

It's always stunning when a republican voter wants to hold up a liberal politician's lies in the era of Trump. Just consider the lies and liars that Trump has inspired since his presidency. Why would any lie told by Biden be a problem for people who have no problem with Trump's extraordinary lies? Could it be bias?

In a side note...What makes a statement a lie?

nursej22, MSN, RN · Feb 21, 2023

So is this fascist ? Or merely authoritarian?

Roitrn · Feb 21, 2023

toomuchbaloney said:

But no one here used the death of those Jews to mud-sling for a political agenda. That's just your biased spin of the comments in this thread.

Your imagined disrespect for the holocaust victims isn't particularly convincing. It seems that you and Daisy4RN are both using those victims as pawns to try to make some partisan political point. Presumably all because Trump had dinner with antisemites and a neo-Nazi and the discussion about that fact is upsetting for you.

Okay?

You can describe Trump however you prefer. Who made a false equivalent for political points? Because it's not false to note that Trump uses the same tactics and strategies that were used by historical and modern fascists and authoritarians. I would recommend that you read the book How Fascism Works. Maybe then you can discuss the similarities.

Are you being disingenuous about the many credible claims of sexual misconduct and assault levied against Trump or are you just going to give him the benefit of the doubt after we all heard him brag on audio tape about kissing and touching women without consent? Use your own judgement.

I'm beginning to think that you don't understand what "false equivalency" means. The party of family values elevated and defends a man who cheated on each of his 3 wives, sometimes with prostitutes or Media stars. That single glaring contradiction, at minimum, implies that "family values" is nothing more than a meaningless bit of marketing language for the GOP. Your extrapolation to individual GOP voters is yours... and has nothing to do with me or my thinking. That's an example of a logical leap, since you brought it up. Maybe it's a reflection of your bias as you interpret my words in these threads.

I generally do not consider people guilty of a crime until it is proven in court. There's allegations about Biden forcefully digitally penetrating a women. Let's not for get Clinton.

I'm the bias one? Coming from someone who suggest because Trump had alleged affairs that the GOP can't be about family values. Right.

Roitrn · Feb 21, 2023

toomuchbaloney said:

As I said... we reviewed and discussed this example of bias when it happened. Do you need a review because I don't and the other members here who participated likely don't either. You could choose an example of media bias that wasn't already discussed at length when it happened, 2 years ago. It seems that you haven't understood my reasoning for not rehashing old discussions. Do you think we should simply discuss them AGAIN because now you want to add your opinion? Just tell us your opinion about the bias... don't keep us guessing.

In case you forgot. I'm new here so I have not had these discussions. Am I supposed to know things I wasn't a part of?

Again. It's not about the actual people involved in the story, its about how the media handled. It.

If you wish not to participate them don't.

Roitrn · Feb 21, 2023

toomuchbaloney said:

Sure, sure fascism can be left or right. Can you give me an example of a left wing fascist for reference, please? I mean, leftists can be cruel and corrupt... don't get me wrong... but outside of the liberal rebound reaction to Nazi activity in Europe, left wing fascism is more of a philisophical exercise than an organized movement.

Yes, I have called Trump a racist... but that's not the same as calling him a nazi, is it? I've called him lots of things that could be considered accurate descriptors by some and slanderous by others. I wonder which side of that spectrum you fall on.

It's not my premise that Trump was impressed with Fuentes, that's what the reporting indicated. Do I need to explain the difference between those two things for you?

"So if Trump..."

Look at you trying to defend Trump's dinner with the white supremacist and neo-Nazi by calling Biden a racist... that's just funny. It's that old tactic of pointing to someone else's perceived transgressions in an attempt to diminish the transgressions of another in the now. It's a bonus when you use a right wing website in that attempt... in a thread about biased media. I guess you're surprised that a white man's views on social topics have evolved over 30 years. Some must be. The examples in that short compilation certainly are making it into the talking points of conservatives in comment sections everywhere.

It's always stunning when a republican voter wants to hold up a liberal politician's lies in the era of Trump. Just consider the lies and liars that Trump has inspired since his presidency. Why would any lie told by Biden be a problem for people who have no problem with Trump's extraordinary lies? Could it be bias?

In a side note...What makes a statement a lie?

Yes. No one can ever call out a democrats lies because of "Trump did it worse". They are forever exonerated from any lie.

I'm not sure if you are aware. Media can be bias but still factual.

Roitrn · Feb 24, 2023

Here is a excerpt of filing from FOX lawyers.

Quote

First, Dominion has alleged no actionable defamation by Fox. A series of First

Amendment and New York free-speech doctrines each independently protect media

reporting and commentary on newsworthy allegations of public concern made by

the President and his legal team. It was a newsworthy "fact" that the sitting President

simply made allegations challenging the presidential election. Dominion confuses

the obligation to truthfully report allegations with a purported requirement that the

media rebut their underlying falsity. No such duty exists under the First Amendment

or New York law. The press can safely cover both sides and interview newsmakers

without endorsing everything they say. The freedoms of speech and press would be

illusory if the prevailing party could obtain billions of dollars from the press for

providing the losing side a forum.

It seems to be a question of knowingly distributing false info or reporting allegations made by Trump. FOX characterizes their coverage as reporting on the news worthy allegations of a stolen election.

It may be argued that an anchor does not need to believe something in order to report about it. It is reasonable to assume that every report made by any news anchor must be believed by them personally.

Fox-Reply-Dominion.pdf

toomuchbaloney · Feb 24, 2023

Roitrn said:

Here is a excerpt of filing from FOX lawyers.

It seems to be a question of knowingly distributing false info or reporting allegations made by Trump. FOX characterizes their coverage as reporting on the news worthy allegations of a stolen election.

It may be argued that an anchor does not need to believe something in order to report about it. It is reasonable to assume that every report made by any news anchor must be believed by them personally.

Fox-Reply-Dominion.pdf

What is the point of repeating allegations made by the former president, again and again, when you know the allegations to be false? What is the point of repeating those allegations again and again without providing the audience with the knowledge that the allegations are associated with no known supporting facts?