CMA playing "Nurse Manager?" CMA boundaries? NPD?

[RenaissanceNurse]

**I mean no disrespect to CMAs, and would really appreciate your input.

I recently interviewed at a Peds office I worked at from mid-90s to early-00's. Many changes, but 3-4 providers + 3-4 remaining staff greeted me with big hugs and "great-to-see-you's." It was so heart-warming?especially after a few several (personal & professional) life-changing punches to the throat!

My experience and 2 thumbs up from nearly a third of the staff make me pretty confident I'm a shoo-in. Especially since they've been "urgently hiring," for 2 openings, for a few weeks.

I was so excited at the thought of working with people that I knew wouldn't plunge a knife in my back or mess with my head. BTW: I'm not paranoid, I'm very self aware and honest...a painfully earned "gift" that few people are comfortable with, and definitely don't want to talk about.

Niggles:

"Office Manager"/MHA believes in full transparency, so he mentions some turn-over issues they're working through, then says "so-n-so is a CMA...my right hand...but only makes the schedule...are you OK with that?" I wanted to say "I was until you asked." In hindsight I recognize his attempts to describe a CMA with some great attributes that helps with scheduling/ordering/admin stuff, but it didn't/doesn't make sense. At some point he said something like "she's great, I don't know how I'd do it without her."

A fleeting sense of being gas-lit, almost like being sized up for a fresh target, came and went.

We talked about all kinds of stuff, he would ask my opinion or invite me to share my thoughts...I kept thinking too much, too much...then I remembered reading something about people pumping others for information, not because they care about you or your opinion...they stockpile, and use it as ammunition.

Then he said something about discipline, or maybe current problems they're having. I was mostly paying attention until he said "....me or 'Right Hand'."

THAT got my full attention, as I was getting the distinct impression that "Right Hand" had more of a managerial role, than was being let on.

Or maybe I wasn't "catching on" quick enough, because as I was preparing to leave he texted "Right Hand," so we could meet. Thank goodness she didn't respond, as I likely would have stood there, dumbstruck.

It was so strange to hear a grown man with a Master's Degree, speak so highly of a CMA, referring to her as his "Right Hand," almost as his "professional" equal. Maybe you had to be there...?

I can't judge her, and really not even him, but my lower jaw started tingling as we were saying good-bye. I met a lot of people -- old and new -- when we did the tour, but if they weren't at their desk, we just kept going. We didn't even wait or look around for the Dr who's kids I used to babysit.

Only "Right Hand" -- the CMA that makes the schedule, which he and I had already discussed, in detail -- was summoned, "to meet me."

My "BS radar" -- free, with a painfully earned ArmChair degree in Psychology, specializing in NPD -- suggests they came as a "set" or just happened to make a "perfect match." And has me wondering if all the employee turnover/discord is all due to lazy, complacent CMAs with attendance issues...?

What are a CMA's limits/scope/role? In the real-world, preferably...like what's acceptable vs what's no-way-in-h*ll?

I can't judge any who think I'm off-my-rocker, but hand-to-heart, I'll follow up, whether I'm right or wrong...

But based on everything, I smell a[n] [ove]RAT[ed], manager wannabe...that's very likely a narcissist...with a weird relationship, but I don't suspect sexual, with her boss.

[Closed Account 12345]

Wow, what a nasty description at the end of your post for a woman you don't personally know - a narcissistic rat?

With that said, it is within the scope of a plumber, janitor, retail worker, fast food worker, stay at home mom, preacher, astronaut, and high school drop out to create work schedules for a place of employment. Why would putting a nurse's name in the Monday, 9-5 slot on a schedule require professional licensure?

Why couldn't a CMA perform administrative duties in a clinic? For all you know, she might also have a Masters in Health Admin. Perhaps she has 20 years of clinical and leadership experience. Maybe she has a bachelors degree in human resources and is well equipped to manage staff/administrative problems.

A CMA can't *clinically* manage you, but she sure can administratively manage you.

[RenaissanceNurse]

3 hours ago, LibraSunCNM said:

Well, then I wish you a more drama-free workplace in the future.

I can handle every-day-run-of-the-mill-drama, I've de-escalated many a tense situation over the years, even after the abuse ended and being diagnosed with C-PTSD.

It's the moment my jaw starts to tingle, followed a nano-second later by the realization someone's ****** with my head that I struggle with.

I sense that your intentions are good, and I sincerely appreciate it.

I just think it's important to know the difference between drama and mind-************, because the line seems to be growing thinner and thinner.

[RenaissanceNurse]

4 minutes ago, FacultyRN said:

Wow, what a nasty description at the end of your post for a woman you don't personally know - a narcissistic rat?

With that said, it is within the scope of a plumber, janitor, retail worker, fast food worker, stay at home mom, preacher, astronaut, and high school drop out to create work schedules for a place of employment. Why would putting a nurse's name in the Monday, 9-5 slot on a schedule require professional licensure?

Why couldn't a CMA perform administrative duties in a clinic? For all you know, she might also have a Masters in Health Admin. Perhaps she has 20 years of clinical and leadership experience. Maybe she has a bachelors degree in human resources and is well equipped to manage staff/administrative problems.

A CMA can't *clinically* manage you, but she sure can administratively manage you.

When commenting on my post, please do so using effective communication and active listening, essential skills for any and all in the medical field.

“Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.” – Stephen Covey

[Rose_Queen, BSN, MSN, RN]

20 minutes ago, RenaissanceNurse said:

When commenting on my post, please do so using effective communication and active listening, essential skills for any and all in the medical field.

“Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.” – Stephen Covey

Once you've put it out there for comment, you have no control over the responses, whether you agree with them or not. I hadn't previously read your last line and agree with the poster you quoted- that was a very judgemental opinion of someone you only met for a few minutes.

[bitter_betsy, BSN]

If you are offered the position, I think you should ask for a couple shifts to make a determination. Explain your confusion over who will be administratively and clinically managing you and that you would like to meet them / work with them for a day or two just to make sure that you click. Don't mention "right hand" just that you want to make sure that you are truly welcomed back into the flock and you know what and where your position is. That might not be acceptable for some place you hadn't worked before, but not knowing the circumstances under which you left and how many people are still there and how you may interact with each of them.... I'd want to spend just a little time checking it out. Besides, Right Hand may be really good at what she does and although not a nurse, may actually be a super helpful person.... or not.

Face the situation straight on. Either say no and move on, or run head on into and see where you land. Don't take a passive back seat and hope that everything works out. If you start out quiet and hate it, the situation will never improve.

I wish you much luck and healing.

[KatieMI, BSN, MSN, RN]

I worked for a few years with RMA managing very large and busy private practice. Nobody cared for her medical knowledge, everybody knew she was a multitasker and organizer of the level 80.0100/Goddess Assoluta with a big warm heart and an ocean of common sense.

Also saw a few SNF heads/leads with degrees in "LTC administration" who were honest, hard-working, dedicated and eager to learn, and a few DONs who were doing nursing longer than I am alive and whom I had to report to State as they actively harmed helpless human beings they were supposed to take care for.

If someone knows for real how to do the job, the letters behing the last name can be considered as secondary factor under usual circumstances. RMA cannot prescribe meds or do surgeries, that's correct. But administrative duties and scheduling - even if it is not written somewhere, they can do it, and those of them who do this gloomy and thankless job well deserve our endless gratitude.

[LibraSunCNM, BSN, MSN, CNM]

2 hours ago, RenaissanceNurse said:

I can handle every-day-run-of-the-mill-drama, I've de-escalated many a tense situation over the years, even after the abuse ended and being diagnosed with C-PTSD.

It's the moment my jaw starts to tingle, followed a nano-second later by the realization someone's ****** with my head that I struggle with.

I sense that your intentions are good, and I sincerely appreciate it.

I just think it's important to know the difference between drama and mind-********, because the line seems to be growing thinner and thinner.

And what I'm saying is I saw no evidence in your post of mind ********, just possible red flags for a poor workplace. It sounds like this is much ado about nothing---just walk away.

[Jory, MSN, APRN, CNM]

An OB office we work with has a CMA as their "head clinician". Not even kidding, they have her bossing LPNs around. She has an ego the size of a Mac truck. They have an Uro/GYN that we have to sometimes refer to and more than once, this CMA has dismissed the urgency that some patients need to be seen when we send them over, even failing to pass on important information to the physician if we have to speak with her by phone...even information we have told her is important.

I refuse to deal with her anymore. When I call I ask to speak to either the physician if he is available or the nurse..

[klone, MSN, RN]

4 hours ago, RenaissanceNurse said:

When commenting on my post, please do so using effective communication and active listening, essential skills for any and all in the medical field.

Dude. I don't even know what to say to that. Your OP, and your subsequent posts, do seem like a teapot. Yes, you do sound paranoid.

Also, your attitude, that because manager has an MHA, he can't take advice and rely on a lowly MA to help run the clinic, is quite distasteful.

I think you're being incredibly unfair, and ascribing ulterior, malevolent motives to this MA based on....I'm not really sure what. I find the idea that you've already diagnosed this person with narcissistic personality disorder infuriating.

I agree with the others that you shouldn't take this job, but only because you've already made up your mind on how this is going to play out, and I think it would be unfair to the employees at the clinic, as I could easily see you bringing a level of toxicity to the workplace dynamics.

[klone, MSN, RN]

Quote

Your OP, and your subsequent posts, do seem like a teapot.

That was supposed to say "tempest in a teapot"

[RenaissanceNurse]

8 hours ago, bitter_betsy said:

If you are offered the position, I think you should ask for a couple shifts to make a determination. Explain your confusion over who will be administratively and clinically managing you and that you would like to meet them / work with them for a day or two just to make sure that you click. Don't mention "right hand" just that you want to make sure that you are truly welcomed back into the flock and you know what and where your position is. That might not be acceptable for some place you hadn't worked before, but not knowing the circumstances under which you left and how many people are still there and how you may interact with each of them.... I'd want to spend just a little time checking it out. Besides, Right Hand may be really good at what she does and although not a nurse, may actually be a super helpful person.... or not.

Face the situation straight on. Either say no and move on, or run head on into and see where you land. Don't take a passive back seat and hope that everything works out. If you start out quiet and hate it, the situation will never improve.

I wish you much luck and healing.

Thank you so much, your kind and supportive words were a welcomed comfort ?

[RenaissanceNurse]

7 hours ago, LibraSunCNM said:

And what I'm saying is I saw no evidence in your post of mind ********, just possible red flags for a poor workplace. It sounds like this is much ado about nothing---just walk away.

I guess you have to endure the emotional-mind-raping I have, before you can fully understand what seems so fantastical, but is actually very real and sucks really hard.