We were discussing the Disneryland measles outbreak at work, and I was appalled to find some of my co-workers refuse to vaccinate their kids. They (grudgingly) receive the vaccines they need to remain employed, but doubt their safety/necessity for their kids.
I must say, I am absolutley stunned. How can one be a nurse and deny science?
As a nurse, you should darn well know what the scientific method entails and what phrases such as "evidence based" and "peer reviewed" mean.
I have to say, I have lost most of my respect for the nurses and mistrust their judgement; after all, if they deny science, on what premise are they basing their practices?
If you look at the current vaccine schedule, there's the pneumococcal vaccine, flu vaccine, varicella vaccine, Hepatitis B x 3, Rotovirus... I dont think any of us reading this site right now had these vaccines as a child. I am not anti-vax but I chose not to have my child vaccinated with these because I wasn't vaccinated with these and neither were any of us and we are all fine. The ones I did receive as a child, my child has received.... with the exception of the MMR. The time frame in which the MMR should be given coincides with the developmental time frame when the area of the brain that controls speech is developing, and all three of these viruses effect that area of the brain if you were to become ill with them.... so, what if being vaccinated with 3 neurotoxins all at once at the time when a child's brain is developing causes autism.... why cant these 3 vaccines be given as 3 different shots? The answer is convenience. Merck, the sole manufacturer of the MMR vaccine is being sued for fraudulent reporting of the vaccine's effectiveness. It never was part of mainstream news but here is the Forbes link to the story: Merck Whistleblower Suit A Boon to Vaccine Foes Even As It Stresses Importance of Vaccines - Forbes . If they can lie and change the results of their own studies what else are they capable of lying about? There are many nurses who still dont get a flu shot today because they took care of GB patients who became sick with it after getting their flu shots. I guess they must have poor judgment too.
GBS is mostly acquired after having been infected with campylobacter jejuni, and your chances of getting it from the flu vaccine are less than 1 in a million. You are more likely to get struck by lightening.
I agree that signs of autism often appear around the time children receive their 1st dose of MMR...THIS IS WHY PEOPLE HAVE WRONGLY IMPLICATED MMR AS THE CAUSE OF AUTISM. It's a sad coincidence. Sad because people want a reason for their child to be faced with autism, so they pick MMR as the culprit when it's just a terrible coincidence.
Hep B, strep pneumo, varicella, and Hep B rates in the U.S. have declined DRASTICALLY after the vaccines were introduced to the schedule by the CDC. All of these diseases are potentially fatal for some children and adults; even varicella.
Merck stopped selling the separate antigens of MMR in in 2010, and it was because the separate antigens had MORE side effects. The vaccine is insanely effective: the 2nd dose is only given to capture the 5% of the population that may not respond to the 1st dose. 95% have adequate coverage the 1st time.
Lastly, The antigens in vaccines are NOT neurotoxins.
Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
Are you saying this is a bad thing? Because I see this as only a good thing
Absolutly not! I am at a loss as to how you can even wonder about that.
Some people got the idea that when Bill gates mentioned reducing polulations through vaccines, good health, etc meant that he want to use a deadly vaccine to reduce the population (eye roll). It was clear to me that he meant good vaccininations and health care will eventually reduce the population through the ways I mentioned.
Good point, I think that is the core issue. Fear is frequently irrational, and when it comes to poking needles into your baby's thigh every three months, three and four vacs at a time, it's pretty horrifying, even to me!
I was sitting with my son and DIL looking at the vaccination schedule for their six week old daughter (six months old now) and I was genuinely shocked at the sheer number of vaccinations. I went and grabbed my son's vacc schedule and kids today are getting a lot more (like, I know, this is obvious).
My son and DIL are pro-vac but still we sort of reeled around at ALL those things being shoved into a bitty baby's body. We hovered over her for that first 24 hrs afterward (she was FINE).
So -- irrational fear on our part? Well, yes, but . . . I can understand the reluctance. At the same time, this is the reality. If any whiff of conspiracy theory about Big Pharma enters the picture my ears turn off. Please, people.
I don't think 'shouting down' or condemning anti-vaxxers is going to help them, it will just scare them more. They have REASONS (albeit uninformed, uneducated and irrationally fearful ones) that we still have to 'respect' and work with, for the sake of their children not to mention ours.
Interestingly, it is the 18 year olds that come in eyes a rolling and realize that THEY need a large number of shots in order to be able to go to college. They are not pleased, have not a clue why their fully vaccinated parents would make this choice for them, and cry tears when they not only have to get more than one shot at a time, but come back again next month for the same thing. (and the month after that). More than one kid who had to put off college until the spring semester, as they had not a clue that they needed a series of injections to be able to do this.
Even those who are wanting to go do mission/charitable/volunteer work in other countries...again, lots of delays due to starting from square one immunization wise.
Stand on your soapbox and preach it, but the fact remains that you are a fully vaccinated adult who is likely not autistic, (and there were FAR more stuff in the shots back in the day) and you are now making choices for a child based on your political business as opposed to the right thing to do.
Lastly, The antigens in vaccines are NOT neurotoxins.
Isn't it interesting how some people try to slip a little word like that into conversation, hoping that it will make an impact and the person listening will believe it as fact?
Do we really need formaldehyde and propylene glycol in a vaccine that is injected into an infant (or an adult for that matter)? The vaccination schedule is another issue that needs to be re-examined. How is a newborn at risk for Hepatitis B exposure?
You do realize that not only do our bodies produce waaaaay more formeldahyde on a daily basis than in a vax, but it is a normal and necessary part of the metabolic process?
And in case you name alumminum, you know that there is more in a dose of tums than a vaccine, right?
Please go back and review A&P and micro- it will never steer you wrong
Well said, dinah77.
Let's also address formaldehyde in vaccines:
Not every vaccine contains formaldehyde. In vaccine production, it is used to kill or inactivate the antigens being used. Because of its anti-microbial properties, it cannot be used in any of the "live" vaccines (e.g., MMR, rotavirus, varicella, and some flu vaccines), or else they would be rendered useless. Only inactivated vaccines use formaldehyde during the production process. Once the bacteria or viruses are inactivated, the formaldehyde is diluted out, leaving only minute amounts.
Note that there is no formaldehyde in the MMR shot.
So which vaccines have formaldehyde in them, and how much is present?
HepA - Havrix - 2 doses (12 mos. and 6-18 mos. after first dose) - 100μg/dose
So what's the most a child might get in a single office visit? That would probably be at their 6 month visit (when they are, on average, 16.5lbs or 7.5kg) with HepB, DTaP, IPV and flu, for a total of 307.5μg. That is about 160 times less than the total amount their body naturally produces every single day*. Compare that to the 428.4-1,516.4μg of formaldehyde in a single apple.
I must emphasize that the quotes above do come from a science blog. I used those quotes because they contain verifiable factual information with no medical advice given, nor any digressions into opinions. Mainly I liked it because it is written simply and easily understood. I don't vouch for any other info on this site because I haven't read any of it.
Someone talked earlier about why should unvaccinated by parent's choice children stay home instead of children who are immunocompromised staying home, because they are both at risk for diseases...
The answer is CHOICE. I think that situation is similar to someone who is not disabled who decides to roll around in a wheelchair. I don't think we have to make "reasonable accommodation" at a job for someone in a wheelchair if they are a 30 year old perfectly healthy marathon runner. I feel the same way about the anti-vaxxer crowd. We don't have to cater to people who are perfectly capable of doing something/getting something for themselves. It is not necessary to read a dinner menu to someone who can read on his own, though it would be very nice to do it for a blind person. Just how far are we expected to assist or cater to people who just want to be catered to, who don't need help based on medical necessity?
Anti-vaxxers' kids should absolutely be kept out of public schools, at least. They are creating a potential problem for the rest of kids just because their parents feel like creating a problem. I think that decision should absolutely complicate things a little bit for the parents - it complicates things for the rest of us, especially the immunocompromised kids. The parents can homeschool if they are so desperate not to vaccinate their kids. Most of the kids I know who are homeschooled get better education and are overall more knowledgeable than the kids who attend public school anyway, so they'd probably be doing their kids a favor taking them out of the public school system.
This other site, which is part of a soil biology class taught by a United States university, states: "A teaspoon of productive soil generally contains between 100 million and 1 billion bacteria." (Bacteria- Scoop on Soil)
All of the anti-vaxxers talking about too much exposure too fast with 69 vaccines before age 18 really ought to think about what could happen if their child eats a teaspoon of soil. Possible exposure to 1 billion bacteria at once sounds like a heck of a lot more than whatever's contained in all 69 doses of childhood vaccines. That logic makes absolutely NO sense.
I just spent an hour reading through the vaccination threads on this forum . . . . . addicting!
I was happy to finally see someone post the evidence that there is no real reason to fear the vaccine schedule and that the myths about ingredients in vaccines are being de-bunked.
I like seeing the "meme's" and links to "youtube" as well . . . .a bit of humor helps.
I follow a FB group called "Refutations to Anti-Vaccine Meme's" that is excellent and funny as well.
mariebailey, MSN, RN
948 Posts
GBS is mostly acquired after having been infected with campylobacter jejuni, and your chances of getting it from the flu vaccine are less than 1 in a million. You are more likely to get struck by lightening.
I agree that signs of autism often appear around the time children receive their 1st dose of MMR...THIS IS WHY PEOPLE HAVE WRONGLY IMPLICATED MMR AS THE CAUSE OF AUTISM. It's a sad coincidence. Sad because people want a reason for their child to be faced with autism, so they pick MMR as the culprit when it's just a terrible coincidence.
Hep B, strep pneumo, varicella, and Hep B rates in the U.S. have declined DRASTICALLY after the vaccines were introduced to the schedule by the CDC. All of these diseases are potentially fatal for some children and adults; even varicella.
Merck stopped selling the separate antigens of MMR in in 2010, and it was because the separate antigens had MORE side effects. The vaccine is insanely effective: the 2nd dose is only given to capture the 5% of the population that may not respond to the 1st dose. 95% have adequate coverage the 1st time.
Lastly, The antigens in vaccines are NOT neurotoxins.