ADN Nurses Being Forced to go Back to School?

Nurses General Nursing

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New Rules Send Upstate Nurses (in S.C.) Back to School

Hospitals across the country are now mandating that nurses with associate degrees obtain a Bachelor of Science degree.The change went into effect July 1 for nursing staff at Greenville Health System. The organization anticipates 300 nurses will be required to sign a Memorandum of Understanding stating that they will return to school for a BSN degree within four years.

The change in education requirements for nursing staff is based on a recommendation from the Institute of Medicine. The non-profit advisory group wants 80 percent of all nurses to have a four-year degree by 2020.

"We hope for the patient, it will provide enhanced care," according to Judith Thompson, CEO of the South Carolina Nurses Association.

One rationale behind this is that since the role of the nurse in the hospital is changing and becoming more complex, more education is needed to keep up.

What do you think about making nurses with years of experience under their belts to go back to school or risk their jobs?

Yes, so let's have people get a *4 year* degree for $60,000 minimum to make $28,000 per year. I'm surprised someone of your intelligence doesn't see what a ridiculous allocation of economic resources that is.

Not all BA or BS costs remotely that much. And at least around here, admins earn more than $28k. But to do take your point. However, some money per year is more than no money per year. :)

I also wondered how exactly a physician would know what credentials a nurse has. Crazy

Back when Florence and I worked the Crimea, we all wore our school pins, and I knew quite a few MDs who took notice of them. And I have often told the story of the Hallowe'en I wore my (east coast university) nursing school cap to work in (west coast university hospital) and heard one of the residents bellow down the hall, "Hey (ECU)!" I looked around and said out loud, "Who the heck out here recognizes an (ECU) cap?" And there were two fellow who had been to med school in that city and done residencies in some of the same hospitals I did clinicals in, and they said, "We do!"

When so many of our medical brothers and sisters have spent so much time in academia, it's not too surprising that at least some of them recognize and value our time doing the same. I know that my CV gets me jobs more automatically than my colleagues with diplomas and ADN/ASNs. No, it's not universal, and maybe it's not fair sometimes; no rule is. But ignoring it is foolish. Whoever said it's the way things are going and you'd be foolish to ignore it was completely correct.

Specializes in L & D; Postpartum.
Not all BA or BS costs remotely that much. And at least around here, admins earn more than $28k. But to do take your point. However, some money per year is more than no money per year. :)

Once all nurses have BSN's, they will be doing bedside nursing for the most part because you can't have all of them going into administration. And most likely, they aren't going to be making the hourly salary that is much more than what any entry level nurse is making today. The dollars in health care are just not there.

I think it more on the lines of trying to weed out the really experienced nurses who don't want to, or simply don't have the work years left to pay for a degree, and thus hospitals will be able to hire nurses in at the lowest wages on their scale.

Specializes in Peds/outpatient FP,derm,allergy/private duty.

I've always associated the distinctive caps from diploma schools. Seems like more and more often the university students shun such things, even the pins. My first instructor was built like a quarterback and wore one of those frilly doily caps. She was my ultimate "crusty old bat". Wish I had a chance to thank her now, but that's for another thread!

They should devise a second NCLEX for BSN nurses so there is something measurable to talk about and to use for leverage to justify increased pay, or the states should get together and push for a change in the law. Otherwise when a shortage returns we'll be starting this argument all over again.

Vivalavespagirl - in the context of nursing I would say that rather than empowering, the 50-year long argument over BSN entry-to-practice has actually sapped away our power, and oddly enough a writer in an ANA journal agrees. This is not to be confused with education itself. There are many ways to become educated. Apologies to those who have seen this link already, but it really explains comprehensively the history of the campaign and explores the legislative and public relations background.

A Policy Perspective on the Entry into Practice Issue - Online Journal of Issues in Nursing

Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.
I've always associated the distinctive caps from diploma schools. Seems like more and more often the university students shun such things, even the pins. My first instructor was built like a quarterback and wore one of those frilly doily caps. She was my ultimate "crusty old bat". Wish I had a chance to thank her now, but that's for another thread!

They should devise a second NCLEX for BSN nurses so there is something measurable to talk about and to use for leverage to justify increased pay, or the states should get together and push for a change in the law. Otherwise when a shortage returns we'll be starting this argument all over again.

Vivalavespagirl - in the context of nursing I would say that rather than empowering, the 50-year long argument over BSN entry-to-practice has actually sapped away our power, and oddly enough a writer in an ANA journal agrees. This is not to be confused with education itself. There are many ways to become educated. Apologies to those who have seen this link already, but it really explains comprehensively the history of the campaign and explores the legislative and public relations background.

A Policy Perspective on the Entry into Practice Issue - Online Journal of Issues in Nursing

Two point of entry RN exams...No...that will solve nothing. Just make it FINALLY BSN entry, grandfather those with >10 years in and get rid of Diploma/ADN programs once and be done with it already.
Two point of entry RN exams...No...that will solve nothing. Just make it FINALLY BSN entry, grandfather those with >10 years in and get rid of Diploma/ADN programs once and be done with it already.

Greater than 10 years in?! And let all the working nurses 0-9years and 11months be out of a job?

I think you just grandfather everyone in who is currently an RN and say it will change to a BSN only profession beginning in 2020.....or whatever year. Seems more fair to me.

Specializes in Peds/outpatient FP,derm,allergy/private duty.
Two point of entry RN exams...No...that will solve nothing. Just make it FINALLY BSN entry, grandfather those with >10 years in and get rid of Diploma/ADN programs once and be done with it already.

I do agree, Esme! It was just another speculative idea to finally end the bickering. If they don't change the law, the only other solution I can see is a concerted effort to transition current ADN programs into BSN programs.

Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.
Greater than 10 years in?! And let all the working nurses 0-9years and 11months be out of a job?

I think you just grandfather everyone in who is currently an RN and say it will change to a BSN only profession beginning in 2020.....or whatever year. Seems more fair to me.

They'll never agree to that. I think that should be done but the mucky mucks won't do it. I have heard this argument for 35 years. When it started it as ALL ABOUT grandfathering everyone in that was already licensed...it was presented that way to get everyone "on board". They even said ALL diploma programs in the US would close...they haven't.

I used 10 years as an arbitrary figure to start asking for those nurses to return to school as many have a long career ahead of them.

Don't get me wrong I am all for grandfathering all nursing grads until a certain date and make BSN entry. The problem is....what would happen to all those who are employed by ADN programs? You can't "just close" programs...it's a mess.

Frankly I am not happy with this push. I think it is wrong to "approve" ALL of these schools especially since 2008...allow these programs to price gouge all these poor people then make a mandate that they can't be hired. It's disgusting. If the BON felt that strongly about BSN entry and BSN by 2020 they would NOT approve any new ADN programs.

To me this is just a way to get rid of seasoned nurses.

Sad really.

This subject hits close to home. I am middle aged and settled in my life and family duties and all that. Thought I was done with school. Have a previous Bachelor's in a non-nursing degree and have an ADN. I start my RN to BSN program soon. Eighteen months of giving up family time to complete some mostly useless classes on things that are outside of my area of practice. Writing papers when I would much more enjoy learning new hands-on nursing skills instead. I have no desire to be in management so why do I need to get more book education?

The best part is that my hospital also has asked me recently to take some national certification classes. When am I going to have time for that?!

But it is what it is. There are some changes in my department and many nurses have found other jobs. I don't have a great chance at finding a new job without the BSN, so here I go.

Specializes in MICU, SICU, CICU.
Two point of entry RN exams...No...that will solve nothing. Just make it FINALLY BSN entry, grandfather those with >10 years in and get rid of Diploma/ADN programs once and be done with it already.

Many years ago, in a nursing leadership class a Nursing professor explained to us the function of the State Board of Nursing.

She said something that has stuck with me all of these years:

Your nursing license is a property right.

​Under tort law it can not be taken from you without due process.

AA and AS degree licensed and registered nurses are safe from having their licenses not grandfathered in ( in my state) because they don't posess certain years of experience.

Specializes in OR, Nursing Professional Development.
Many years ago, in a nursing leadership class a Nursing professor explained to us the function of the State Board of Nursing.

She said something that has stuck with me all of these years:

Your nursing license is a property right.

​Under tort law it can not be taken from you without due process.

AA and AS degree licensed and registered nurses are safe from having their licenses not grandfathered in ( in my state) because they don't posess certain years of experience.

But that does not prevent an employer from deciding that a nurse without a BSN no longer meets the criteria for continued employment.

I'm all for making the BSN the single entry point for a nursing license. However, those who are already licensed when that happens should be grandfathered in- as far as a license status. What an individual facility does is up to that facility, but they may end up shooting themselves in the foot.

Specializes in MICU, SICU, CICU.

Community colleges are the only affordable option for many people.

If History of Western Civ 1 and II, American history I and II, 2 semesters of language, Biochem, some electives, statistics, nursing research and Community Health courses were added to the required AS in nursing pre-requesites and credits, it would equal 120 credits which equals a baccalaureate in Nursing.

I think this is the most sensible option and it would be very appealing to those who have a bachelors degree in another field.

I feel that since I have never had any kind of education in information technology i am a big disadvantage when learning a new program. This kind of education is going to be essential in years to come. not that i want to go back to school for it : )

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