Why do so many people insist that LPN'S AREN'T REAL NURSES!!??

Dalzac, LPN, LVN, RN · Sep 13, 2006

I just retired after 33 yrs as a LPN and I have lstened the same thing. Usually it is the grad that comes into the setting with this attitutued. It used to bother me but I watched many a RN choke on what they had said to me. esp in a dire situation. All f my experience is ICU,CCU,ER, and even a little research nursing. One of the funniest things was while I was going to school was an RN that came in for the day to teach arrythmias was a nurse I taught them to (I was a Monitor Tech for a very large Hospital) and she told the instuctors that I taught her and I got excused for the day. I took my kids to the Zoo and had a great time and aced the test the next day.

RNsRWe, ASN, RN · Sep 13, 2006

And then there was the time, just weeks from graduating from my RN program after the better part of four years of classes and clinicals, when one patient's wife asked me if I was planning to "go on to get my LPN after graduation". Sigh. I had introduced myself as a student nurse, and met her as I was tidying up the bedside stuff while her hubby was in the john, so perhaps I didn't look....um....scholarly enough for her!

I grinned and gave her the ten second comparison of the programs, and assured her that I was already about to become "a real nurse" (she used the term, not me)!

Maybe she thought more letters equalled a higher education. Got me! Sometimes you've gotta see the humor in some of it, right? :)

nursejoelle · Sep 13, 2006

While I have worked with many fine LPNs, and as I have stated in many other threads, I think that the time of LPNs/LVNs has come and gone. That is why so many hospitals across the country are phasing them out.
Do you realize that you have less education than Physical Therapy Assistants? Whose claim to fame is walking patients around the unit, or exercising their legs and arms? What is wrong with this picture? Their educational entry into practice is a associates degree, while LPNs and LVNs have only a 9 month program. That is probably where their credibility with the public gets questioned. and probably why many RNs, including me, don't want to be responsible for their patient load, as well as my own. JMHO.
Lindarn, RN, BSN, CCRN
Spokane, Washington

Interesting...and thanks for your input. I'll rely on credible information instead of opinions in this case. I've provided you with a reference from the National Council of State Boards of Nursing: http://www.ncsbn.org/news/stateupdates_state_shortage.asp

As you can see LPNs are quite in demand and probably will be for the forseeable future. JMHO.:wink2: One more thing...as far as I know...most all nurses wear their heart on their sleeve, not their credentials. Just something to think about.

Tweety, BSN, RN · Sep 14, 2006

From the many post i've read it seems that the LPN's are thought of just like nursing assistants.Since they are not RN's people don't see them as real nurses.

Really, I don't see many posts like that at all here. Perhaps a few, but I've never noticed. Anyway, don't judge the real world by a message board. :)

FroggysMom · Sep 14, 2006

I mean, the title does have "Nurse" in it.So why are so many people insisting that LPN's arent real nurses? When I go to the hospital, I see these people giving medication , care, comfort and other services to their patients, isn't that what nursing is all about? What do you think about this issue? Do you think LPN's aren't real nurses?

I think in some cases it is an attitude promoted by administration (hospital primarily). We are about to undergo a change in "definition" and probably uniform as well in the near future.

I'm not so sure what this is going to accomplish except to take nurses who have practiced the 3-C's for many years (caring, compassion, competence) and make them feel like second class citizens. It will also put an undue burden on the staff RNs who we work with every day; after all, someone is going to have to pick up the slack when the LPNS are suddenly deemed unable to do what they have done for years. I suppose a conspiracy theorist might say that it is the first step toward an all RN staff - the RNs will be feeling overworked (and rightly so) due to the extra duties they will have to assume...therefore hiring all RNs in place of LPNs takes on the perfect argument.

I might be "demoted" or even laid off if I don't get through school in time for the axes start to fall. I love what I do - I look forward to each day - but I'm not so sure I want to fight so hard any more just to do what I love to do. I don't want to see the look on the RNs faces when I tell them that a patient needs something that I used to be able to competently provide, but cannot any more.

The RNs on the floor all say how badly they feel about the coming changes. They say they feel terrible about it. But they say it to us, not to administration, although I doubt admin will listen much anyway. I wish we could just all quit looking only at degrees and look at the person doing the job.

KellieNurse06 · Sep 14, 2006

While I have worked with many fine LPNs, and as I have stated in many other threads, I think that the time of LPNs/LVNs has come and gone. That is why so many hospitals across the country are phasing them out.
Do you realize that you have less education than Physical Therapy Assistants? Whose claim to fame is walking patients around the unit, or exercising their legs and arms? What is wrong with this picture? Their educational entry into practice is a associates degree, while LPNs and LVNs have only a 9 month program. That is probably where their credibility with the public gets questioned. and probably why many RNs, including me, don't want to be responsible for their patient load, as well as my own. JMHO.
Lindarn, RN, BSN, CCRN
Spokane, Washington

Whatever...........I have a friend who is an LPN ( for 30 yrs) and I can tell you.....she can run circles around any RN, BSN, or even MSN nurse............she has more brains & common sense & critical thinking than any nurse I have ever seen...........plus she has taught me tons of stuff that have helped me as I prepare to become a nurse ...................so an LPN is as equal to me as any level nurse be it RN BSN or MSN.

I can't stand people who look down their nose at others :nono: ................life is too short.

p.s. There are tons of hospitals around hiring LPN's.........that phasing out story is a rumor and has been for years.

If it were true......there would be no more LPN schools............PLUS there are many other places to work BESIDES a hospital.........

jharris71RN · Sep 14, 2006

I don't understand why it feels like LPN's have to defend their decision to be "just an LPN". I enjoy being an LPN, and I'm not sure that I will go back. It doesn't mean I don't have teh skills or brains to be an RN, I just choose not to go back at this point in my life. To me, an LPN is still a nurse, still has skills, and an LPN with 20+ years experience is going to be able to teach you a heck of a lot. It's not about the title, it's about how you care for people, whether you're a CNA, LPN, RN or higher.

Right on!!! I was a LPN for just 2 months short of 15 years when I graduated RN School. I wanted to have more options otherwise I was pleased and proud to be a LPN. A Wise ADON and friend of mine said something that I agreed with and always will " I hate to hear any nurse say ' I am only (just) a LPN" In this day and age regardless of shortages etc. LPN's are just as important and are soon as knowlegeable as many RN's. I know there a scope of practice differences that I understand a little more now but I would never consider anyone Just a LPN or Just a CNA.... its all one department, the largest and the most versital group of employees a business could ever have.

caroladybelle, BSN, RN · Sep 15, 2006

While I have worked with many fine LPNs, and as I have stated in many other threads, I think that the time of LPNs/LVNs has come and gone. That is why so many hospitals across the country are phasing them out.
Do you realize that you have less education than Physical Therapy Assistants? Whose claim to fame is walking patients around the unit, or exercising their legs and arms?

Please do not denigrate another health care profession, in an attempt to elevate nurses. Physical therapy has its own challenges, and the PTA programs teach a lot more that "walking patients around the unit or exercising".

Saying that PTAs just walk people is like saying that nurses just hand out pills willy nilly,per the MD orders.

MedSurgeMess · Sep 15, 2006

I have encounted this constantly since moving to Michigan a few months ago. In Virginia Bch, I was an Urgent Care nurse and I was a respeceted professional...in Michigan, no one is interested in hiring an LPN except a Nursing Home, and maybe a few hospitals that aren't in my area or that I have not come upon yet.

All states have differences regarding the scope of practice, so this may be part of the answer. Also, some facilities, depending on how many RNs are practicing in the area, may have the ability to hire more RNs and no (or less) LPNs. Also, due to scope, some facilities don't want to take the time and effort to write policies to help cover RN/LPN situations/scope. I work at a facility that has probably as many LPNs as RNs (almost no CNAs ) and we get along fine....The Magnet facility in the next town has no LPNs and all RN and CNAs. Who gets better care? I think we give better care because our LPNs have many years experience, can do anything a RN can do except assessments, and we work as a TEAM. I just wish we could get our CNAs back, they are a vital part of the equation also. Just my :twocents:

Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN · Sep 15, 2006

Please do not denigrate another health care profession, in an attempt to elevate nurses. Physical therapy has its own challenges, and the PTA programs teach a lot more that "walking patients around the unit or exercising".
Saying that PTAs just walk people is like saying that nurses just hand out pills willy nilly,per the MD orders.

:yeahthat:

RN34TX · Sep 15, 2006

I have encounted this constantly since moving to Michigan a few months ago. In Virginia Bch, I was an Urgent Care nurse and I was a respeceted professional...in Michigan, no one is interested in hiring an LPN except a Nursing Home, and maybe a few hospitals that aren't in my area or that I have not come upon yet. /quote]
I think that mentality is specific to the nursing culture of that region.
Not to say that other areas don't have the same things going on, but my experience working in Minnesota as an LPN, and talking to other LPN's who worked in Wisconsin, Illinois, Michigan, etc. it seems that I share a lot of the same experiences as other LPN's who worked in the midwest.
I wasn't allowed to flush a central line or even change a central line dressing in MN as an LPN.
If someone brought up the idea of expanding a MN LPN's practice, the next comments seemed to frequently involve a scenario where LPN's were allowed to give IV push meds and ended up killing patients. There was also speculation that the hospitals would then only employ LPN's and have just one RN to charge the floors.
This of course was the common rhetoric of MNA ( union who represent MN RN's) who seemed determined to keep MN RN's paranoid that LPN's will take their jobs away if their scope of practice gets expanded.
Low and behold in states like Texas, LVN's give IV push meds and a laundry list of other nursing skills/tasks that are forbidden in many midwestern states, and guess what?
Not only are TX LVN's not killing patients as a result, they also are not taking RN jobs away as was so passionately predicted at MNA meetings.
Good luck to you in Michigan. After my LPN experience in MN, I really don't know how any LPN's in that region can stand working there. Way too stifling with very limited opportunities.

kristen3g3tp8 · Sep 15, 2006

The more education you have... the further you are from the patient :uhoh21: